So here's a little thing I've been trying to figure out ever since I got ahold of Operative Luke: is it better to fill out the rest of the legion with low-cost grunts so that the activation number stays high, or allow the hit in activations so that heroes or special forces can be used for more effect. Lately I've tried to work with a seven activation list and... it hasn't gone well to say the least. I think my flaw is wanting Rebel Troopers to be better (less glass cannon) than they are without any real means to accomplish that. It's even more frustrating when taking into account the options they have thanks to the upgrade pack. Why invest points into a unit if they're just going to get mowed down by the first squad of stormies that decides to aim (or worse, clones with fire support and friends with ANY green tokens)?

Seriously just need someone with more experience than I do to show me what I'm missing here.

19 hours ago, Cruzer said:

So here's a little thing I've been trying to figure out ever since I got ahold of Operative Luke: is it better to fill out the rest of the legion with low-cost grunts so that the activation number stays high, or allow the hit in activations so that heroes or special forces can be used for more effect. Lately I've tried to work with a seven activation list and... it hasn't gone well to say the least. I think my flaw is wanting Rebel Troopers to be better (less glass cannon) than they are without any real means to accomplish that. It's even more frustrating when taking into account the options they have thanks to the upgrade pack. Why invest points into a unit if they're just going to get mowed down by the first squad of stormies that decides to aim (or worse, clones with fire support and friends with ANY green tokens)?

Seriously just need someone with more experience than I do to show me what I'm missing here.

A rebel seven activation list will likely not do well, the main problem is that though you have a powerhouse with either Luke he can still be taken down with focused fire, so you want to play him often so that you can go last one turn and first the next, often either having him end up in melee (and protected from ranged attacks) or have him in cover and /or out of LOS. if you try to go last on a seven activation list on just about every other meta relevant army they would still have activations able to go after Luke does , even a Dooku/Grevious double the fall list has 8 activations, and will out activate you. So you would want 10/11 or more activations ideally.

I'm curious about how you manage to beef up your units so that a 7 activation list is possible. The problem for rebels is that 1 wound is about 80% likely to end up with one lost trooper and also 7 activation lists don't leave many unit leaders for actually scoring points on objectives, which is ultimately how you win the game. Tabling your opponent is also much harder the more units they have.

You also have to have units capable of achieving things. This is why sniper strike teams are popular as they are cheap, pad out your activations, can stay out of danger, and still continually put out damage throughout the game

Both.

But if you do, you have to cut extras from other units. For example,

3x Rebel troopers = 120

3x Rebel snipers = 144

Op Luke, Force Push, Force Reflexes =220

K2S0. Jyn's blaster =75

Cassian +stuff =112

Jyn blaster DnC

You have 10 activations, 15 pts still to bid or get some options

3 hours ago, syrath said:

I'm curious about how you manage to beef up your units so that a 7 activation list is possible. The problem for rebels is that 1 wound is about 80% likely to end up with one lost trooper and also 7 activation lists don't leave many unit leaders for actually scoring points on objectives, which is ultimately how you win the game. Tabling your opponent is also much harder the more units they have.

I suppose my biggest issue is I let it get into my head that because the Rebel faction is so hero-focused, it's better to invest in a small number of high-cost units while minimizing low-cost, easy to kill corps units. One thing that has consistently perplexed me is how often heavy weapons (especially on Rebel Troopers and Fleet Troopers) become a huge point gamble due to how often they can get out-ranged by other factions (mostly have played against Empire and Republic players lately. DLT19s and mortar phase IIs are starting to give me a 1000-yard stare). At the very least I've found that Rebel Vets can get some use out of their CMO + either overwatch or offensive push (all the better fire-supporting with a MKII, but I digress).

The 7-unit list I've been doubling down on the saber-wielding units by having Op Luke and Sabine + Darksaber. Other units are the generic Rebel commander, two rebel trooper units (one DLT20A with a specialist, one with a captain and an ion in case of vehicles or droids), a fleet trooper unit with the scatter-gun, and a unit of tauntauns. Best part about the list so far has been the DLT20A unit, which works as a killer poor-man's sniper (especially having the surge/dodge token as an option). Luke and Sabine sadly do get focused very easily ><

1 hour ago, buckero0 said:

Both.

But if you do, you have to cut extras from other units. For example,

3x Rebel troopers = 120

3x Rebel snipers = 144

Op Luke, Force Push, Force Reflexes =220

K2S0. Jyn's blaster =75

Cassian +stuff =112

Jyn blaster DnC

You have 10 activations, 15 pts still to bid or get some options

Admittedly, I do not have any rebel commando teams (chiefly due to the over-saturation they saw during the pre-nerf). As said above, kinda tried using the DLT20A as a poor-man's sniper which works well enough. Also located in the U.S., so sadly no Cassian/K2SO yet (have not broken down and gone for eBay just yet). Would prefer not to go the heavy sniper route if I can help it overall.

1 hour ago, Cruzer said:

Admittedly, I do not have any rebel commando teams (chiefly due to the over-saturation they saw during the pre-nerf). As said above, kinda tried using the DLT20A as a poor-man's sniper which works well enough. Also located in the U.S., so sadly no Cassian/K2SO yet (have not broken down and gone for eBay just yet). Would prefer not to go the heavy sniper route if I can help it overall.

Just an example of something i tried.

My point is that if you go super heavy on Rebel characters (3-4), you'll have to go cheap on upgrades.

Ifyou want your upgrades, you can't take all the characters.

I like taking Chewbacca as a walking blood-bank for example with other characters.

I like the dlt20, its the best weapon for the rebel troops there is. If i take that, then i usually only have 2 maybe 3 cheaper chatacters (like leader Luke instead or operative), otherwise, i don't take an upgrade on my troopers ever.

Tauntauns act like or better than most characters which is why people spam them.

If i play Sabine and Luke, i keep her cheap and fast and she flies around and grabs objectives and bombs things and distracts people from Luke then he swoops in and kills units.

My point is some of the charaxters act like mini units. Cassian should be out this week and is one of my favorites. You can manage less activations if you have a way to eliminate umits and even things out. I never play more than 2 snipers just because.

Pathfinders work as a mini character and the clan wren will too i think.

9-10 activations is enough i think to make any list playable. 7 would be tough though unless you could guarantee certain deployments and you had the vital assests pack too (i don't yet) because i don't think you can eradicate units fast enough to stay in the game.

FD cannons, Parhfinders and DLT20 on troopers can deal with long range threats as well. They just cost more and cramp your activations.

Most of the big or threatening rebel characters do better in close range though. I've never played Sabine wirh the Darksaber bc of the points. Plus i feel she does more damage with her bombs and pistols.

I hear your pain on rebel trooper frustrations, i haven't taken an upgrade on them in years til the dlt20a came out. The z6 has been poo since the beginning for me.

1 hour ago, buckero0 said:

FD cannons, Parhfinders and DLT20 on troopers can deal with long range threats as well. They just cost more and cramp your activations.

Most of the big or threatening rebel characters do better in close range though. I've never played Sabine wirh the Darksaber bc of the points. Plus i feel she does more damage with her bombs and pistols.

I hear your pain on rebel trooper frustrations, i haven't taken an upgrade on them in years til the dlt20a came out. The z6 has been poo since the beginning for me.

Sabine + Darksaber is INSANELY good and I will forever swear by the extra 25 pts. Not only does she cancel pierce in melee (making her an excellent matchup for saber wielders) but she also gains Dauntless, which is epic when you know how much she's gonna get focused. If the dice are good, she'll shrug off most attacks like no other unit but Boba Fett can.

8 hours ago, Cruzer said:

Sabine + Darksaber is INSANELY good and I will forever swear by the extra 25 pts. Not only does she cancel pierce in melee (making her an excellent matchup for saber wielders) but she also gains Dauntless, which is epic when you know how much she's gonna get focused. If the dice are good, she'll shrug off most attacks like no other unit but Boba Fett can.

different playstyles and that's okay. The more different ways of playing the better.

I'm with buckeroo and prefer my Sabine light not dark(see what I did there)

9 hours ago, syrath said:

I'm with buckeroo and prefer my Sabine light not dark(see what I did there)

Do you put endurance or any of her specific gear (shield or cable line)?

The shield is handy as long as you don't forget about it because she hs a couple ways to recover. That and i likee to get those bombs out early and sometimes get lit up getting into position.

8 hours ago, buckero0 said:

Do you put endurance or any of her specific gear (shield or cable line)?

The shield is handy as long as you don't forget about it because she hs a couple ways to recover. That and i likee to get those bombs out early and sometimes get lit up getting into position.

The fact that the Electro Grappling Line takes an action is basically a deal breaker for me.

3 hours ago, arnoldrew said:

The fact that the Electro Grappling Line takes an action is basically a deal breaker for me.

Tried using it as an alternative for keeping force users off my troops for a couple turns. Had marginal success, so I haven't really used it since. XP

12 hours ago, buckero0 said:

Do you put endurance or any of her specific gear (shield or cable line)?

The shield is handy as long as you don't forget about it because she hs a couple ways to recover. That and i likee to get those bombs out early and sometimes get lit up getting into position.

Endurance , usually I've dabbled with Hunter, but more likely to use that in Cassian since at least it's not a dead card as often happens with Sabine. Started off using the shield and darksaber , the latter is too many points or what it brings for a unit without charge although I do like it for dauntless , again that's 25 points though, the shield , useful as it is , I'm either getting focused that much that the 1 or 2 at best wounds it may prevent over an entire game make little difference for a save that would often likely be made anyway. I'd take it if the points were spare though

One big question I still have is how effective is using units like Leia or the generic commander to give "take cover" dodges to troopers as far as survivability is concerned? I'm actually debating dropping Sabine and to add in Leia plus another corps unit. I get the sense that as long as the rebs can advance into range before suffering major damage (basically powering through sniper and DLT19 dice) they'll likely be better off getting first full-unit shot (based on sheer dice hit ratio) and thinning the enemy ranks first. Does this work very much in practice or is it mostly a lot of needless losses in exchange for bravado points?

I find leia works for dodges turn 1 and maybe turn 2 but then she gets left behind.

I wonder if Offensive Push is worth it since her 2 pip gives the recover. That and the shield could regen basically giving her 2 aims and 2 shields over the game. Hunter only works on certain unit types and I find her gunslinger works to eliminate the last 1-2 figures in a unit towards endgame.

14 minutes ago, buckero0 said:

I wonder if Offensive Push is worth it since her 2 pip gives the recover. That and the shield could regen basically giving her 2 aims and 2 shields over the game. Hunter only works on certain unit types and I find her gunslinger works to eliminate the last 1-2 figures in a unit towards endgame.

If you're not going Darksaber, heck yes OP is worth it with Sabine. Move 3, get in range of two enemies and have the reroll for misses/crit fishing. It's good stuff. Only thing better is Tenacity with the Darksaber (hard to be 5 black, 1 red with dauntless).

18 minutes ago, buckero0 said:

I find leia works for dodges turn 1 and maybe turn 2 but then she gets left behind.

Don't think the commands are worth it? Her 1-pip is an almost perfect anti-sniper/saber-wielder move, especially since you get to split fire between 3 targets.

2 hours ago, Cruzer said:

One big question I still have is how effective is using units like Leia or the generic commander to give "take cover" dodges to troopers as far as survivability is concerned?

I just meant in response to this statement. Her command cards are good, but I don't know that the take cover part of it is worth it.

Alot of rebel units are very fragile and vs long range firepower and standby of the empire or token sharing fire support of the republic, activations is a good option.

If you are low on activations an empire player can simply wait you out and shoot you when your units get close or move and snipe with range 4. Republic players can use fire support to take down activations without fearing to be out activated themselves.

I agree that rebel troopers have it rough as they have gotten some possibility to boost their offense or utility, they still get whiped very easy.

Can 7 activations work? Sure, but I don't know how. I rarely take a rebel list with 9 or less activations due to the fact of how easy most units get's blown up, even from range 4 in cover. An operative Luke list would probably like to stay at around 10 activations to allow Luke to attempt a last-first activation in crucial rounds. Also u need several units to cap objectives and cheap rebel troopers squads and strike teams help with that.