where would southern cross constellation would be located in 40k galaxy? it seems to me that it would be part of ultima segmentum. anyone care to input?
southern cross
It wouldn't. After 40,000+ years, stellar drift would have altered the locations of the stars that make up the constellation.
Errant said:
It wouldn't. After 40,000+ years, stellar drift would have altered the locations of the stars that make up the constellation.
Not only that, but constellations are subject to viewing angle to an extent - there is no guarantee that those stars are particularly close to one another in the first place.
okee... is there an astro-something on the plane? i mean some educated guess would be nice...
You could find the names of each star, see if their relative position is known and then plot a guestimate fo their drift over the last 40k years...I think Beta Crucis is one of them.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crux#Stars
Acrux is a multiple star located 321 light years from the solar system.
Beta Crucis is located approximately 460 light years distant.
Delta Crucis is a star in the constellation Crux. It is sometimes called Pálida in Portuguese. It is about 360 light-years from Earth.
I can not plot a drift of my sofa towards the kitchen but I hope there are some smart people over here that can do that
that is tell me where in the 40k galaxy is the southern cross. I am planning a pacific-themed RT sandbox setting and have just thought that it would be wicked cool if I would set it inside the Southern Cross constellation. It is very evocative and it cries (at least to me) adventure and exploration.
Going by the distances quoted by isiah, it sounds like the stars that make up the Southern Cross are all within 500 light years of Earth. This would put them either at the extreme edges of the Sector Holy Terra is located in, or in an adjacent sector.
This pretty much rules them out for any Rogue Trader style games. Any systems that close to the human homeworld will have been explored, colonised and settled in the earliest days of humans traveling the stars. They'll all have long-established settlements, with cities older than recorded civilisation in the real world. Or they'll have a very good reason why they aren't colonised- either there's no way they can be made habitable, or they were given the Exterminatus treatment during the Horus Heresy or in the Age of Strife, and it wasn't practical to re-Terraform them.
In short, the Southern Cross stars themselves have no unexplored frontiers for the Rogue Traders to profit from. It might have been a cool-seeming idea, but the astronomical realities don't back it up.
If you're absolutely desperate to use the Southern Cross idea, then the "Jewel Box" or "Kappa Crucis Cluster" is an open cluster of 100 stars that seems to be a single star when seen from Earth with the naked eye. It's located at the very edge of the Southern Cross, and is 6440 light years from Earth.
The heart of the cluster is the orange Supergiant star Kappa Crucis. The stars are so close together that any worlds orbiting them would probably have nights as bright as if several full moons were in the sky at once. Strictly speaking, it's debatable whether stars in an Open Cluster would have planets at all, let alone ones in any way habitable- but 40K is a setting that bends niggling details like that whenever it's in the interests of the plot.
Unfortunately I don't have any idea where this would be on the 40K galaxy maps, so I can't help you with that.
There are unexplored areas within the Imperium and areas that have been cut off by warp storms. Even a few minor non-Imperial and xeno empires. If the Imperium can lose track of worlds due to administrative errors, there are surely "lost worlds" to rediscover even in the Segmentum Solar.
Decessor said:
There are unexplored areas within the Imperium and areas that have been cut off by warp storms. Even a few minor non-Imperial and xeno empires. If the Imperium can lose track of worlds due to administrative errors, there are surely "lost worlds" to rediscover even in the Segmentum Solar.
I really heartily agree with you on this. Any area not detailed by GW/FFG is open to you ... you can say this just because if you want to and your the GM.
On the logical side the fact that there are hundreds of BILLIONS of unexplored systems (milky way has ~200-400 billion stars, this is an estimate) means that most of the Imperium is isolated in pockets, sectors. So do whatever you want with the Southern cross and dont feel bad about it. You can even say the cross and a thousand stars nearby are a single pocket human empire if you want and they've never had contact with the Imperium until just yesterday. Or xenos or the pilsbury dough boy oligarchy!
Well, yes, it'd be possible the Southern Cross was a pocket empire that was cut off until very recently. Just very, VERY unlikely.
There are unexplored and/or inaccessible areas in the Segmentum Solar, but right on Holy Terra's doorstep?
Even if such an area had been cut off and just now become accessible, it wouldn't be just Rogue Traders moving in to explore and exploit. The Southern Cross is close enough that it could be used to launch an invasion of the Sol system from. The High Lords of Terra themselves would send all available forces into the region to secure it and eliminate any possible threats.
Simply put, given travel times, the Southern Cross stars are too close to Earth for things to be left to the PCs. People far more powerful than them will have a vested interest in the place.
I agree that it's probably not a terrible common occurance in that segmentum and the Adeptus Terra would be quicker than usual to move in. But since someone has to be there say when a warp storm abates, why not the players? I'm thinking a goldrush type scenario where they rush to grab what they can before the gears of Imperial bereaucracy get moving to claim the region. They could be the ones assigned to do it to speed up the process, considering the massive number of larger threats that are likely to eat into any resources that might be sent to pacify the region.
guys I might wanna have an anti-imperial campaign (with evil imperial astral cardinal as the main villain) and as far I know it is distance in warp that counts and not in real space. if there is any turbulence in warp it is really not important if that system is 'close' in real space.
that said, yes 'jewel box' idea also crossed my mind. but I would love to connect it all: southern cross, jewel box...
also, I was just staring at the maps of galaxy (both the real one and 40k one) and it seems to me that southern cross is on the western edge of the ultima segmentum. any thoughts on that.
Tantavalist said:
Well, yes, it'd be possible the Southern Cross was a pocket empire that was cut off until very recently. Just very, VERY unlikely.
There are unexplored and/or inaccessible areas in the Segmentum Solar, but right on Holy Terra's doorstep?
Even if such an area had been cut off and just now become accessible, it wouldn't be just Rogue Traders moving in to explore and exploit. The Southern Cross is close enough that it could be used to launch an invasion of the Sol system from. The High Lords of Terra themselves would send all available forces into the region to secure it and eliminate any possible threats.
Simply put, given travel times, the Southern Cross stars are too close to Earth for things to be left to the PCs. People far more powerful than them will have a vested interest in the place.
Only if they know of a way in. For example, if the RT knows about a stable passage through the warp storms and they don't then they won't be sending a fleet.
However keeping it secret while profiting from it could be difficult.
Tantavalist said:
Unfortunately I don't have any idea where this would be on the 40K galaxy maps, so I can't help you with that.
The Southern Cross is actually pretty dead-on where Hive Fleet Leviathan ended up around Rigant/Gryphone IV is on a 40k star chart.
that puts it in segmentum tempestus?
What year did Hive Fleet Leviathan hit Rigant/Gryphone IV?
isaiah said:
What year did Hive Fleet Leviathan hit Rigant/Gryphone IV?
Hive Fleet Leviathan struck the Imperium during 997.M41; not sure of any more specific dates than that.
Cat that Walked by Himself said:
that puts it in segmentum tempestus?
According to the map I'm looking at its in the Seg-Ultima, most of the Lev invasion went through Tempestus but it splintered, some ended up around Rigant (some crappy ag-world) in 997M41 and got attacked.
Cat that Walked by Himself said:
where would southern cross constellation would be located in 40k galaxy? it seems to me that it would be part of ultima segmentum. anyone care to input?
Not to sound like an ass, but 'Who cares' seems like a perfectly valid response to this question.
Hear me out: unless your players are astrophysicists you can pretty much move it to any part of the galaxy and nobody will know or care. (unless it's writen about in some of the other books as being somewhere else, which I'm not sure about but given people's reactions seems unlikely)
Also this isnt an ultra realistic setting. Having a full set of armor and refusing to wear the helmet gives you all sorts of stat bonuses. It clearly exists in the fantasy/fiction realm of storytelling wherein a leather jacket and pistol will keep you alive better than a full suit of armor and assault carbine, Han Solo style.
My suggestion is to just ignore any facts you may find about the southern cross and draw up your own star map in whatever corner (perhaps not TOO distant) of the galaxy you like and possibly make some sort of excuse for why the area isnt very well explored. Leave lots of holes in the history and loose threads because players will fill them better than you could and having a bit of mystery is essential.
Are you or any of your players Aussies or Kiwis, Cat, is that why you're interested in the Southern Cross? I think it's a neat idea for a campaign.
From quickly glancing at Wikipedia, it seems there's a huge number of stars in the constellation http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_stars_in_Crux but it would seem to me that given the galaxy is some 100,000 light years across, the majority of them are going to be in the Segmentum Solar rather than as far out as the Calixis Sector.
That said, there are a few famous constellations mentioned in the background for 40k that you could substitute for the Southern Cross (there's the face of Saint Sabbat in the Sabbat worlds, or the wings of Sanguinius mentioned in the latest 40k edition). Neither of those are Calixis specific, though, so you could make some up yourself: the Sword of Drusus or the Face of Angevin spring to mind as possible ideas.
If you're dead set on the Southern Cross idea, you could have a famous constellation called "The Southern Cross" visible from Scintilla that consists of stars lying within the Koronus Expanse. The constellation could have huge religious significance because it is identical to the Southern Cross constellation visible on Ancient Terra. Perhaps the players are hired by missionaries to ferry them to investigate the stars within the constellation, on the basis of a holy vision one of their number has had about a lost world to bring to the Emperor's light...
Just a thought! 
MKX said:
Cat that Walked by Himself said:
that puts it in segmentum tempestus?
According to the map I'm looking at its in the Seg-Ultima, most of the Lev invasion went through Tempestus but it splintered, some ended up around Rigant (some crappy ag-world) in 997M41 and got attacked.
thanx!
Omnicrazzy said:
Cat that Walked by Himself said:
where would southern cross constellation would be located in 40k galaxy? it seems to me that it would be part of ultima segmentum. anyone care to input?
Not to sound like an ass, but 'Who cares' seems like a perfectly valid response to this question.
Hear me out: unless your players are astrophysicists you can pretty much move it to any part of the galaxy and nobody will know or care. (unless it's writen about in some of the other books as being somewhere else, which I'm not sure about but given people's reactions seems unlikely)
Also this isnt an ultra realistic setting. Having a full set of armor and refusing to wear the helmet gives you all sorts of stat bonuses. It clearly exists in the fantasy/fiction realm of storytelling wherein a leather jacket and pistol will keep you alive better than a full suit of armor and assault carbine, Han Solo style.
My suggestion is to just ignore any facts you may find about the southern cross and draw up your own star map in whatever corner (perhaps not TOO distant) of the galaxy you like and possibly make some sort of excuse for why the area isnt very well explored. Leave lots of holes in the history and loose threads because players will fill them better than you could and having a bit of mystery is essential.
no, no, you are not an ass. au contraire, mon amie! your advice is sound and something that brings much needed perspective to this 'problem'. if I may say the favorite piece of gaming wisdom as far as published settings are concerned is one found in chaosium runequest books: your glorantha may vary
and I think that our 40ks not only may but must vary.
I just seek some little pointers, tidbits, already out there to get me started and nothing else. like this tyranid stuff.
Lightbringer said:
Are you or any of your players Aussies or Kiwis, Cat, is that why you're interested in the Southern Cross? I think it's a neat idea for a campaign.
From quickly glancing at Wikipedia, it seems there's a huge number of stars in the constellation http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_stars_in_Crux but it would seem to me that given the galaxy is some 100,000 light years across, the majority of them are going to be in the Segmentum Solar rather than as far out as the Calixis Sector.
That said, there are a few famous constellations mentioned in the background for 40k that you could substitute for the Southern Cross (there's the face of Saint Sabbat in the Sabbat worlds, or the wings of Sanguinius mentioned in the latest 40k edition). Neither of those are Calixis specific, though, so you could make some up yourself: the Sword of Drusus or the Face of Angevin spring to mind as possible ideas.
If you're dead set on the Southern Cross idea, you could have a famous constellation called "The Southern Cross" visible from Scintilla that consists of stars lying within the Koronus Expanse. The constellation could have huge religious significance because it is identical to the Southern Cross constellation visible on Ancient Terra. Perhaps the players are hired by missionaries to ferry them to investigate the stars within the constellation, on the basis of a holy vision one of their number has had about a lost world to bring to the Emperor's light...
Just a thought!
not really lightbringer. we are all eurotrash here and that probably why opening lines of the hugo pratt's 'la ballata del maro salto' (I am the Pacific Ocean and I am the largest) resonate with the promise of exotic adventure. if we were aussies we probably would be already too jaded to notice that.
to tell you the truth. I got that idea after reading 'Flashman's Lady' that is mostly set around malaya and singapore and then hunting down and reading sandokan novels. I decided that I want exotic, pacific-themed, sandbox setting in which it would be possible to run also an piratical, in certain way, anti-imperial campaign.
Well, if you want a "Southern Cross" themed game, there's plenty you could do:
First off, pick a nice region of the starmap and a reasonably important nearby world. Say you're using the Koronus expanse, pick some important world in the Calixis sector. Now just say that, as seen from this planet, a particular group of stars look close enough to the old constellation to be named the "Southern Cross". There's probably thousands of so-named regions across the galxy. All the stars in the constellation "happen" to be close enough to each other in realspace to form a subsector, once explored. (Looks like someone already mentioned this)
Now, populate this region with interesting locations that support the theme, could include things like:
- A potential "home base" system. Rich in the resources (and possibly skilled humans) needed to keep a rogue trader ship from having to return to civilization for a long time.
- A star system with lots of little planetoids to serve as "islands". Probably a double or triple-star system to explain why no or very few planets formed. Lots of archaeotech to keep each island inhabitable till the present - hazards would include gravity tending to pull them out of orbit and occasional too-close brushes with one of the stars, handleable with shields and thrusters. Larger planetoids have achieved spaceflight but not warp cabability so you have "islanders" spread throughout the "islands". Maybe even a star cluster that are close enough together that generation ships would be possible.
- Systems that could serve as pleasure worlds
- A former penal colony, either imperium or pre, that got cut off by warp storms and forgotten, now accessible again and has turned to piracy
- A literal "water world", where either the whole planet or all the interesting bits are water, with lots of small islands.
- A dead planet, with some equivalent to Easter Island's "dead island with lots of big statues". Maybe a necron tomb world or a planet of dead eldar?
- Pick your pirates. Ork freebooters, eldar raiders, random human empire #3702
- A space station that has turned to human sacrifice to placate the machine spirit that keeps them alive (villagers on a volcanic island)
- Head collecting chaos cultists
I'd also suggest looking up David Drake's "Lt. Leary" series. Has a "pacific in spaaaace!" feel, and one or more of the books has them traveling through uncivilized regions exploring, meeting natives, finding ancient relics, etc. Very rogue trader.