I've been working on my Lannister deck again lately and it occurs to me that this perception of Lannister's overwhelming draw dominance is not entirely accurate. For a start let's look at what they do have.

Golden Tooth Mines- The card that all others are compared to. Sure, it nets you a guaranteed card per turn while it lasts, but does nothing else.

Qyburn's Collectors- Much more viable now that First Snow of Winter is gone, but paying 4 still irks.

Hornvale- Not worth talking about. (As wel as the equivalents for all the other houses)

Summer Tax- Solid card, but really only a replacement effect.

Tommen- Yup, great card, but do watch for other kings.

Tyrion Lannister- Solid draw, but hard to justify running over shadows Tyrion.

Insidious Ways- All around solid.

Gold Cloaks- In Lannister, usually just a replacement effect. They really shine more out of say.... Targ.

For reference, how about Martell (and yes, I'm going to include reveal):

Desert Exiles- Ok, really only in the Reinforcements deck that I've never seen materialize.

Bronze Shield- Good card, but just replacement during Summer.

Fleabottom Scavenger- Holy crap this card is good. Up front 3 card boost and claim soak? I've had it be amazing so many more times than not.

Dornish Paramour- Solid just like Insidious Ways.

House Messenger- Solid and gets around the cap.

House Dayne Skirmisher- Only 1 draw, but 1 discard makes it a 2 card tempo change. (Granted you do have to kill him....)

Viper's Bannerman- Expensive but potentially 4 non-cap-able cards.

In playable cards, I'd actually give the nod to Martell at the moment as two of theirs get around the cap and one other gives a three card boost up front. Now, I'm not going to argue that these houses are in the lead, but as a very quick run down:

Stark- Sansa, Guard at Riverrun, Blackfish, Eddard, Storm Dancer, (plus To be a Wolf for great search)

Targaryen- Xaro's Home, Maegi Crone, Tears of Lys, (plus Street Waif and Dany's Chambers for great recursion)

Greyjoy- Kingsmoot, Scurvy, LIV, Fishmonger's Square, Drinking the Sea

Baratheon- Battle at the Wall, Renly, R'holler's Blessing (plus some pretty solid discard effects lately)

Neutrals can be used to varying effects in certain houses and certain builds. Gilly, Sam, and The Kings of Summer in Baratheon or Targ, Sam in Greyjoy or Stark, King's Landing in Lannister, Stark, Targaryen or Baratheon Shadows builds, etc. As well as a handful of replacement effects that can be scattered around.

Yes, in the end it does look that Greyjoy and Baratheon are further behind the rest of the pack in playable draw, but is Lannister really as far out in front as general talk here makes it out to be? I don't think so. At least not so far out in front that isn't a reasonable amount for a house that is supposed to have draw as one of their strengths. They may have GTM as an auto draw each turn, but it does nothing else and takes longer to ramp up than Martell draw. I think we're much closer to reasonable parity on these effects than most people have noticed.

Well one can look at Martell and note that they in fact have an equal or better draw engine than lannister right now.

But Lanni is still the favorite.

I think its the combination of Tier A draw AND Tier A Gold. Hell a Targ deck can be argued as having better card advantage than lanni since they have Draw, Search, and Recursion. However Targ like Martell can't use those cards as fast as lannister.

Granted a house's dominance can be very subtle. Take a look at Martell they were dominant because ITE Arianne could give them a free locked, and because they got Prince's Loyalist for 2 gold cheaper. Lanni lost dominance at that time because everyone found the loyalist to be worth 5 gold and they were very character ability driven.

Bear in mind also that as we get more location control effects, Targ, Martell, and Greyjoy will weaken since many of their strategies require a lot more gold and influence and locations than other houses.

I didn't realize draw was supposed to be a Lannister strength. I thought gold was their strength. When I think of Lannister, I think of gold (and of course, kneeling). I don't think it's a good idea to give one house both of these as strengths, since if a house has more cards *and* more gold than other houses, they will always have more options and will be more efficient/faster than other houses. That's a hard combo to beat on a consistent basis.

Of course, without more cards to spend it on, what does extra gold really do? Just sit there and maybe win dominance for you. Of course, you could just make Lannister's cards more expensive so that they need to spend the extra gold, but then you're just breaking even and the extra gold isn't an advantage.

Well, I think they have been adding cards and effects that trigger off paying gold, which would still give Lannister some additional options and benefits beyond saving gold for dominance (which in itself isn't an altogether bad thing). For example, "Sweet Cersei" (the ship that can give +1 strength per gold spent), the plots that require gold be spent to initiate challenges or play events, and to offset negative attachment effects such as "Motley". Then there are also events that have a gold cost (like "Hand of Judgement").

So, I don't think extra cards are needed to necessarily take advantage of the extra gold that Lannister has. Extra gold still provides the opportunity for more potential options.

dude....seriously....you are complaing that gtm doesn't do anything else but draw? i'd kill for a garanteed draw card that is **** near impossible to stop before draw phase and that I can have 3x of in play....

Kennon said:

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4 really good card draw cards with 2 solid but more expensive back ups and 2 more options if you really really want them.

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a lot of situational things and no muliple turn draw effects all one shots. 3 of the draw effects happen as you lose a character....you might get more cards in the long run (though I doubt it) but you will have less of a board.

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Like Lars said (and I completely agree), it's not that other houses don't have draw, it's the lanni has better more consistent draw. And some other cards that don't make it into lanni decks would probably appear in other houses if given the opportunity.

Dornish paramour is not that good because you have to win with her and you have to kill her in order to draw (it's actually 1 card advantage that you have to spend 2 gold on) - mediocre to sucky in my opinion, whereas Insidious Ways is a great card.

Flea Bottom is really good in the first round agreed, but after that it's a really sucky weenie for 2 gold - and you usually include 3X in your deck to be able to get it off on the first turn. Plus if you don't get it in the first turn and god forbid you made some power, well guess what, you got 3 sh*tty cards in your deck now. Not really the best draw around.

House Messenger is a very good card. I don't agree that the put on bottom is a disadvantage. What if you get a really useless and a useful card - you've just gotten rid of the useless card for the next time you draw or reveal. There's no advantage or disadvantage there imo. The advantage comes from the fact that you can look at two cards and decide which one you'll take. This advantage in my opinion outweighs the fact that you have to show your opponent the card. Much better than dornish paramour by a long shot.

The only solid draw from GJ is LIV, Kingsmoot sucks, and Scurvy + Drinking the sea are mediocre.

Xaro's home is expensive (I usually want to use my influence for other things), Maegi crone is good - but we're talking about a 3 gold 1 str character that can be gotten rid of easily. And it's not automatic draw, you still gots to burn some units (or forever burn your own units ).

Baratheon sucks the most in the draw department, At the wall is problematic, King Renly has two conditions for him to draw 1 card! - at least if he was like the blackfish.

Lanni still has the best draw - the end

*shakes head in amazement* did i just agree with the majority of one of lars's unending treatises?!1 surely it can't be so! (and as a refinement, i agree with zsa's post almost to the letter.) at the end of the day, GTM, tommen, and insidious ways form a triplet unrivaled by the draw any other house has access to.

LIV is no GTM, and all of greyjoy's other draw has been demonstrated to suck (i have hope for fishmonger's square in the long run, but i also think mill/discard is a silly strategy in an era with no search and thus no reason to care about what gets discarded off the top of a deck); dornish paramour is a far cry from an equivalent to insidious ways, and the martell guy who kills himself to draw a card is just awful; flea bottom scavenger is good but terribly inconsistent; and so on. it's very clear to me that the house with the second best card advantage is targ: the crone, the waif, and forever burning. (xaro's home is a dated source of draw, especially since attachment recursion is no longer targ's primary burn mechanism; furthermore, a crone and a poisoned wine is a much more consistent and flexible combo with the same recurring cost to draw.) targ also has a very favorable summer build (its ability to protect black ravens from white ravens with dany's chambers and its ability to burn carrion birds with ease), thus making it the best house to play the summer agenda out of (with martell as a close second).

zsa's lanni shadows deck in the last online tournament demonstrated what happens when lanni's already consistent draw is supplemented by its easy use of king's landing -- the only way i beat that deck in two out of three games was by doing everything i could to claim power before KL came out; in the game that he won, it came out early and just owned my own ability to draw.

OK, the problem is that lannister has so much gold. Sure their draw is better, but a lanni summer deck using only agenda, sam, and insidious ways is still going to be just as good as a lannister shadows build with king's landing, GTM, Insidious Ways, and some other random lanni draw. However, people just want to make a lanni deck redundant enough so that no matter what happens they'll still be able to draw three cards a turn and kneel five dudes a turn. Lanni can do different things, but the kneel and draw is so easy to do why bother trying to build anything else. Lannister isn't as good as everyone thinks. Sure I think they're probably on top now, but not by much. I think the real problem is that no one is playing location hate. So Lannister has tons and tons of gold to play all the cards they draw.

In fact, let's look at all the sweet location control that's out there.

Support of the Kingdom-Awesome! I think most decks need at least two of these in a deck.

War Horn-Granted you actually have to have something standing, but still a decent enough card to run one of out of GJ or Stark.

River Bandit-Awesome card! I don't think its worth paying 4 for ooh, but def a must in a bara deck!

Condemned by the Realm- I'm going to be honest, I've never played with this card so I don't know how it plays. BUT on paper it looks good. Granted, you also have to have someone standing.

Shadow of the Isles- Wow, this card seems retarded. Its shadows, so it probably fuels some lanni stuff while not fueling much of anything from you, but also you have to lose a location too? Dumb.

Pyro's Apprentice- hahahahaha I can only imagine that this card was designed as a slap in the face to non lanni players.

Price of War- Badass. You have to have a character standing, but shouldn't be that big of a problem. The non-limited thing kinda sucks, but should be able to hit most stuff.

Climbing Spikes-Not sure about this yet. It looks meh to me. Although I like that you don't have to actually have a standing character.

Frozen Solid-Why is this stark only?!

I guarantee that if you take away lanni's gold, all the draw in the world won't matter. And before anyone just starts saying I'm dumb, why don't you try it? What do you have to lose?

Wow, I can't believe we're debating this. GTM would be an auto-include as an in-house location in pretty much every deck, as it typically is in Lanni. (LIV's result can be similar, but it's unique and can't be used before marshalling.) Tommen is amazing for his cost...much better than, say, Myrcella (a 1-cost queen for comparison). Insidious Ways is a pump that often swings the challenge result and draws two cards.

Other cards can be less attractive but still playable. For example, Gold Cloaks isn't always "draw," but it replaces itself, which is a big deal. Compare this with Martell's House Messenger. For 2 gold, Messenger replaces himself but generally doesn't add much STR to your board position. For 4 gold, Gold Cloaks replaces itself, adds good icons (Lanni is short on power icons) with a beefy 4 STR, and helps fuel a dominant house theme (shadows). My point is that even some of Lanni's "crappy draw" tends to be stronger or require less combo than other houses' "draw" sources.

And if all of this isn't enough, Lanni has the easiest access to neutral draw: King's Landing. Not only does Lanni have a bit more gold, which helps to play shadows and city plots, but it also has the most playable shadows cards/characters to supplement the shadows theme.

If people think Lanni should have better draw, or that it's draw is somehow balanced by the environment, that's one thing. To say Lanni's draw isn't the best in the game at the moment seems way off in my opinion. (A bit more location hate could change this up a bit, but until that exists, I suspect Lanni's draw will be among the most efficient and least finicky.)

I have to agree with everybody else. Kennon I don't know where your coming from, maybe your just trying to keep lanni from falling back into the state they were during Winter block times...I remember how bad they were and how much you complained about them being bad. Right now Lannister has the best draw hands down. I must agree with Lars, if I could run Qyburns Informers in any other house I would in a heartbeat, and he is expensive, but there are only so many choices out there for other houses. You either have to specialize your deck to Summer or Winter, or a certain deck type or you pretty much just can't draw.

As for taking away Lannisters gold, I am not cool with that, they deserve all the gold just because thats how they were in the book, paying a little extra price to buy people from other houses and factions, its a great mechanic, it just shouldn't be coupled with draw, which is whats going on at the moment.

Full agreement with you again, Wrecking Ball. As I said in an earlier post, I think Lannisters specialty *should* be gold and I wouldn't want that to go away. It's how they are represented in the books, as you pointed out. I don't think they should have gold *and* draw. That's just going too far.

Kennon said:

Did anyone even read Kennon's whole post? Seriously, he never said Lannister wasn't still the best draw house. He never said their draw sucks. He simply said that the gap has narrowed, but public perception has not. And he is dead right as evidenced by the responses to his post.

Most Lannister decks use the exact same in-house draw that they used a year ago: 3x GTM, 3x Insidious Ways, 1x Tommen. Perhaps they might use some neutrals like King's Landing that weren't available 12 months ago, but that is for a specific build (KL heavy, most often shadows deck). While every other deck has gained in-house draw options over the past year, the gap in draw has clearly closed.

One of the driving factors behind Kennon's post, was the fact that in our games lately I have been regularly outdrawing him except for the games he starts with a GTM. Basically, Tommen's fragility and Insidious Ways one-time-shot nature are not sustainable. GTM is the easiest and most sustainable draw in the game. But if you don't get one out (or it gets immediately nuked), it is quite interesting how Lanny's draw just dries up. Running 3x GTM, 3x Insidious Ways, and 1x Tommen just isn't enough for me. Nor was it enough for him in most of our games. And both the Gold cloaks and Qyburns Informers have the Ally trait, which means I personally would never play them with Arys and Varys so prevalent in the metagame.

But instead of people reading his whole post to recognize he was simply saying the draw gap had closed and was not as large as public perception, well, instead he gets his post torn apart line by line.

Oh well, he is a big boy, he can handle it. We shall just keep observations from our actual game play experience to ourselves from now on.

Ok, I'm going to go do something else for awhile and cool down before I respond fully. I intended this to be an intelligent thread pointing out something interesting that I realized. I didn't expect the vehemence that I received.

I request people please try to read and understand what I'm saying when I post rather than assuming that I'm whining that Lannister isn't good enough.

Well I can definitely see where you would be a little mad from what I said in my post so I will go ahead and apologize because you obviously weren't whining. I will still disagree with some of the points in your post. You and Dobbler are right about the gap closing but I will still always believe that the house that is supposed to have massive amounts of gold should not be able to draw so easily.

Wrecking Ball said:

Which is a good point.

My biggest problem with Lanny right now isn't the gold or the draw. It is the high number of reusable control cards. Castellan, Flogged, AGH, Toll Gate, Brothel, Ser Ilyn Payne....until those cards get removed from the table, turn after turn they locking down an opponent's character. If you build a shadows deck and include Black Cells and Venomous Blade, that number increases. So even if they don't get their draw going, I've found that getting out just a smattering of these cards does the trick just fine.

Kennon said:
Ok, I'm going to go do something else for awhile and cool down before I respond fully. I intended this to be an intelligent thread pointing out something interesting that I realized. I didn't expect the vehemence that I received.
I request people please try to read and understand what I'm saying when I post rather than assuming that I'm whining that Lannister isn't good enough.

Sorry to hear you're upset over some people's responses. I definitely see the point you're trying to make and where you're coming from. I think what got people going was that your original post seems to suggest that Lannister's cards that provide draw aren't as strong as they're percieved to be. For example, GTM only provides draw. To suggest that a card only provides consistent draw for 2 gold will get a lot of people going, and IMO it very well should. It would have been one thing to demonstrate how other Houses' draw cards/effects are almost as easy to achieve/access as Lannister's, but it's another to "knock down" Lanni's draw cards/effects to make other Houses' draw cards/effects seem relatively stronger. This may have not been your intention, but I think to many (including myself) that is the initial impression. For example, the original post doesn't have a single question mark. This makes it seem more like a declaration, which will naturally receive more criticism, and less like an inquiry, which will much more often lead to the intelligent discussion you were looking for instead of a heated debate. In this case the debate was rather one-sided: dissent against your post.

Some people may have jumped the gun, but this topic is the near equivalent of saying the earth is round when everyone thinks it's flat. If you don't tread carefully, you may receive some harsh and possibly even deserved criticism. Not saying that you deserved it, but this is what any radical proposition, right or wrong, should and often does receive.

I played a game the other night, It was lannister shadows vs lannister shadows. After that game I vowed that I wouldn't play lannister shadows every again. Lannister Shadows creates such a large NPE its crazy, I was very dissapointed.

Well, actually, there is a question mark in my initial post.... But oh well. I was just shocked at the response. I thought it best to step back before I put my foot in my mouth in a large way. I didn't expect everyone to agree with me, but I suppose I likewise didn't fully realize the burning hatred that people really have for my house of choice.

Yes, I suppose my intention was in part to knock down some of Lannister's draw cards. I really feel that those outside the Triumvirate (with the exception of the Informers) aren't blowing anyone out of the water. Is Summer Tax that much better than Court Advisor? I'm not disputing the power level of the Triumvirate (GTM, Tommen, Insidious Ways), however. They are fantastic cards and as Dobbler says, every bit as much a part of the Lannister decks of today as they were of Lannister decks a year ago. But by the same token, they are exactly the same lineup that we've seen in Lannister for a year, while other houses are increasing and diversifying. Even aside from draw, point me towards some Lannister cards that look worthwhile in the latest set other than Misinformation. Your voices have been heard by development it does surely appear, though not all of the houses are moving forward at the same rate. As I said, Greyjoy and Baratheon still lag behind, though I just realized I left out mentioning The Seastone Chair for Greyjoy draw.

Speaking of Baratheon, I'm curious if Lars is running R'holler's Blessing in his Baratheon deck? Your comment in response to Summer Tax seems to suggest yes, while your response to my admittedly short list of Baratheon draw seems to suggest that you wouldn't play any of it. I'm a little confused. Especially since I still think that Epic event is..... epic out of Baratheon- especially when coupled with Vigilant.

For others, is anyone else playing Fleabottom Scavenger? I've tossed my first hand many times in order to mulligan into one. It is that good. Two gold for three cards up front and a character for claim soak is fantastic. It takes me several turns to get up to that level of return with GTM. While Martell's draw isn't as steady as Lannister, the explosive power of it seems to give them a huge hand on finishing up the game quickly. At least in play here.

Dornish Paramour vs. Insidious Ways- While Insidious ways does get a slight nod on surprise and lack of gold cost, it does require a character and a Lannister one at that. Many times I've been stuck with neutrals and wanted to play it but was unable. Dornish Paramour is essentially an Insidious Ways that comes attached to it's own body. Something I'm very much a fan of.

Also, per Lars' comment about draw bringing Stark back up thanks to the expansion and the like, I would agree that yes, that is part of it. On the other hand exceptional attachment and location control with Frozen Solid is another. They also received another attachment control card if I recall. I would rather though, that in the future they got some of their search back. I liked the game better when the houses had clear and different means of card advantage. Where's a Riverland Horsemen reprint when we need one?

That's all I can think of right at the moment as there's quite a lot to cover. Hopefully I'll think of more later. As well, I hope I've done a more careful job of phrasing than I would have an hour ago. If I still come off harshly, I do apologize.

Twn2dn said:

See I would venture to say that the location hate exists now but no one's really using it. To be fair though most of the good location hate needs to be run out of Stark and GJ, the two most unpopular houses at the moment I think. Although I'm guessing we'll see more Stark decks soon, and as such an end to a Lannister dominated tourney scene.

Dobbler said:

again....there are other options which have been pointed out that are the ONLY source of draw in some other decks. in lanni they can be added to and enhance the best draw in the game if its really a problem. Sorry, but gold cloaks is better then dornish paramour, one of the supposed gap closers and they are both ally's. Gold clocks x3 and AGH verse Dornish paramour x3 and lost oasis.............discuss. And once again qyburn's informer is such ass but I'd still run it if it was printed in any other house.

Dobbler said:

Kennon said:

Which I (~eventually) answered and Zsa followed up w/ a (succinct) agreement. Martell has the able to see more cards in one turn, but lanni still rules the draw game in the long run and in consistientsy. I'm really not feeling bad that you are tired of the same three cards nor the odd time when martell gets off a FBS first turn. If you are feeling the gap close on you you have sooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo many options to stick in your deck that is sounds more like I wanna new shiny mercedes benz, not my 3 year old well maintined faster then any car out there Mercedes Benz.. The only thing that I had a negtive reaction to (and maybe it colored the rest of my post) was the 'complaints' about GTM (and now the 'same old draw').

~When rich girls whine to daddy it erks me, so too when lanni whines about draw

Kennon said:

as a lanni player you shouldn;t care if court advisor is better then summer tax, why? you get BOTH!

Kennon said:

Nope, as I said if it was free (like summer tax) I would in a second. Until then that 1 gold for a crappy effect isn't worth drawing into it. In essence it says pay one gold to get the card you should have drawn. For 1 gold and a replacement effect court advisor works much better. Yes I can get both, but that is now twice as much gold and doesn't have the possibility of slowing my opponent down (like summer tax) or speeding me up (like summer tax). The epic event I've tried to make work, but I have to have it in plot phase, have to have a character standing in epic phase (yeah I have vigiliant, but no real help, especially because a card can come out of shadows before the epic phase starts) and it provides another power challenge/draw for my opponent who if is lanni is going first. Renly I play, but the draw is only a bonus, and as plots have gotten better there are less power struggle in the deck. I used to run eddard but like most things in bara these days he was just so expensive and his cancel too limited.

Kennon said:

FBS is a hit or miss though. Like you said you are tossing you hand to get one. If lanni doesn't have GTM it probable just shurgs and says whats next? If you miss on FBS you miss big time. Yes it can be money or it can be the card you really didn't want to see on turn 4 after you valared and have 1 power on your house because your opponent didn't feel the need to power you last turn.

Kennon said:

Dobble rules out a few of the lanni card draw cards because they are an ally......well this one is also an ally (so's FBS btw) but it still gets compared to an event? If you are lacking a lanni character in play.....sorry then something is wrong. there should be 2-3 neutrals in your deck, syrio and varys and maybe a pyromancers apprentince. What others do you need?

Kennon said:

its both, though if you were going to take one of them away and still have them be a solid house, which one would it be?

Staton said:

In general I would have to agree with Kennon. I believe the results of KublaCon support Kennon's post.

Certainly the matches I played as Lannister support the proposition that what matters are "Playable cards in hand" more than simply having a "gold or draw advantage". If a Greyjoy player can effectively lock down the Lannister players gold production and draw power (which is NOT hard for Greyjoy to accomplish). then draw and gold doesn't matter nearly so much since what makes the difference in card games is "playable cards in hand". While gold and draw have been the basic CCG ways to achieve an advantage in playable cards in hand, these are not the only means of achieving this. I think that is what FFG is trying to work out for LCG games. Alternative means of achieving an advantage in playable cards in hand besides just the old CCG stand-by pattern of "draw, search, draw, resource locations".

Baratheon for instance has far less worries about gold than any other House when they have so much free playing synergy cards that simply jump out onto the board without paying gold cost. That proved a more consistently effective mechanic in competitive play than the old stand-by of Weaponsmith + Steward for Lanni character gold production.

Other Houses have very powerful cards that perhaps have just not had competitive players take advantage of. One top California player was raving about the potential power of Meerenese Brothel for repeatable and consistent attachment hate. When Lannister had their only attachment control card banned, that really hurts them more than may be initially believed.

Staton said:

I can't speak for your guy's metas but out here in California, location hate most certainly is being run, at least by all the experienced players. I saw multiple Condemned by the Council all the weekend and I know others used Support for the Kingdom. I won't even talk about Wintertime Maruaders =/.

So yea, West Coast at least still run lots of location hate. There was also location blanking in addition to the straight destruction.

Wrecking Ball said:

NPE?

Natural Plant Extract?

Kennon, for the record I hope you did not take offense to any of my posts. They were not written with malice and I welcome any observations or insights from members of the community. If something I said sounded harsher than intended then I apologize. Tone and intent are often so hard to express in a written form like this, so it's easy to misunderstand folks. I have no hatred for any house, I play them all myself.

Dobbler, ditto to you for what I said to Kennon above. We've met in person so I hope you realize I'm not the sort of fellow who rips into others just for sharing their views.

Much respect.

The Ally trait on Fleabottom Scavenger isn't a negative. If it hits the table, it has served its purpose. I don't care it they use Varys or Arys on her then. As for the paramour also having the Ally trait, yep she does, and it sucks. But there is a big difference between paying 2 for a character and losing it and paying 4. I'd play her any day of the week over the gold cloaks

As for GTM, the interesting thing is, nobody ever mentions the true payback. It takes TWO FULL rounds for this card to become card advantage. The turn you play it, it is card disadvantage because it cost you a card from hand yet did not help your board at all. The following plot phase you receive your first card, which is the replacement card. The second plot phase it finally pays off in the form of real card advantage. What makes GTM so strong, is Lanny's repeatable control gives it time to get the card advantage from GTM. I'm sorry, but a two turn payoff is actually a long time. I have a couple of new decks that I really like that are quite fast and actually hope to see GTM sitting on the table at setup or played during the first round because I hope to have the game over before the draw kicks in.

Also, FBS is no more hit or miss than GTM. Both if you have it in the early game or money in the bank. And both if you draw it in the late game are fairly weak. GTM is stronger in the midgame, but FBS is stronger in the early game. But the fact that neither is a card you want to draw in a tight 12-12 game late, makes them both hit or miss in my book.