Well, first post ever.

Anyway, I'm currently helping a friend of mine to develop some houserules to allow players to play male sororitas. Sounds wierd I know, but we don't realy like to tell our players what they can and can't play.

We currently have this idea of calling the male sororitas "Frateris Brothers" (With Frateris Templar, Frateris Medicae and Frateris Ambasador as replacements for Militant, Hospitalier and Dialogus), named after the original armed forces of the Ecclisiarchy. But as they got disbanded in the lore and replaced by the Adepta Sororitas, we are still trying to come up with something diferent.

Essentaily, what we want is a new name for male sororitas, anyone has any ideas, or perhaps even an own set of ruels?

voresia said:

First, Sororitas is a Female order. Like a Sorority. A male "version" would be a cleric. After the Age of Apostasy (if I'm remembering right) the church was forbidden to keep "men under arms." So the Sororitas is their loophole for having any dedicated military force at all. Individual clerics might be armed, but they are not soldiers per se. While the idea is neat, it violates the background material.

Best bet might be to do an alternate career rank for the Cleric that fills one of those roles you're looking at. Or an assassin with a stronger than normal religious bent.

-=Brother Praetus=-

Brother Praetus said:

Yes, as the church was forbidden from keeping men under arms after the Age of Apostasy, and the Brides of the Emperor, an all female cult, was renamed the Adepta Sororitas, since they are not "Men at arms", being female an all.

We currently have a player who wants to play a Sororita, but he dosent like to play female characters. I dont realy like to bend the lore all to much, and I am currently trying to find another loophole to allow for a male counterpart for the Sororitas, but I cant realy find anything.

voresia said:

Well, if you don't want to break the lore why don't you simply try to find out what your friend likes about the SoB (Sisters of Battle) and then point out what other carrers offer the same choices. SoB are basically humans with a very strong religious bent that wear power armour and carry bolters... If its the gear that attracts your friend that it is easy for several other classes to use it. If it a specific skill or talent several other classes offer them I'm sure... If its the new Fait talent SoBs have access allow the player to buy it with another class as an Elite Advancement (possibly without charging him any extra XP).

If it has to be the SoB specific carrer path... Well, just give a different name. Maybe you can say that he is a cleric with a particular martial bent and that, as an "elite advancement", he trained different skills and that the faith talent is actually miracles granted to him by the Emperor (maybe if the character dies you can even canonize him and have eclesiastic NPCs talk about him in future adventures!

Drauggurth said:

Now this was a very good idea! Thank you my friend, im gonna talk this over with my fellow GM-to-be and hopefully, this solves that.

from france

remenber that some planet are eclesiarchy holding. so no men at arms no frateris militia , no male SoB (sister of batlle) but gang SoB (son of bi...) units, pdf unit (proudly devoted to female), ig units (inclunding guy) comming from the planet.

so no! no breach from the eclesiarchy on the imperium level. but yes on the planetary level.

Go for Cleric and have him buy the faith talents on the appropriate levels...worked for us...

Three words: Black Priest of Maccabius (or what ever that planet is called...). If that dosn't scratch the itch of being a male "sororitas", I don't know what will.

voresia said:

A Trap. A **** convincing one too, if he wants to live very long.

"Frateris Militia is the unofficial armies of the Ministorum. The religiously-motivated Frateris fight wars of faith against the enemies of the Imperium."

You could use the same rules as the Sororitas and claim he is simply a religion militia volunteer; if you want him to have the signature gear, say it is gifted or on loan from the Ecclesiarchy.

-Cynr

The Frateris Militia are only temporary forces, however. They aren't standing armies. I'd just say that the player would have to go with being a cleric, and could buy stuff as elite advances.

Have the pc do the Black Priest of Maccabeus alternate career and fill in the other faith talents as elite advances for say 200 to 300 xp a piece...

Not all Clerics are Ecclessiarchy priests, not all Techpriests are Ordained Priests Mechanicus, not all Guardsmen are members of the Imperial Guard, not all Arbitrators are of the Adeptus Arbites.

It's the archetype they represent, but it needn't be precisely that. Any sort of vaguely military-/highly-disciplined- religious order should do the trick as the 'Sororitas'. There's nothing about it, except the lore, which is absolutely necessary to being Adeptus Sororitas.

In my Tau Empire centred campaign, the Ethereal 'style' is well represented by the Sororitas career.

Saying that Career mandates Background is poor form in my esteem. It's a guide, but it needn't be an absolute thing.

Does anyone really feel or think differently?

Xisor said:

Patently untrue as far as Warhammer RPG is concerned. Your Career is who you are as well as what you do and how the people see you. It has been so since WFRP 1ed and it remains so throughout all incarnations of this system.

Feel free to house-rule it away, but please don't state this as a fact when it's not.

Morangias said:

To be fair, he's correct, and for most of the careers (Scum, Arbites, Guardsmen, etc) it states as such. They are just archetypes. My fiancee wanted to play a social assassin-esque character. Under your "rules", she'd have had to play an Assassin career and be happy with it. In reality however, and fully supported by the rules, she picked Scum, because the career fit her type of assassin better. Same with my bounty-hunter: I wanted him to be more of an investigative type. Your "rules" would mean I'd have to pick a Guardsman or a Scum for that, but I didn't, I picked the Arbitrator career instead.

So sorry, you are the one who is stating what is fact when it is not.

Examples:

DH Rulebook, p24 - "A career Path is a rough guideline to who you are, what you can do and your place in the Imperium."

DH Rulebook p43 - "the Career Paths ... are purposely broad in scope"

It even states that the careers given are only examples, because you are free to make your own careers if you wish to.

Don't have the book at the moment, but I am pretty sure it also gives various suggestions as to what the different careers could be. Such as a a "Guardsman" instead being a mercenary, a merchant bodyguard or something similar. Of course some careers are more difficult than others to change like this. If you are using the psycher career without actually being a sanctioned psycher you are by definition an unsanctioned psycher... probably not very popular with the other Acolytes

Um............... if it's possible. You could always run a campaign that's before or during the Age of Apostacy? Just an idea, but that way it doesn't conflict with the fluff, and just run with it from there?

It is true that the careers in DH are deliberately flexible and the titles are meant to be representative of the basic theme. So a "Guardsman" might be a PDF trooper, a Naval Armsman, a mercenary, a feral world thug or perhaps even a *gasp* Imperial Guardsman. BUT.... The Adepta Sororitas career is deliberately set aside as an "advanced players only" career that EXPRESSLY portrays a FEMALE member of the Adepta Sororitas. The setting is quite explicit for why this is! If the Ecclesiarchy even so much as entertained stray thoughts as to inducting males into their "Chamber Militant" the wrath of the entire Inquisition, not to mention the High Lords of Terra would rain down on their collective heads like an Emperor class Titan on infantry! The Imperium does not coddle those who are different and offer them therapy, understanding and a lovely greeting card... It beats them into line with a hammer until uniform or broken: the results are less important than the process after all!

Point your friend at the Guardsman, Arbitrator or Cleric careers and make sure he realizes that they can train in chainswords, flamers and bolt weapons too. Simply roleplay the character as being particularly devout. Maybe consider taking the Schola Progenium origin? Or perhaps he can try playing a female on for size? I seriously doubt it will kill him or make him any less macho for the experience.

ZillaPrime said:

What about a small group that is similar to the Sororitas except for two major points:

1 - They have male members, possibly even a fully male group.

2 - Their ties with the Ecclesiarcy are much weaker than the Sororitas.

Different planets worship the emperor differently, so I can't see any reason as to why such a group couldn't exist. They wouldn't have armed forces the Ecclesiarchy could call upon, so they shouldn't cause problems there. The differences in wealth between this group and the Sororitas could easily be dealt with by the Inquisitor providing gear for the member he recruited (maybe the whole group is one of his projects).

There's the problem that if the Ecclesiarcy exists on the planet at ALL, they must follow the treaty that states they may have no Men At Arms. The ENTIRE REASON BEHIND THE SISTERS.

Kylen said:

True, the Ecclesiarcy can't have men at arms. But this group is not a military force belonging to the ecclesiarchy . It's just a militant group that worships the emperor.

The only difference between this hypothetical group and a death cult is that death cults worship the emperor through killing. Are you saying that all death cults are forbidden ?

Bilateralrope said:

Depends on who you ask. Some view death cults as uncontrolled loose cannons which should be expunged; while others view them as useful tools.

Though, I just realized a way to work around the "no men under arms" thingy. Make your Order a Crusader House, like those described in Ascension . They are predominantly independent with ties to other organizations via action alliances, treaties and contracts. Even the Ecclesiarchy can make use of a few Crusaders without overtly violating the treaty. After all, they aren't "maintaining" them, merely "employing" them.

-=Brother Praetus=-

So we are essentially back to the common sense approach of "make a Cleric, Guardsman or whatever, buy every bolt, chain, flame and melta weapon training talent that you can lay your hands on and make sure to make loud proclamations of faith and intolerance of stupid things."

All this is is a rehash of the retardedly over-long "Why can't my Space Marine be a girl?!" threads on the Deathwatch forum.

BECAUSE THEY CAN'T!

This is for the same reason that you won't be importing droids from Star Wars into the 40K universe... The game-lore conflicts far too strongly! Thinking machines are an affront to the Omnissiah and must be purged at once! The genetic modifications undergone by Astartes candidates is universally fatal for females, and indeed even for males with genetic incompatabilities: They die horrific and excruciating deaths! The Ecclesiarchy is forbidden by uncompromising and ancient decrees to have "MEN at arms" (at the pain of threatened extermination!) and thus even the most radical of clergy will abjectly refuse to raise a standing army that maintains a single male member.

"But surely the Imperial government can be reasoned with?"

THOUGHT BEGETS HERESY! HERESY BEGETS RETRIBUTION!

Think about it.... But not TOO hard.

Easist way to do this would probably be to play a Black Priest of Maccbeus Quintus, or just allow a cleric or guardsmen access to Faith talents, the Guardsmen career looks very similar to the sororitas one even...

Call it a Crusader, or missionary, an individual who has taken it upon himself to fight for the good of the Ecclesiarchy and isn't a formal militia