Hello there,

With the upcoming Vital Assets, I've just read this article : https://thefifthtrooper.com/vital-assets-a-modest-guide/

And we wiil need to add some fast units/infiltrate units in our lists 🙂

So, what do you think about this :

Commanders:
- Director Krennic (90): Aggressive Tactics (10) = 100

Operatives:
- Darth Vader (170): Force Reflexes (10) = 180

Corps:
- 2× Shoretroopers (52): T-21B Trooper (32) = 168
- DF-90 Mortar Trooper = 36

Special Forces:
- Death Troopers (76): DLT-19D Trooper (34), E-11D Config (8) = 118
- Strike Team (20): DLT-19x Sniper (28) = 48

Supports:
- 2× Speeder Bikes (75) = 150

•Vader's Might, •Voracious Ambition, ••Deploy the Garrison, ••New Ways to Motivate Them, •••Master of Evil, •••Darkness Descends, ••••Standing Orders

That's 9 activations with 5 different types of command tokens. Acitvation control is going to be a *****.

I think the importance of bids will rise an insane amount when VA hits. It might be better to tailor an army to certain objectives and take a 15-20 points bid instead of trying to build one that can do everything for 800 points.

Regarding your list: You activation control is pretty bad, especially because you are also using operative command cards. This could be a big problem. It is particularly bad for your shore troopers since they are a good unit overall, but a great unit if they receive orders. Same thing applies for the bikes. If they are moving too early or late in a round, they are toast.

All in all it is a good and well balanced list on paper, but it will hardly be a good list in an actual game, if the opponent knows how to exploit your lack of activation control.

Maybe use Commander Vader instead of Krennic? The 100 points would be another bike or officer + an upgrade for Op Vader + HQ Uplink on the bikes. Additionally you can cut the DT and the snipers and add more corp units (maybe snows, they work well with Vader). This would provide you with better activation control (Op/Commander + Support that has HQ Uplink + rest is only corps) but reduce the range of your army.

Generally the Empire might need to move away from the Krennic+DT+Shore gunline meta to achieve more mobile lists.

On 4/6/2020 at 7:07 PM, arnoldrew said:

That's 9 activations with 5 different types of command tokens. Acitvation control is going to be a *****.

Good point !

18 hours ago, Staelwulf said:

I think the importance of bids will rise an insane amount when VA hits. It might be better to tailor an army to certain objectives and take a 15-20 points bid instead of trying to build one that can do everything for 800 points.

Regarding your list: You activation control is pretty bad, especially because you are also using operative command cards. This could be a big problem. It is particularly bad for your shore troopers since they are a good unit overall, but a great unit if they receive orders. Same thing applies for the bikes. If they are moving too early or late in a round, they are toast.

All in all it is a good and well balanced list on paper, but it will hardly be a good list in an actual game, if the opponent knows how to exploit your lack of activation control.

Maybe use Commander Vader instead of Krennic? The 100 points would be another bike or officer + an upgrade for Op Vader + HQ Uplink on the bikes. Additionally you can cut the DT and the snipers and add more corp units (maybe snows, they work well with Vader). This would provide you with better activation control (Op/Commander + Support that has HQ Uplink + rest is only corps) but reduce the range of your army.

Generally the Empire might need to move away from the Krennic+DT+Shore gunline meta to achieve more mobile lists.

I agree with you about bids, but Kyle from the 5th trooper said : " I expect “serious” bids to fall in the 10-15 range; and if you aren’t bidding that, you might as well try and fit that extra upgrade in and go “no bid.” A “no bid” list should be designed to handle a variety of different objectives, conditions, and deployments, rather than hoping you don’t run across that one card you really don’t want to deal with."

I prefer to build a "no build" list, because I don't want to be totally useless on some objectives/conditions/deployments. Being blue player doesn't matter if your army can't handle the objectives/conditions/deployements. If I can't make a decent "no bid" list, i'll consider building a "bid one".

As above, good point about my activation control who is not good as it is.

I thought about an infiltrated commander Vader, but the lack of Spur, the fact that he can't be suppressed for that free +1 cover, and the fact that if I lose him I lose my main Commander made me choose the operative one. Still, your ideas are interesting.

I agree about mobile lists, and i'm glad because gunlines were a bit boring sometimes. But I don't think Krennic and Shores will be less played. Krennic has very good Command cards, and Compel makes the army faster. For only 8 points more per unit than Stormtroopers, Shoretroopers get black dices + Target 1 + give access to Mortar for cheap activations, so I don't see any reasons to play Stormtroopers if you can afford Shoretroopers. I agree about Death Troopers though.

V2, no bid :

800/800 (10 activations)

Commanders:
- Director Krennic (90): Aggressive Tactics (10), Strict Orders (5) = 105

Operatives:
- Boba Fett (140): Offensive Push (4), Recon Intel (2) = 146

Corps:
- 2× Shoretroopers (52): T-21B Trooper (32) = 168
- Shoretroopers (52): T-21B Trooper (32), Medical Droid (19) = 103
- 3× DF-90 Mortar Trooper (36) = 108

Supports:
- 2× Speeder Bikes (75): HQ Uplink (10) = 170

•Voracious Ambition, •Whipcord Launcher, ••Deploy the Garrison, ••Pinned Down, •••Annihilation Looms, •••Assault, ••••Standing Orders

So, I got :

- 10 activations, 4 different command tokens

- Good commander with good command cards

- A mobile army (Boba, 2 Speeder bikes, Compel )

- Long range (T-21B, Mortars)

- I can dump the medical droid to get a -19 bid

Version with OP vader :

800/800 (10 activations)
Commanders:
- Director Krennic (90): Aggressive Tactics (10) = 100

Operatives:
- Darth Vader = 170

Corps:
- 3× Shoretroopers (52): T-21B Trooper (32) = 252
- 3× DF-90 Mortar Trooper (36) = 108

Supports:
- 2× Speeder Bikes (75): HQ Uplink (10) = 170

•Voracious Ambition, •Vader's Might, ••Deploy the Garrison, ••New Ways to Motivate Them, •••Annihilation Looms, •••Darkness Descends, ••••Standing Orders

- 10 activations, 4 different command tokens

- Good commander with good command cards

- Got less mobility, but an infiltrated Vader can be a pain in the a**, and his 1 pip card is good for objectives

- Long range (T-21B, Mortars)

What do you think?

Boba got a HUGE boost due to Vital assets. I like your second list.

On 4/7/2020 at 6:29 PM, weebaer said:

Boba got a HUGE boost due to Vital assets. I like your second list.

Yep he looks good on most of the new missions/deployment/conditions.

V3 with Iden :

787/800 (10 activations)

Commanders:
- Director Krennic (90): Aggressive Tactics (10) = 100
- Iden Versio (100) + ID10 (15): Offensive Push (4), Targeting Scopes (4), TL-50 Repeater (15) = 138

Corps:
- 2× Shoretroopers (52): T-21B Trooper (32) = 168
- Shoretroopers (52): T-21B Trooper (32), Medical Droid (19) = 103
- 3× DF-90 Mortar Trooper (36) = 108

Supports:
- 2× Speeder Bikes (75): HQ Uplink (10) = 170

•Voracious Ambition, •Pulse Scan, ••Deploy the Garrison, ••Concussive Blast, •••Annihilation Looms, •••Tactical Strike, ••••Standing Orders

I will try all the versions (Boba / OP Vader / Iden), but I think I will switch from one to another 😉

On 4/9/2020 at 1:02 PM, player4031660 said:

Yep he looks good on most of the new missions/deployment/conditions.

V3 with Iden :

787/800 (10 activations)

Commanders:
- Director Krennic (90): Aggressive Tactics (10) = 100
- Iden Versio (100) + ID10 (15): Offensive Push (4), Targeting Scopes (4), TL-50 Repeater (15) = 138

Corps:
- 2× Shoretroopers (52): T-21B Trooper (32) = 168
- Shoretroopers (52): T-21B Trooper (32), Medical Droid (19) = 103
- 3× DF-90 Mortar Trooper (36) = 108

Supports:
- 2× Speeder Bikes (75): HQ Uplink (10) = 170

•Voracious Ambition, •Pulse Scan, ••Deploy the Garrison, ••Concussive Blast, •••Annihilation Looms, •••Tactical Strike, ••••Standing Orders

I will try all the versions (Boba / OP Vader / Iden), but I think I will switch from one to another 😉

How about Veers instead of Krennic? One of his command cards sinergizes well with the speeder bikes, and you get 10 points that you can spend on other upgrades!

On 4/9/2020 at 6:02 AM, player4031660 said:

787/800 (10 activations)
Commanders:
- Director Krennic (90): Aggressive Tactics (10) = 100
- Iden Versio (100) + ID10 (15): Offensive Push (4), Targeting Scopes (4), TL-50 Repeater (15) =138

You don't want targeting scopes on Iden. She wants to use her aim tokens to make hits into crits. On average she's going to roll 3 hits.

Worse case scenario, use her aim to make a blank a hit. Guaranteeing a hit is better than rerolling 3 dice.

She can also flip her training card or gear cards for whatever she needs or wants at the beginning of the game so usually take Hunter and OFFpush and you're good to go. You can trade those for whatever you need. Outside of recon you probably won't use the gear much

On 4/9/2020 at 1:02 PM, player4031660 said:

Yep he looks good on most of the new missions/deployment/conditions.

V3 with Iden :

787/800 (10 activations)

Commanders:
- Director Krennic (90): Aggressive Tactics (10) = 100
- Iden Versio (100) + ID10 (15): Offensive Push (4), Targeting Scopes (4), TL-50 Repeater (15) = 138

Corps:
- 2× Shoretroopers (52): T-21B Trooper (32) = 168
- Shoretroopers (52): T-21B Trooper (32), Medical Droid (19) = 103
- 3× DF-90 Mortar Trooper (36) = 108

Supports:
- 2× Speeder Bikes (75): HQ Uplink (10) = 170

•Voracious Ambition, •Pulse Scan, ••Deploy the Garrison, ••Concussive Blast, •••Annihilation Looms, •••Tactical Strike, ••••Standing Orders

I will try all the versions (Boba / OP Vader / Iden), but I think I will switch from one to another 😉

As a follow-up comment, i would not choose tactical strike as a card because you lack Special forces in your army and that card is mostly useful if you have them: how about the generic imperial card that gives out aim tokens all around? Picture this: Veers passes tokens, the shores geenrate tokens with their activations, and Iden gets them all! Using Marksman, she could easily come up with multiple crits in one shot!

@buckero0 and @Rogue Three : Ok, you definitely have some nice ideas here.

The problem is, I'm struggling to chose the best Commander/Operative combo for my list...

In your opinion, who should I pick with that core, between all the Commander/Operatives the Empire has :

530/800 (8 activations)

Corps:
- 3× Shoretroopers (52): T-21B Trooper (32) = 252
- 3× DF-90 Mortar Trooper (36) = 108

Supports:
- 2× Speeder Bikes (75): HQ Uplink (10) = 170

I would get Veers w/ Aggressive Tactics 90pts (binoculars if you want to be ridiculous-i think you may struggle keeping units in Spotter range to be effective)

140 Iden w/ D1O, Repeater, Hunter, Off Push which you can switch for DucknCover depending on terrain or whatever you need. Try her out like that i think you'll lover her.

Do you have any sniper teams?

At 90+140 you still have 40pts to play with.

I think squeezing a sniper would be good or I've played with a medical droid or imperial officer upgrade as well.

1 hour ago, buckero0 said:

I would get Veers w/ Aggressive Tactics 90pts (binoculars if you want to be ridiculous-i think you may struggle keeping units in Spotter range to be effective)

140 Iden w/ D1O, Repeater, Hunter, Off Push which you can switch for DucknCover depending on terrain or whatever you need. Try her out like that i think you'll lover her.

Do you have any sniper teams?

At 90+140 you still have 40pts to play with.

I think squeezing a sniper would be good or I've played with a medical droid or imperial officer upgrade as well.

Thank you for your suggestions, yes I have 3 sniper teams, if I include one, that will give me a 11 activations list, with 5 different command tokens (because Iden will probably infiltrate and become an operative) .

793/800 (11 activations)

Commanders:
- General Veers (80): Aggressive Tactics (10) = 90
- Iden Versio (100): Hunter (6), Offensive Push (4), TL-50 Repeater (15) = 125

Corps:
- 3× Shoretroopers (52): T-21B Trooper (32) = 252
- 3× DF-90 Mortar Trooper (36) = 108

Special Forces:
- Strike Team (20): DLT-19x Sniper (28) = 48

Supports:
- 2× Speeder Bikes (75): HQ Uplink (10) = 170

•Maximum Firepower, •Pulse Scan, ••Evasive Maneuvers, ••Concussive Blast, •••Imperial Discipline, •••Coordinated Fire, ••••Standing Orders

OR

798/800 (10 activations)

Commanders:
- General Veers (80): Aggressive Tactics (10) = 90
- Iden Versio (100) + ID10 (15): Hunter (6), Offensive Push (4), TL-50 Repeater (15) = 140

Corps:
- Shoretroopers (52): T-21B Trooper (32) = 84
- 2× Shoretroopers (52): T-21B Trooper (32), Medical Droid (19) = 206
- 3× DF-90 Mortar Trooper (36) = 108

Supports:
- 2× Speeder Bikes (75): HQ Uplink (10) = 170

•Maximum Firepower, •Pulse Scan, ••Evasive Maneuvers, ••Concussive Blast, •••Imperial Discipline, •••Coordinated Fire, ••••Standing Orders

I'd try both. I thought Iden would be nice as an operative, but I really prefer her Courage as a commander. I find that Recon Intel is 'good enough' for most cases instead of infiltrate.

On 4/6/2020 at 6:07 PM, arnoldrew said:

That's 9 activations with 5 different types of command tokens. Acitvation control is going to be a *****.

I am new to the game. Why is this a problem?

24 minutes ago, Andyf1702 said:

I am new to the game. Why is this a problem?

Because you'll be drawing from the bag a lot and have basically no choice as to what will activate when. If you have a bag with 1 Support and 6 Corps tokens, you can be pretty sure you are going to draw a Corps token and can formulate a strategy around that. If your bag has 2 Corps, 1 Commander, 1 Operative, 2 Special Forces, and 1 Support token, you have no idea what you're going to be drawing and will just be forced to do whatever is the best option you can do with whatever you draw. Being able to activate what you need when you need it is very important in Legion.