Overdrive Thrusters states "While you perform a red boost, barrel roll, or SLAM action, you must use a template of 1 speed higher, if able".

Is it possible to execute a red SLAM? The RR on pg 18 states "A ship can perform a 󲁊 action only as the ship’s one action during the Perform Action step. Therefore a ship cannot perform a 󲁊 action if it is granted an action from another effect"

How does one get to a red SLAM? If the action is granted by Poe's ability it's granted from "another effect" and it is not the "ship's one action during the Perform Action step".

Thoughts? I am not attempting to resurrect the argument that BB-8's boost is white 🙂

Currently there is no way to execute a red SLAM.

The only way is if a pilot has a red slam on his action bar.

The argument could be made that "Ship's one action during the perform action step", Is equivalent to pattern analyser's " While you fully execute a red maneuver, before the Check Difficulty step, you may perform 1 action."

Now PA has been clarified that you can certainly do more than one action in that step. Linked actions are valid even tho it says one, plus you could certainly trigger new Poe's ability in that timing window, maybe even getting 3 actions with some pilot like Nien.

So it could be interpreted as " a SLAM action needs to be made during the ships Perform action step" and that's the important part. That an action to linked SLAM could be possible even tho we haven't seen a ship with that ability.

If that is true then Poe's ability would trigger within that window as an analogue to a remote linked action and could be valid.

Even if that's not quite hiw the rules are written at this moment I fully expect an errata to make it so.

6 minutes ago, Tyhar7 said:

The argument could be made that "Ship's one action during the perform action step", Is equivalent to pattern analyser's " While you fully execute a red maneuver, before the Check Difficulty step, you may perform 1 action."

Now PA has been clarified that you can certainly do more than one action in that step. Linked actions are valid even tho it says one, plus you could certainly trigger new Poe's ability in that timing window, maybe even getting 3 actions with some pilot like Nien.

So it could be interpreted as " a SLAM action needs to be made during the ships Perform action step" and that's the important part. That an action to linked SLAM could be possible even tho we haven't seen a ship with that ability.

If that is true then Poe's ability would trigger within that window as an analogue to a remote linked action and could be valid.

Even if that not quite where it is at the moment I fully expect an errata to make it so.

That isn't how it works, though. Pattern Analyzer does not create a Pattern Analyzer step before the Perform Action step; rather it simply specifies its timing as after the movement step and before the Check Stress step. When you use Pattern Analyzer to perform an action, any ability or effect that happens "after you perform an action" is also triggered, and because you have not yet reached the Check Stress step, such actions also happen before the Check Stress step.

As it stands, it's quite clear that you cannot use any ability or effect to perform a SLAM action except for a) the one opportunity you get from the Perform Action step and b) the opportunity provided by Coaxium Hyperfuel, which specifically bypasses the rule.

17 minutes ago, Maui. said:

That isn't how it works, though. Pattern Analyzer does not create a Pattern Analyzer step before the Perform Action step; rather it simply specifies its timing as after the movement step and before the Check Stress step. When you use Pattern Analyzer to perform an action, any ability or effect that happens "after you perform an action" is also triggered, and because you have not yet reached the Check Stress step, such actions also happen before the Check Stress step.

As it stands, it's quite clear that you cannot use any ability or effect to perform a SLAM action except for a) the one opportunity you get from the Perform Action step and b) the opportunity provided by Coaxium Hyperfuel, which specifically bypasses the rule.

I was not arguing that PA gives you any new steps. I was arguing the definition of "one action."

PA was an example because when it was first released people argued that because of its wording that you could not do more than one action within the timing window that it triggers in. That has since been clarified that any linked action or other triggers can be carried out in that window.

So it could follow that in the sentence " A ship can perform a SLAM action only as the ship’s one action during the Perform Action st ep ." That the "one action" isn't the important part but the "during the Perform Action step" is. That "one action" does not mean one and only action like everyone thought for PA and the same rules for linked actions that apply for PA should apply here.

If that is true, then I'd argue that New Poe's ability is working as proxy linked action and is still valid.

We already know that "one action" opportunities don't extend to include additional action opportunities triggered by that first action (e.g. Sai and coordinate). There is no reason for us to interpret " the ship’s one action during the Perform Action step" as anything other than the single specific action opportunity granted by the standard rules governing a ship's activation.

If FFG wants there to be red SLAMs they'll give us red SLAMs, either on a card or by making changes to the rules. We can't change the rules to make things work differently; that's FFG's job.

16 minutes ago, Maui. said:

We already know that "one action" opportunities don't extend to include additional action opportunities triggered by that first action (e.g. Sai and coordinate). There is no reason for us to interpret " the ship’s one action during the Perform Action step" as anything other than the single specific action opportunity granted by the standard rules governing a ship's activation.

If FFG wants there to be red SLAMs they'll give us red SLAMs, either on a card or by making changes to the rules. We can't change the rules to make things work differently; that's FFG's job.

I wasn't suggesting we make up the rules! Simply playing devils advocate there is ambiguity in the wording and presedant from other similar rulings. As it is, I would lean toward agreeing with you, if I had to make a ruling today.

However this question was asked on the stream on Thursday and the designer seemed perplexed that it wasn't possible. He could of been playing coy, but he did seem to make a note of it. So I'd be expecting some rules changes soon.

Notable, the new Poe has the ability to let ships perform additional actions on their turn... this would indeed allow his team's Black 1 (either him, or a friendly T-70) to attempt a red SLAM action. However, that flies in the face of the rule that you can't SLAM outside of your perform action step... and Poe's ability seems to specifically happen after that particular perform action step is over.

I'm anticipating a rules change or modification to accompany this card

1 hour ago, emeraldbeacon said:

Notable, the new Poe has the ability to let ships perform additional actions on their turn... this would indeed allow his team's Black 1 (either him, or a friendly T-70) to attempt a red SLAM action. However, that flies in the face of the rule that you can't SLAM outside of your perform action step... and Poe's ability seems to specifically happen after that particular perform action step is over.

In terms of timing and interaction with Black One, Nu!Poe is exactly the same as the old one. Neither can be used to SLAM based on the current rules, as neither is the ship's standard action performing during the Perform Actions step.

If you do a linked action in your perform action step would you agree both actions are performed in that step?

Just now, Tyhar7 said:

If you do a linked action in your perform action step would you agree both actions are performed in that step?

Many (myself included) would not agree that the linked action happens during the Perform Action step because that step says, "The ship may perform one action." (v1.1.0 p3)

By the standing consensus that means the Perform Action step ended with the resolution of that one action and anything triggered by that action was resolved in the timing window of After the Perform Action step.

48 minutes ago, nitrobenz said:

Many (myself included) would not agree that the linked action happens during the Perform Action step because that step says, "The ship may perform one action." (v1.1.0 p3)

By the standing consensus that means the Perform Action step ended with the resolution of that one action and anything triggered by that action was resolved in the timing window of After the Perform Action step.

Okay, seemingly why I'm having some difficulty with this.

This is why I pointed to Pattern Analyser. " While you fully execute a red maneuver, before the Check Difficulty step, you may perform 1 action."

It too clearly states one action before the Check Difficulty step, but its been ruled you can perform linked actions before the timing window ends. If you were to apply the same above then a linked action in PA would happen after the check difficulty step, but it does not? So isn't that a precedent that linked actions happen within perform action step? or am I missing something else entirely?

35 minutes ago, Tyhar7 said:

Okay, seemingly why I'm having some difficulty with this.

This is why I pointed to Pattern Analyser. " While you fully execute a red maneuver, before the Check Difficulty step, you may perform 1 action."

It too clearly states one action before the Check Difficulty step, but its been ruled you can perform linked actions before the timing window ends. If you were to apply the same above then a linked action in PA would happen after the check difficulty step, but it does not? So isn't that a precedent that linked actions happen within perform action step? or am I missing something else entirely?

you're missing the ability queue, yeah. and the rules on SLAM. a linked action never has the same timing window as the action it was linked from. it happens afterwards. you can add effects and abilities to the front of ability queue, thus they resolve before other effects in the queue.

i'm totally with you when you're questioning the perform action step and what happens during it, when it ends, etc., but in the context of the rest of the rules, it's irrelevant. this is the rule on when a SLAM action can be performed:

there isn't much of a question left there. it can be performed only as the ship's one action during the perform action step. it's not just that it can only be performed during the perform action step, it can only be the one action during the perform action step.

sometimes, the rules are actually very clear if you read all of them.