I wonder how a B-wing would be implemented. You could ignore the rotation of the cockpit, or you could auto-rotate the cockpit to keep the target in the top half of it's viewport, and make the roll functionality rotate the body of the ship.
It could make for an interesting ship design.
4 hours ago, FTS Gecko said:You're one of those toxic tryhards who absolutely must get the last word every internet discussion, aren't you?...
Mewl away kiddo....
I'm the one who apologized, and you told me to shut up, then you accuse me of being toxic?
Guess that ignore option is going both ways.
Edited by StriderZessei33 minutes ago, joeshmoe554 said:I wonder how a B-wing would be implemented. You could ignore the rotation of the cockpit, or you could auto-rotate the cockpit to keep the target in the top half of it's viewport, and make the roll functionality rotate the body of the ship.
It could make for an interesting ship design.
It'd make avoiding obstacles fun, that's for sure! 😂
If I was expecting extra ships of any kind, I'd be expecting the B-Wing for the Rebels and the TIE Defender for the Empire - two advanced starfighters against each other (although given how Rogue One influenced the creative team's efforts appear to be, there's a case for the TIE Striker as well).
Although the what-you-see-is-what-you-get nature of the gameplay interview suggests such DLC is unlikely to happen, I guess that may depend on how much player support the game sees. If the numbers are high enough, we may get something. Or they may just end up moving directly to a sequel.
On 6/13/2020 at 6:44 AM, Cpt ObVus said:I can’t speak for the other guy, but the X-Wing/TIE Fighter games were the pinnacle of sci-fi dogfighting. The pacing was fantastic. The missions were extraordinarily well-concepted, difficult, and varied. The mission briefings from Dodonna, Ackbar, the Imperial Flight Control Officer, or whoever you happened to be taking orders from were engaging and informative.
Once in the cockpit, your role was often dictated by your ship type, and you’d have different assignments according to what you were flying at the time; an A-Wing might be assigned to do a high speed sensor sweep of an Imperial convoy as it dropped out of hyperspace in waves, which necessitated transferring all your weapon energy to engines (or shields), and quickly acquiring target locks on all the ships you passed while dodging turbolaser fire at top speed. An X-Wing might be assigned to escort duty of a Y-Wing squad while it made torpedo runs on an enemy Interdictor, with the added directive to throw its own torpedoes into the mix whenever it wasn’t actively dogfighting enemy TIEs. Some missions required you to actively work with your wingmen and direct them to attack certain targets. Others put you in positions like, “We’re under attack! This lone Y-Wing is the only ship that isn’t currently dismantled for repairs, go use it to stop as many TIE Bombers from hitting us as you can, while we plot a hyperjump to safety!”
Ships would drop out of hyperspace and throw a few squadrons into battle, then make a couple of quick microjumps to the other side of things a few clicks away, and drop a few more, and while you got distracted by all of that, a Lambda shuttle and a group of StarWings would jump in and make a boarding attack on your flagship.
The game was glorious. The controls were fantastic. Each ship was a joy to fly and felt very different from the others. In the cockpit of a TIE Interceptor, you constantly flew on a knife’s edge, knowing that one full salvo from the linked cannons of an X-Wing, or a split-second slip while juking a concussion missile, and you were toast.
The only games that have remotely approached the masterful approximation of Star Wars fighter combat since those games were Rogue Squadron 1 & 2, and they were pretty decent, but in all, much more arcade-y and just not the same. Everything else, including the fighter combat of the newer Battlefront series (which isn’t bad), has paled by comparison.
I’m interested to see what they can pull off with a new take on SW Fighter combat, but I’d be floored if they gave us something even half as good as the old PC games.
This is basically what the Devs said Sqaudrons will be.
Nothing like Battlefront 2 for those asking. Completely different team, and different game.
Eg. No auto tracking, and each ship having a unique feel it's gunna be good
3 hours ago, EbonHawk said:This is basically what the Devs said Sqaudrons will be.
Nothing like Battlefront 2 for those asking. Completely different team, and different game.
Eg. No auto tracking, and each ship having a unique feel it's gunna be good
Yep, I thought I was THE biggest fan of the old X-Wing sims... until I watched the reveal video with the game director, and saw his drawings of the game as a kid. This guy clearly loved those games as much I ever did, and the gameplay footage looks amazing. I have very high hopes for this project.
On 6/21/2020 at 2:08 AM, StriderZessei said:Care to explain?
Just wanted to add (without further derailing this discussion, so I’ll be very brief): I think I misunderstood your previous post, which is why I was dismissive (and probably came off as a bit snarky at first). Apologies; your position is more clear to me now.
11 minutes ago, Cpt ObVus said:Just wanted to add (without further derailing this discussion, so I’ll be very brief): I think I misunderstood your previous post, which is why I was dismissive (and probably came off as a bit snarky at first). Apologies; your position is more clear to me now.
Hey, no worries! Misunderstandings happen, especially when text is the only way to communicate.
8 hours ago, EbonHawk said:This is basically what the Devs said Sqaudrons will be
Nothing like Battlefront 2 for those asking. Completely different team, and different game.
Eg. No auto tracking, and each ship having a unique feel it's gunna be good
Yeah, for a start you have the fixed first person point of view, and you're going to need to learn to read and understand the cockpit controls, power management etc.
As posted in the off topic version of this thread as well it looks like the flight controls are going to be very different, with some inspiration taken from the X-Wing Miniatures Game as well. the CD talks about being able to boost away from combat, then cut the engines mid-boost to flip your facing, allowing for Koiogran Turn, Segnor's Loop and Tallon Roll style manuevers.
That and the importance of squad-based flying and the practical differences between the ships gives me the impression that they're working hard to both emphasise team work avoid the circling-the-drain style flying that dogfighting games often end up seeing.
13 hours ago, FTS Gecko said:If I was expecting extra ships of any kind, I'd be expecting the B-Wing for the Rebels and the TIE Defender for the Empire - two advanced starfighters against each other
We know which is the real counterpart for the B-wing...
Anyway, the TIE Defender would do, I guess. They just need to make it slower (and the B-wing a little faster). Both have 6 guns and warhead launchers and for balancing, the B-wing should be better shielded/armored.
4 hours ago, FTS Gecko said:As posted in the off topic version of this thread as well it looks like the flight controls are going to be very different, with some inspiration taken from the X-Wing Miniatures Game as well. the CD talks about being able to boost away from combat, then cut the engines mid-boost to flip your facing, allowing for Koiogran Turn, Segnor's Loop and Tallon Roll style manuevers.
It should be interesting flying with abrupt change of facing maneuvers without also needing to make a change in relative elevation. Outside of a 2d restriction both a Split-S and an Immelman move the craft in a single plane yet change the facing of the aircraft 180 degrees like an X-wing TMG K-turn. These 3d maneuvers also come with a change in elevation. An atmosphere bound aircraft moving at high speed can not simply rotate its direction of travel 180 degrees while remaining at a constant elevation. Those sorts of maneuvers are most certainly not possible in Battlefront II.
5 minutes ago, Frimmel said:It should be interesting flying with abrupt change of facing maneuvers without also needing to make a change in relative elevation. Outside of a 2d restriction both a Split-S and an Immelman move the craft in a single plane yet change the facing of the aircraft 180 degrees like an X-wing TMG K-turn. These 3d maneuvers also come with a change in elevation. An atmosphere bound aircraft moving at high speed can not simply rotate its direction of travel 180 degrees while remaining at a constant elevation. Those sorts of maneuvers are most certainly not possible in Battlefront II.
Nor were they in the old X-Wing sims. There really wasn’t any sort of “drift” mechanic; your fighter kept constant forward momentum, relative to the direction in which the nose was pointed. Squadrons seems to be set to allow for cutting engines, spinning in a different direction while maintaining previous momentum, and then accelerating against that momentum to create a drift effect, which will allow you to shoot at targets that aren’t necessarily directly in your flight path. Could make for some pretty dope tricks.
20 minutes ago, Cpt ObVus said:Nor were they in the old X-Wing sims. There really wasn’t any sort of “drift” mechanic; your fighter kept constant forward momentum, relative to the direction in which the nose was pointed. Squadrons seems to be set to allow for cutting engines, spinning in a different direction while maintaining previous momentum, and then accelerating against that momentum to create a drift effect, which will allow you to shoot at targets that aren’t necessarily directly in your flight path. Could make for some pretty dope tricks.
I remember that you turned better with the engines at 1/3 of power in the old games. Your speed slowly decreased but you turned faster.
Then you could put the throttle at 100% to recover all the speed.
No "drift" effect, but I liked it.
38 minutes ago, S4ul0 said:I remember that you turned better with the engines at 1/3 of power in the old games. Your speed slowly decreased but you turned faster.
Then you could put the throttle at 100% to recover all the speed.
No "drift" effect, but I liked it.
That's just "real-world" physics. A basic law of motion. Your speed is force in direction X and your turn is force in direction Y. Reduce the magnitude of X and the force in direction Y has more effect. I suspect the same thing will be in play in the game.
Seems like there will be a lot of tuning available. Adjusting speed as a means to change turn radius. Robbing power from elsewhere to adjust turn radius without needing a speed change. I think some of those perks they showed can effect this. Probably tweaks that change how long you've got to cut speed when you execute any sort of drift.
On 6/21/2020 at 1:18 AM, Cpt ObVus said:True. Forgive me. I just can’t deal with reflexive, knee-jerk Sequel hate. Those were good films.
My hate for the Sequel films is not knee-jerk. I was open minded to all 3 of them. I recognize the garbage for what they are. In no way are they fun movies to watch over and over. Each time I re-watched any of them, I feel even more disgusted.
Unlike the original trilogy...more so A New Hope and Empire Strikes Back, which I have watched so many times over the last 40 years I lost count and still to this day I can watch again and still feel entertainment and drawn into the story.
The Sequel Trilogy was a massive fail.
1 hour ago, HawkZ71 said:My hate for the Sequel films is not knee-jerk. I was open minded to all 3 of them. I recognize the garbage for what they are. In no way are they fun movies to watch over and over. Each time I re-watched any of them, I feel even more disgusted.
Unlike the original trilogy...more so A New Hope and Empire Strikes Back, which I have watched so many times over the last 40 years I lost count and still to this day I can watch again and still feel entertainment and drawn into the story.
The Sequel Trilogy was a massive fail.
Knee jerk in that you are insistent on letting everyone know you hate the new movies. Because god forbid someone references something from a movie you hated.
I hated Infinity War, you don't see me being insistent that my view of the movie is correct and everyone needs to hear my opinion.
There is a reason Star Wars "discourse" has gotten so tiring over the past 3 years.
Anyway, I am half tempted to pick up a cheap PS4 for this game.
1 hour ago, Sithborg said:Anyway, I am half tempted to pick up a cheap PS4 for this game.
DEW IT
5 hours ago, HawkZ71 said:My hate for the Sequel films is not knee-jerk. I was open minded to all 3 of them. I recognize the garbage for what they are. In no way are they fun movies to watch over and over. Each time I re-watched any of them, I feel even more disgusted.
Unlike the original trilogy...more so A New Hope and Empire Strikes Back, which I have watched so many times over the last 40 years I lost count and still to this day I can watch again and still feel entertainment and drawn into the story.
The Sequel Trilogy was a massive fail.
Hey, nostalgia’s great! The Sequels were almost as much fun.
16 hours ago, Cpt ObVus said:Yep, I thought I was THE biggest fan of the old X-Wing sims... until I watched the reveal video with the game director, and saw his drawings of the game as a kid. This guy clearly loved those games as much I ever did, and the gameplay footage looks amazing. I have very high hopes for this project.
Yes! Having someone with passion leading is always a great sign imo.
Gameplay really has me hyped, as does creating you own pilot for single/multi player including aliens, being fully VR, and capital ship battles with destroyable hardpoints. My only niggle is B-WINGS! I would pay for that added it, as well as say a defender as a heavy fighter
12 hours ago, FTS Gecko said:Yeah, for a start you have the fixed first person point of view, and you're going to need to learn to read and understand the cockpit controls, power management etc.
As posted in the off topic version of this thread as well it looks like the flight controls are going to be very different, with some inspiration taken from the X-Wing Miniatures Game as well. the CD talks about being able to boost away from combat, then cut the engines mid-boost to flip your facing, allowing for Koiogran Turn, Segnor's Loop and Tallon Roll style manuevers.
That and the importance of squad-based flying and the practical differences between the ships gives me the impression that they're working hard to both emphasise team work avoid the circling-the-drain style flying that dogfighting games often end up seeing.
That gameplay of a K turn with missiles being fired after was pure sex I won't lie
5 hours ago, HawkZ71 said:My hate for the Sequel films is not knee-jerk. I was open minded to all 3 of them. I recognize the garbage for what they are. In no way are they fun movies to watch over and over. Each time I re-watched any of them, I feel even more disgusted.
Unlike the original trilogy...more so A New Hope and Empire Strikes Back, which I have watched so many times over the last 40 years I lost count and still to this day I can watch again and still feel entertainment and drawn into the story.
The Sequel Trilogy was a massive fail.
I feel the opposite, I enjoy them more and more when I rewatch them, apart from TLJ that is garbage...
On 6/22/2020 at 11:25 AM, HawkZ71 said:My hate for the Sequel films is not knee-jerk. I was open minded to all 3 of them. I recognize the garbage for what they are. In no way are they fun movies to watch over and over. Each time I re-watched any of them, I feel even more disgusted.
Unlike the original trilogy...more so A New Hope and Empire Strikes Back, which I have watched so many times over the last 40 years I lost count and still to this day I can watch again and still feel entertainment and drawn into the story.
The Sequel Trilogy was a massive fail.
Careful, or Gecko is gonna get on your case about getting off topic. EDIT: never mind, looks like he only cares about staying on topic when you disagree with him. What a hypocrite.
20 hours ago, EbonHawk said:I feel the opposite, I enjoy them more and more when I rewatch them, apart from TLJ that is garbage...
I honestly felt that TLJ was the only one that wasn't a mediocre attempt at cashing in on our collective nostalgia. I won't say it was perfect, but it at least had something interesting to say, and had me really excited to see what would happen in 9.
If the internet hadn't had 2 years to form its own headcanon before its release, it probably would have been received better.
Edited by StriderZesseiBack on topic: I'm super excited to see that the Star Destroyers will finally be scaled properly!
It's easy to see how utterly MASSIVE they are in the shot of the A-Wing flying the length of it. This game can't get here soon enough.
18 hours ago, Sithborg said:Anyway, I am half tempted to pick up a cheap PS4 for this game.
What platform I get this on will be my problem. I have a PS4 and VR Headset which has been collecting dust for the better part of a year. I have recently built a new PC and prefer PC gaming. However, already having a VR headset and not having to buy one for the PC might push my platform decision in the PS4's favor.
14 hours ago, StriderZessei said:I honestly felt that TLJ was the only one that wasn't a mediocre attempt at cashing in on our collective nostalgia. I won't say it was perfect, but it at least had something interesting to say, and had me really excited to see what would happen in 9.
If the internet hadn't had 2 years to form its own headcanon before its release, it probably would have been received better.
To me, the real salt test of a Star Wars movie is watch it 10 times. If you can rewatch it over and over and feel like you catch something new every time and it builds more into the story and imagination while entertaining...then it is a worthwhile Star Wars movie.
I watched TFA 3 times and found myself more aggravated with each viewing...have no desire to watch it again. TLJ twice, yet once was enough to find complete disgust in how Luke's story was trashed. And only once for TROS to see how they badly attempted to salvage the dumpster fire train wreck of the trilogy...so much missed opportunity on what could have been an awesome continuation of the original trilogy.
As for the topic, I am hoping this is an even better X-wing PC simulator. I loved that game in the early 90's and did everything I could to improve the game even making sure I had the best joystick I could find at the time.
If the make the game VR...I see that being awesome in how you could look around quick to have a real feel of situational awareness...but then the problem I have always had with a VR game is then what is the point of having a high quality TV? Will the VR be better in graphics? Then you don't even need a tv.
2 hours ago, Jo Jo said:
What platform I get this on will be my problem. I have a PS4 and VR Headset which has been collecting dust for the better part of a year. I have recently built a new PC and prefer PC gaming. However, already having a VR headset and not having to buy one for the PC might push my platform decision in the PS4's favor.
Oh I'd definitely want to try this in VR. Just looking at the action we've seen so far, it promises to be pure insanity.
Otherwise, I'm not sure the choice of platform will make a massive difference with it being designed for all three. You'll probably be able to squeak better performance out of a gaming rig?
24 minutes ago, HawkZ71 said:...As for the topic, I am hoping this is an even better X-wing PC simulator. I loved that game in the early 90's and did everything I could to improve the game even making sure I had the best joystick I could find at the time.
If the make the game VR...I see that being awesome in how you could look around quick to have a real feel of situational awareness... but then the problem I have always had with a VR game is then what is the point of having a high quality TV? Will the VR be better in graphics? Then you don't even need a tv.
I suppose it depends on what you mean by "better". Each ofthe X-Wing games were groundbreaking for their time. They all have us memorable campaigns, as the Rebellion, as the Empire and as a family trying to survive on the fringe of the conflict. Each was a leap forward in graphical design, flight controls, music and immersion.
X-Wing Alliance was one of the first games I played online, via dial up of all things (and later with the XWAU fan content). It was a lot fun, but it was also a long time ago (and may has well have been in a galaxy far, far away) - co-operative and competitive multiplayer games have come a long, long way since then. There's absolutely no doubt that this game will be better from that point of view.
I think what a lot of people will mean when they say "better" is will it evoke the same sense of wonder that the X-Wing games did at the time? That's going to be a much harder standard to reach and beat.
The game is unlikely to be rooted anywhere near as deep in flight sim territory - although Elite: Dangerous showed that complex flight simulation controls can be successfully ported to the PS4 and Xbox One, console controls (and the Star Wars franchise in general) lend themselves better to fast paced action, which is also what we've seen in the trailers.
The flight controls and combat will no doubt be much deeper than they were in Battlefront (I enjoyed Criterion's take on Starfighter combat, but it wasn't anything like a simulation), but they're not likely to be anywhere near as in depth as the X-Wing games. Likewise, what single player campaign we get will no doubt be fun, but clearly isn't going to be anywhere as long or involved as the X-Wing games.
As for the difference in plying on TV and VR; well, the difference is going to be immersion. The graphics won't be much different, but with VR you're going to be fully immersed in the game and the action. I imagine that's going to be this game's groundbreaking leap forward.