Came up with this fleet.  Basically would want to run the fleet at max speed and use Jerjerrod's ability to make turns that normally these ships couldn't do. Put engine techs on the Harrow and Demolisher to make them even more maneuverable.

Jerrys Kids



Author: mj10982

Faction: Empire

Commander: Moff Jerjerrod



Assault Objective: None

Defense Objective: None

Navigation Objective: None



Gladiator I-Class Star Destroyer (56)

- Demolisher (10)

- Admiral Montferrat (5)

- Rapid Reload (8)

- Engine Techs (8)

- Ordnance Experts (4)

= 91 points



Arquitens-Class Light Cruiser (54)

- Hand of Justice (4)

- Early Warning System (7)

- Captain Needa (2)

- Turbolaser Reroute Circuits (7)

= 74 points



[flagship] Victory I-Class Star Destroyer (73)

- Moff Jerjerrod (23)

- Harrow (3)

- Captain Brunson (5)

- Expanded Launchers (13)

- Engine Techs (8)

- XI7 Turbolasers (6)

- Ordnance Experts (4)

= 135 points



Gozanti-Class Cruisers (23)

- Suppressor (4)

- Electronic Countermeasures (7)

- Slicer Tools (7)

- Expanded Hangar Bay (5)

- Minister Tua (2)

= 48 points



1 "Mauler" Mithel (15)

1 Ciena Ree (17)

1 Valen Rudor (13)

= 45 points

Lets trim some fat

GSD you could drop ETs. Brunson is good here but you have him on the flagship so Montferrat is fine. SFO if desperate for points. Swap EX launchers for ACM, APT or E-Rax. I prefer ACMs.

Arquitens, hand of Justice can go. the small fire arcs make EWS often useless as the enemy get a choice of hull zones to target. RBDs make sense or just keep it cheap with Needa & TRC.

flotilla is pricy but a great design. Drop expanded hangar as you won't have three fighters for long and the VSD could do the initial "get stuck in" squadron command on turn 2.

flagship. E-rax or ACMs to save points. If you go for ACMs here and on Demolisher change the XI7s for QBTs or LTT or XX9s.

With all the point savings above you can get some rogues or Intel (to keep mauler ramming) or even change Harrow for a Kuat with ECM OE & E-Rax.

supprise attack/most wanted.

Contested outpost/Planetary ion cannon.

Salvage run/ Solar corona.

3 hours ago, Mad Cat said:

Lets trim some fat

GSD you could drop ETs. Brunson is good here but you have him on the flagship so Montferrat is fine. SFO if desperate for points. Swap EX launchers for ACM, APT or E-Rax. I prefer ACMs.

Arquitens, hand of Justice can go. the small fire arcs make EWS often useless as the enemy get a choice of hull zones to target. RBDs make sense or just keep it cheap with Needa & TRC.

flotilla is pricy but a great design. Drop expanded hangar as you won't have three fighters for long and the VSD could do the initial "get stuck in" squadron command on turn 2.

flagship. E-rax or ACMs to save points. If you go for ACMs here and on Demolisher change the XI7s for QBTs or LTT or XX9s.

With all the point savings above you can get some rogues or Intel (to keep mauler ramming) or even change Harrow for a Kuat with ECM OE & E-Rax.

supprise attack/most wanted.

Contested outpost/Planetary ion cannon.

Salvage run/ Solar corona.

You could also use the point savings for an increased bid; if you have this many points invested in black-die killers like a VSD-I Harrow and Demolisher, you want to get last activation, then go first and blow them away. I’d aim for a bid of 15 points, at least.

Switched the Harrow for a Kuat Relentless. Should I drop the Gozanti totally and beef up the other three ships?  Ive only got a 3 point bid.


Jerrys Kids



Author: mj10982

Faction: Empire

Commander: Moff Jerjerrod



Assault Objective: None

Defense Objective: None

Navigation Objective: None



Gladiator I-Class Star Destroyer (56)

- Demolisher (10)

- Admiral Montferrat (5)

- Rapid Reload (8)

- Ordnance Experts (4)

= 83 points



Arquitens-Class Light Cruiser (54)

- Captain Needa (2)

- Turbolaser Reroute Circuits (7)

= 63 points



Gozanti-Class Cruisers (23)

- Suppressor (4)

- Electronic Countermeasures (7)

- Slicer Tools (7)

- Minister Tua (2)

= 43 points



[flagship] Imperial Star Destroyer Kuat Refit (112)

- Moff Jerjerrod (23)

- Relentless (3)

- Reinforced Blast Doors (5)

- Leading Shots (4)

- Captain Brunson (5)

- Assault Concussion Missiles (7)

- Local Fire Control (4)

= 163 points



1 "Mauler" Mithel (15)

1 Ciena Ree (17)

1 Valen Rudor (13)

= 45 points

13 hours ago, Mj10982 said:

Switched the Harrow for a Kuat Relentless. Should I drop the Gozanti totally and beef up the other three ships?  Ive only got a 3 point bid.


Jerrys Kids



Author: mj10982

Faction: Empire

Commander: Moff Jerjerrod



Assault Objective: None

Defense Objective: None

Navigation Objective: None



Gladiator I-Class Star Destroyer (56)

- Demolisher (10)

- Admiral Montferrat (5)

- Rapid Reload (8)

- Ordnance Experts (4)

= 83 points



Arquitens-Class Light Cruiser (54)

- Captain Needa (2)

- Turbolaser Reroute Circuits (7)

= 63 points



Gozanti-Class Cruisers (23)

- Suppressor (4)

- Electronic Countermeasures (7)

- Slicer Tools (7)

- Minister Tua (2)

= 43 points



[flagship] Imperial Star Destroyer Kuat Refit (112)

- Moff Jerjerrod (23)

- Relentless (3)

- Reinforced Blast Doors (5)

- Leading Shots (4)

- Captain Brunson (5)

- Assault Concussion Missiles (7)

- Local Fire Control (4)

= 163 points



1 "Mauler" Mithel (15)

1 Ciena Ree (17)

1 Valen Rudor (13)

= 45 points

I think you’re moving in the wrong direction. Go back to Harrow, and INCREASE your bid.

I don’t know how much experience you have flying black-dice equipped knife-fighters, but the Empire has a lot of them, ranging in size from the Kuat Refit ISD, down through the VSD-I, GSD, and Raider-I. The Rebels have a few as well, including the MC-75 Ordnance Cruiser, the MC-30, and Hammerhead Torpedo Corvette.

Black die ships can be fantastically powerful. The dice are the most damaging in the game, and the critical hit effects and other upgrades that you can put in the Ordnance upgrade slot are amazingly potent. The problem is that it can often be very difficult to actually fire meaningful shots without a bid, and sometimes a decent number of activations as well.

With a low activation count (less than 4, say), your opponent will often just activate other ships, and wait you out until you’ve committed your close ranged brawler, then do everything in his power to jump over/around that guy and keep out of close range. It’s possible to set up killboxes that he cannot easily escape, but can be very very difficult.

These lists also tend to struggle with small initiative bids. Once you do manage to catch your opponent at close range of your VSD-I’s front arc, you NEED to be able to activate first and really nail him with ALL the guns. But if he’s first player, he just activated the endangered ship first, punches Harrow in the nose, and takes off for the hills. Again, if you’re a really great player, especially when it comes to maneuvering, you can mitigate this difficulty a bit as well. But going in with a bid of 3 points is making your own life incredibly hard.

See if you can get a list going with 4-5 activations and a 13-15 point bid, and you’ll really see some value in the black-die brawlers.

I cut down to a 15 point bid and even kept some of the upgrades I had originally.  

  

Jerrys Kids



Author: mj10982

Faction: Empire

Commander: Moff Jerjerrod



Assault Objective: None

Defense Objective: None

Navigation Objective: None



Gladiator I-Class Star Destroyer (56)

- Demolisher (10)

- Admiral Montferrat (5)

- Assault Concussion Missiles (7)

- Engine Techs (8)

- Ordnance Experts (4)

= 90 points



Arquitens-Class Light Cruiser (54)

- Reinforced Blast Doors (5)

- Captain Needa (2)

- Turbolaser Reroute Circuits (7)

= 68 points



[flagship] Victory I-Class Star Destroyer (73)

- Moff Jerjerrod (23)

- Harrow (3)

- Captain Brunson (5)

- Assault Concussion Missiles (7)

- Engine Techs (8)

- Spinal Armament (9)

- Gunnery Chief Varnillian (6)

= 134 points



Gozanti-Class Cruisers (23)

- Suppressor (4)

- Electronic Countermeasures (7)

- Slicer Tools (7)

- Expanded Hangar Bay (5)

- Minister Tua (2)

= 48 points



1 "Mauler" Mithel (15)

1 Ciena Ree (17)

1 Valen Rudor (13)

= 45 points

Looks pretty good. I’d consider:

That’s an expensive VSD; I’d think about cutting some upgrades on the Gozanti (and probably Mauler or Valen) and swapping Harrow for a Kuat. The role is similar, but Electronic Countermeasures makes it much more durable against large dice pools, Leading Shots is cheap and effective, a boarding party is easy to make room for, and the larger base size is better at trapping and doesn’t need navs for speed 3 (to trigger Engine Techs.) It’s also eligible for Strategic Adviser to boost activation count, something black dice fleets appreciate.

Failing that, swapping Varnillian and Spinal for Ordnance Experts and Dual Turbolaser Turrets or LTTs could be smart. You often aren’t going to get many close range range shots, and Varnillian doesn’t help get that black crit for ACM. She also doesn’t do anything to fix blanks, just moves them around a little to hurt less. And for the Turbolaser, rerolls are almost as good as adding in a die, because of how likely a blank is.

Hope this helps, good luck!

My choices for your Harrow would be. - Linked Turbolaser Turrets instead of Spinal Armaments and Ordnance Experts.

I would agree with these guys, for the most part. I think the Harrow might be a cool way to go, but a Kuat Refit ISD with Stategic Advisor is also a strong choice. If you’re gonna go Harrow/VSD-I, I’d trim it down a lot. Spinals out, Linked Turbolaser Towers in. Varnillian out, Ordnance Experts in. Assault Concussion Missiles out, and go with Assault Proton Torpedoes, or even External Racks. Admiral Montferrat & Reinforced Blast Doors can both go.

So that saves you about 16 points. Let’s say you then cut Mauler. 31 points. Now, I really love the Suppressor Jerk Gozanti. Always have. But what if we cut that as well? Now you have 79 points to play with, and you still haven’t bitten into your 15 point bid. 79 points can get you a Raider-I with Ordnance Experts and ExRax, PLUS a Gozanti with Comms Net, or Officer Vader and a bunch of Skilled First Officers for him to choke on the other ships. It could buy you two mostly naked Gozantis with a couple more fighters. It’s even enough for a real warship, like a second GSD or Arquitens... and if you were really ruthless about shaving a few more points, it could even be an Arquitens AND a Gozanti.

I guess my point is, there’s still a bunch of fat to trim off this list that would really help to get rid of. The bones of it are good though, and I feel like it’s getting there!

The ECM Supressor is pretty obnoxious and a good carrier for a small squadron group. But I could get rid of that and sone upgrades and add a raider. Maybe a raider II with HIE with Corvus iden Versio and dcaps?

While adding a raider would help with anti-squadron, I'm hesitant on dropping Mithel because I"m worried about going up against a bomber fleet and getting overwhelmed.

Got a 13 point bid. Dropped the gozanti for a raider II Corvus. It might be expensive but its almost guaranteed to trigger HIE with the WBTs. I feel like four activations is pretty good for Imperials, no? Especially that all four are actual fighting ships and not a gozanti or strategic adviser.

Jerrys Kids



Author: mj10982

Faction: Empire

Commander: Moff Jerjerrod



Assault Objective: None

Defense Objective: None

Navigation Objective: None



Gladiator I-Class Star Destroyer (56)

- Demolisher (10)

- Admiral Montferrat (5)

- Assault Concussion Missiles (7)

- Ordnance Experts (4)

= 82 points



Arquitens-Class Light Cruiser (54)

- Captain Needa (2)

- Turbolaser Reroute Circuits (7)

= 63 points



[flagship] Victory I-Class Star Destroyer (73)

- Moff Jerjerrod (23)

- Harrow (3)

- Captain Brunson (5)

- Assault Concussion Missiles (7)

- Engine Techs (8)

- Linked Turbolaser Towers (7)

- Ordnance Experts (4)

= 130 points



Raider II-Class Corvette (48)

- Corvus (2)

- Heavy Ion Emplacements (9)

- Disposable Capacitors (3)

- Iden Versio (6)

- Weapons Battery Techs (5)

= 73 points



1 Ciena Ree (17)

1 Valen Rudor (13)

1 Black Squadron (9)

= 39 points

I definitely see the value of Suppressor, but as you say, four real combat ships is pretty good. As for Mithel, he certainly isn’t bad, but without a significant group of other squadrons, or tricks that allow him to continue moving, like Dengar, he loses a bit of punch. The simple fact is that any small coverage group is going to get overwhelmed. You just have to make the most of your speed bump squadrons while they last, and Mauler isn’t the most effective guy in that scenario.

Yeah Id like to test it out against a dedicated bomber fleet.

Just a couple of tweaks on that last list:

I'd move Jerry over to the raider: given the extra flexibility from the corvus title, it makes a certain amount of sense, also turns the vsd into a bit less of a points sink. I could see arguments for putting the admiral on either ship, but I think on balance he's better off on the corvus.

Speaking of the vsd... you could save an extra 2 points for the bid by swapping the linked turbolaser towers out for dual turbolaser turrets. The reroll effect comes out about the same on balance (it's more powerful than the one on ltt's, but you can't use it twice in a turn.) The only drawback (which I consider fairly minimal) is that you can't gun down single squadrons quite as well.

Rest of the ships & upgrades look good to me. Not sure if you need black squadron though. If you were going to run a 3rd squadron (I probably wouldn't) I might go with saber squadron.

(Reason being that black squadron is basically just a free kill for the enemy. Saber squadron at least can park outside of engagement range & snipe in - letting Valen & cienna have their synergy).