I have a player that is desperate for an armor mod that improves agility, akin to the mod that bumps up brawn.
In searching the mods out there, I have not found one (nor has the player). My question on this is whether it's a good idea to let him have such a mod? What's the prevailing wisdom on that? Game breaking / don't do it? Or only for certain skill checks? Or why not?
Thanks
There is not one, and you're probably better off without it. Agility is one of the most potent characteristics and high Agility makes the character extremely effective in combat.
It wouldn't be game-breaking, but your game is probably better off without it.
There are cybernetics that increase Agility.
18 hours ago, Jindy said:In searching the mods out there, I have not found one (nor has the player). My question on this is whether it's a good idea to let him have such a mod? What's the prevailing wisdom on that? Game breaking / don't do it? Or only for certain skill checks? Or why not?
An extra ability die in this game is a big deal, so be wary of throwing it around. It's why Dedication takes so long to get and why high skill ranks cost so much XP. If you have access to some of the sourcebooks, there are armours that have built-in benefits, but they are usually along the lines of "reduce setback from Perception caused by darkness" or the like. IOW, very specific situations, and they still cost a bundle to get, or are basically illegal for "civilians".
If your player is desperate to improve their PC's Agility it begs other questions like: What is their Agility now? 4 is usually plenty, 5 borders on overkill. Does the player really want to re-invent their PC? Perhaps their current PC deserves some kind of epic end, so they can bring a new one on board.
Or they can spend XP to buy into another Specialization and beeline to Dedication...
Here’s another thing to consider. Powered armors can increase strength because servos take up the additional load that the muscles can’t handle on their own. Agility is a completely different matter all together. Agility is about innate coordination and reaction time. Armor has a nasty habit of inhibiting both of these. It cannot boost them.
7 hours ago, Tramp Graphics said:Here’s another thing to consider. Powered armors can increase strength because servos take up the additional load that the muscles can’t handle on their own. Agility is a completely different matter all together. Agility is about innate coordination and reaction time. Armor has a nasty habit of inhibiting both of these. It cannot boost them.
While I am inclined to agree given that cybernetic arms/legs (of the right type) increase Agility it wouldn't seem totally unreasonable that there could be armor designed to increase the wearer's agility through augmentation.
33 minutes ago, RickInVA said:While I am inclined to agree given that cybernetic arms/legs (of the right type) increase Agility it wouldn't seem totally unreasonable that there could be armor designed to increase the wearer's agility through augmentation.
Cybernetics are hardwired into the nervous system and replace the existing skeletal-muscular system of those limbs. Armor, even powered armor, is limited to what the existing body is capable of.
I would permit an armor mod that specifically improves Coordination , which seems reasonable and possible- without increasing weapons or piloting prowess.
25 minutes ago, Edgehawk said:I would permit an armor mod that specifically improves Coordination , which seems reasonable and possible- without increasing weapons or piloting prowess.
There is one from RotS that does this: The Physiological Support System basically gives a rank of Resolve and gives a Boost to Coordination, Athletics, and Resilience, with mod options for a skill rank in each.
2 HP, 3,000 for Clones, 10,000 for others.
20 hours ago, Tramp Graphics said:Cybernetics are hardwired into the nervous system and replace the existing skeletal-muscular system of those limbs. Armor, even powered armor, is limited to what the existing body is capable of.
Ah, but what says that the theoretical armor couldn't "jack" into the wearers nervous system and augment agility? If paralyzed people can walk with the aid of modern mechanical augmentation (which they can) I have no problem with imagining agility enhancing armor in a technologically advanced society. And to presuppose the response that Star Wars is not so terribly advanced, I reply that the cybernetics available in game a clearly vastly beyond current real world capability.
While I do not disagree with the premise that some things are "impossible", history has shown that they are only impossible until someone figures out how to do it.
Star Wars tech has figured out a way to install a computer in a ship that can calculate a faster than light path between any two points in a minute or two. Given the millions of inhabited planets, and the fact that our Milky Way rotates at about 500,000 miles per hour, while at the same time moving through space at 1.3 million miles per hour, along with the individual orbits of all the planets in all the systems, etc., I hesitate to put anything into the "impossible" category. I'm much happier with the "Not yet invented" category.
7 hours ago, RickInVA said:Ah, but what says that the theoretical armor couldn't "jack" into the wearers nervous system and augment agility? If paralyzed people can walk with the aid of modern mechanical augmentation (which they can) I have no problem with imagining agility enhancing armor in a technologically advanced society. And to presuppose the response that Star Wars is not so terribly advanced, I reply that the cybernetics available in game a clearly vastly beyond current real world capability.
While I do not disagree with the premise that some things are "impossible", history has shown that they are only impossible until someone figures out how to do it.
Star Wars tech has figured out a way to install a computer in a ship that can calculate a faster than light path between any two points in a minute or two. Given the millions of inhabited planets, and the fact that our Milky Way rotates at about 500,000 miles per hour, while at the same time moving through space at 1.3 million miles per hour, along with the individual orbits of all the planets in all the systems, etc., I hesitate to put anything into the "impossible" category. I'm much happier with the "Not yet invented" category.
You still have the limitations of the underlying limbs. The “armor” would essentially be forcing them to move faster than they’re capable of and that would invariably result in serious injuries to the muscles, bones, and joints. Cybernetic prosthetics don’t have that problem because they completely replace the limb or limbs involved.
15 hours ago, Tramp Graphics said:You still have the limitations of the underlying limbs. The “armor” would essentially be forcing them to move faster than they’re capable of and that would invariably result in serious injuries to the muscles, bones, and joints. Cybernetic prosthetics don’t have that problem because they completely replace the limb or limbs involved.
An excellent point! Perhaps the theoretical armor has a significant drawback, it causes the wearer to take Strain to use it.
Another possibility...Agility is, certainly, the ability to move well, to move appropriately for the need. That motor control is certainly difficult to augment. How about twitch control? If jacked into the nervous system the armor might be able to help the wearer react and act quicker due to reducing the time between thought and action. Would that be a component of Agility significant enough to provide a bonus?
P.S. I hope you are taking this exchange in the manner it is being provided, which is not at all confrontational nor disagreement, but, hopefully, an enjoyable back and forth of "Ah, but have you considered...".
If it's jacked into the nervous system, it sounds more like a permanent exoskeleton cybernetic rather than an armor you can easily take on and off.
52 minutes ago, RickInVA said:An excellent point! Perhaps the theoretical armor has a significant drawback, it causes the wearer to take Strain to use it.
Another possibility...Agility is, certainly, the ability to move well, to move appropriately for the need. That motor control is certainly difficult to augment. How about twitch control? If jacked into the nervous system the armor might be able to help the wearer react and act quicker due to reducing the time between thought and action. Would that be a component of Agility significant enough to provide a bonus?
P.S. I hope you are taking this exchange in the manner it is being provided, which is not at all confrontational nor disagreement, but, hopefully, an enjoyable back and forth of "Ah, but have you considered...".
34 minutes ago, P-47 Thunderbolt said:If it's jacked into the nervous system, it sounds more like a permanent exoskeleton cybernetic rather than an armor you can easily take on and off.
Exactly, and even then, it’s not enough. Basically, you’d need to re-wire the nervous system almost completely. Check out the game Cyberpunk 2020. It actually has Reflex boosting Cybernetics. Read what they actually entail, how they operate, and what’s required to make them work. Armor simply cannot accomplish that.
11 hours ago, RickInVA said:How about twitch control? If jacked into the nervous system the armor might be able to help the wearer react and act quicker due to reducing the time between thought and action. Would that be a component of Agility significant enough to provide a bonus?
Reaction/Initiative is not related to the Agility skill in this game, by design. The Cresh “Luck” Armor in Keeping the Peace provides an automatic Advantage to Vigilance checks, but relies on external sensors, not cybernetics.
Cybernetic arms and legs could provide a boost to Agility, but it would be a drastic measure. Perhaps you might permit cybernetic enhancements to accomplish this, as opposed to outright limb replacement?