How would you built the Jade Champion Title?

Jade Magistrate title?

Jade Yoriki?

I think a standard yoriki title would be fine, and I'm not sure about a 'champion' title - that's too huge a thing to compare to any example we have. As to magistrates...

The 4th edition version:

Quote

The Jade Champion combats criminals who abuse the arcane, and his magistrates enforce his will. The Jade Magistrates are trained to recognize these crimes and quickly dispense justice. These warriors mainly hunt maho-tsukai and Bloodspeakers, all those who perform profane magic within the Empire’s borders.

The Jade Champion combats criminals who abuse the arcane, and his magistrates enforce his will. The Jade Magistrates are trained to recognize these crimes and quickly dispense justice. These warriors mainly hunt maho-tsukai and Bloodspeakers, all those who perform profane magic within the Empire’s borders.

• Replaces: Any Bushi, Courtier, or Shugenja School, Rank 4
• Requirements: Lore: Law 3, Spellcraft 3, must receive an appointment as Jade Magistrate before this Path can be entered
• Special: Members of the Imperial families may ignore one Skill Rank requirement
• Technique: Scent of the Kami - A servant of the Jade Champion is a master at deciphering the mysteries of the kami. You may make a Perception / Spellcraft Skill Roll to identify any spells cast in an area during the past forty-eight hours. The TN for this roll is equal to the basic TN to cast the spell in question (which is to say its Mastery Level x 5, plus 5).

For a 5th edition equivalent, I'd suggest the following:

• Doesn't need to be a shujenga-tagged school (a Kaito, for example), but must know at least one invocation.
• Status increase as per Emerald magistrate.
• Theology, Skulduggery, Rituals and Invocations on the curriculum (preferential access to jade strike and tomb of jade)
• Title ability giving the ability to sense invocations and Maho (I believe there's already a school ability which does this? Can't recall which one, though)
• There was also an ability which was pretty much universally associated with them called Path of Jade, which let any family take techniques which are normally Phoenix- or Kuni- exclusive. As yet, there is nothing for them to apply to, but worth keeping in mind.

The Asako Inquisitor has a school ability like that, Magnus. And technically there's Lord Shiba's Valor for the Phoenix-only tech.

30 minutes ago, Magnus Grendel said:

I think a standard yoriki title would be fine, and I'm not sure about a 'champion' title - that's too huge a thing to compare to any example we have. As to magistrates...

The 4th edition version:

Well we do have Emerald Magistrates to compare Jade Magistrates to.

11 hours ago, Daeglan said:

Well we do have Emerald Magistrates to compare Jade Magistrates to.

Yes, but we don't have a title for the Emerald Champion (and I'm not sure we're likely to).

17 hours ago, Magnus Grendel said:

Yes, but we don't have a title for the Emerald Champion (and I'm not sure we're likely to).

You seem to be hung up on the Jade Champion and ignoring the Jade Magistrate part of my question.

Scholar skill group
Command
Fitness
Cleansing Spirit
Rouse the Soul
Jade Strike (with errata to make it affect Tainted instead of or in addition to otherworldly beings)

Honestly, I have no idea for the title ability.

That does seem like a good start though!

I'd add a status increase like with the Emerald Magistrate and a requirement to not be tainted (duh).

As a title ability, perhaps something like a cross between witch hunter and the inquisitor's school ability?

4 hours ago, Diogo Salazar said:

Scholar skill group
Command
Fitness
Cleansing Spirit
Rouse the Soul
Jade Strike (with errata to make it affect Tainted instead of or in addition to otherworldly beings)

Honestly, I have no idea for the title ability.

How about, "Your invocations that target/affect Otherworldly Creatures also target/affect Tainted Creatures or those with 1 (2?) or more Tainted disadvantages."?

That's the same thing in this edition - Tainted means having one or more of those disadvantages.

I like the idea, though I haven't thought it entirely through yet.

4 hours ago, Tonbo Karasu said:

How about, "Your invocations that target/affect Otherworldly Creatures also target/affect Tainted Creatures or those with 1 (2?) or more Tainted disadvantages."?

The only problem then, is that somehow the Phoenix screwed up the Crab so bad by getting rid of the Jade Champion/Magistrates that only the Jade Strike from the Elemental Master of Earth seems to be able to hit Tainted beings... 🙄

2 hours ago, Diogo Salazar said:

The only problem then, is that somehow the Phoenix screwed up the Crab so bad by getting rid of the Jade Champion/Magistrates that only the Jade Strike from the Elemental Master of Earth seems to be able to hit Tainted beings... 🙄

Well since the Pheonix feel they are the best to deal with Spiritual problems in the empire it would be par for the course wouldnt it?

4 minutes ago, Daeglan said:

Well since the Pheonix feel they are the best to deal with Spiritual problems in the empire it would be par for the course wouldnt it?

[sarcasm mode = on]

Except the Phoenix are the Clan furthest from the Wall, and apparently only ONE of them can actually harm Tainted creatures with Jade Strike.

[sarcasm mode = off]

Everyone knows everyone in Rokugon is bad at their job.....

I would disagree on that, for what their job is supposed to be, I would say the Crab and the Scorpion really do their assigned job to their best of their conditions. Specially the Crab.

My sarcasm mode and comments, which at this point I think you haven't noticed is due to the fact that the rules and the lore contradict themselves regarding to Jade Strike. In the rules, Jade Strike only affects Otherwordly beings (even though has a side bar mentioning about targeting non-Tainted beings and failing) and in Beneath the Light of Jade it is shown that Isawa Tadaka actually hurt Kuni Yori with a Jade Strike. So, that means that Kuni Yori is an Otherwordly being, or the rules are wrong and we should have received an errata by now, or (most likely) the Robert Denton III wrote like this because Jade Strike worked on Tainted beings since 1st edition and forgot to check the mechanics and whoever was supposed to review it, forgot it either. The sad funny implication of all this, of course is, that somehow being the Elemental Master of Earth makes you the only Shugenja able to target Tainted creatures with Jade Strike.

16 minutes ago, Diogo Salazar said:

I would disagree on that, for what their job is supposed to be, I would say the Crab and the Scorpion really do their assigned job to their best of their conditions. Specially the Crab.

My sarcasm mode and comments, which at this point I think you haven't noticed is due to the fact that the rules and the lore contradict themselves regarding to Jade Strike. In the rules, Jade Strike only affects Otherwordly beings (even though has a side bar mentioning about targeting non-Tainted beings and failing) and in Beneath the Light of Jade it is shown that Isawa Tadaka actually hurt Kuni Yori with a Jade Strike. So, that means that Kuni Yori is an Otherwordly being, or the rules are wrong and we should have received an errata by now, or (most likely) the Robert Denton III wrote like this because Jade Strike worked on Tainted beings since 1st edition and forgot to check the mechanics and whoever was supposed to review it, forgot it either. The sad funny implication of all this, of course is, that somehow being the Elemental Master of Earth makes you the only Shugenja able to target Tainted creatures with Jade Strike.

oh... that is weird...

I kind of dont blame Robert. I think it is an error in the Jade strike write up. Has anyone asked the Devs?

2 hours ago, Daeglan said:

I kind of dont blame Robert. I think it is an error in the Jade strike write up. Has anyone asked the Devs?

I don’t blame him either, like I said, whoever was responsible to revise the short story forgot about that too. This, plus the sidebar text in the book makes me believe that they actually forgot to add the Tainted keyword or Otherworldly should have been replaced by Tainted. Correct me if I’m wrong, but kenkus are Otherworldly creatures now, right? And definitely were the Kami, so I don’t see how they are supposed to br hit by Jade Strike.

53 minutes ago, Diogo Salazar said:

I don’t blame him either, like I said, whoever was responsible to revise the short story forgot about that too. This, plus the sidebar text in the book makes me believe that they actually forgot to add the Tainted keyword or Otherworldly should have been replaced by Tainted. Correct me if I’m wrong, but kenkus are Otherworldly creatures now, right? And definitely were the Kami, so I don’t see how they are supposed to br hit by Jade Strike.

With my albeit limited knowledge I would think you are correct. as would be tengu and naga and nezumi right?

I can see an argument for Otherworldly and Tainted, if you call it the power of the mortal realm kicking out anything from other realms. I'd make kami immune to Jade (but otherwise still otherworldly) and maybe give that ability to beings of Yomi and Tengoku too, in that case.

But it really should target Tainted.

1 hour ago, Myrion said:

But it really should target Tainted.

It really should!

Actually, @Daeglan , Nezumi, Ningyo and the one Tengu we've seen stats for in the RPG are all not Otherworldly. No stats for Naga yet, afaict, but I suspect they might be, much like Trolls, who seem to have a deeper connection to mystical powers.

On 8/7/2020 at 2:40 AM, Daeglan said:

You seem to be hung up on the Jade Champion and ignoring the Jade Magistrate part of my question.

No - my suggestion above was for the Jade Champion title.

My sarcasm mode and comments, which at this point I think you haven't noticed is due to the fact that the rules and the lore contradict themselves regarding to Jade Strike. In the rules, Jade Strike only affects Otherwordly beings (even though has a side bar mentioning about targeting non-Tainted beings and failing ) and in Beneath the Light of Jade it is shown that Isaw a Tadaka actually hurt Kuni Yori with a Jade Strike

whilst it's never been created, I think it can be assumed it was meant to say 'tainted' - compare the Jade Strike in the published rulebook to the beta version: the beta jade strike was for tainted, not otherworldly, targets.

Ah
Never checked the beta version. Well, someone clearly screwed up and they keep screwing If they haven’t fixed it yet.

Anyway, what could be a good title ability then?

1 hour ago, Diogo Salazar said:

Ah
Never checked the beta version. Well, someone clearly screwed up and they keep screwing If they haven’t fixed it yet.

Anyway, what could be a good title ability then?

Im guessing a 5e interpretation of Scent of the Kami