46 minutes ago, KCDodger said:Geez some of you guys are really frakking mean.
Anyway, @Blail Blerg Try my list. x5 Grey Squadron bombers with Ion (Rear only! Don't move it!!!) + Proton Bombs. Please, give my boys and girls a shot. I think you'll be pleasantly surprised- and I want to hear what you think about it.
Ok, for friendship I'll do it. haha
really never move it? lol. my opponents might not fly like yours.
3 hours ago, Blail Blerg said:Ok, for friendship I'll do it. haha
really never move it? lol. my opponents might not fly like yours.
Ask yourself this. Is rotate EVER worth it over Focus, TL, or even a Barrel Roll?
At the risk of contributing to the original post, seismic charges are three points for two charges so, to me, even if one charge does one damage to one enemy ship you are coming out ahead. Even the cheapest ships are 5 to 7 points per hit point ( most bombs are less per charge than the target per hit point, cluster bombs 8 points WTF i bet this comes down ) As for the argument about guns being better, dropping a device is in addition to shooting. As for not having an opportunity, I don’t know. Anecdotaly I always have an opportunity, maybe not three opportunities. The trick is remembering to do it.
personally, I like bombs/mines, but I think they loose value when spammed (not always enough opportunities). Perhaps I am not considering the cost of the bomber correctly.....
3 hours ago, Stay OT Leader said:But the not-stupid became not-stupid by listening to people who said he was stupid. The stupid remain stupid by complaining about being called stupid.
There is ego in play here but it’s not mine.
There is truth hidden behind the lack of civility here, unfortunately due to the rudeness of your point people will ignore the hidden wisdom. Maybe try "a fool finds learning by listening to the learned, but remains the fool if he refuses to listen."
I am a huge fan of using bombs. Like many others have stated, their value lies almost more in area denial than in the damage they do. I admit I love it when a bomb is perfectly placed and hits 2-3 ships, or an ace lands directly on it and cannot get out of range. The fact that people will do ridiculous maneuvers just to avoid that 1 point of damage from a bomb leaves a huge window of opportunity. If you can capitalize on other people's mistakes, and can reasonably predict they will make a mistake, that is worth the 5-6 points to me. Nym and Emon make an amazing team for area control and is one of my favorite lists to fly.
QuoteWhen are bombs ever truly worth their value?
When you have two rounds of 2 of your opponent's 3 ships unable to avoid eating 2 bomblets each round 😄
TrajSim Bomblet Paige can be brutal if your opponent can't avoid the double bomblet launch, and the StarFortress in general is the tankiest ride for Holdo and her new cloak passing shenanigans the Fireball has enabled. If you haven't used Holdo on a StarFortress, you might want to try it. Reloading and shooting in the same turn, shedding stress to remain in place and being cloaked until just before your turn to shoot is fun.
1 hour ago, KCDodger said:Ask yourself this. Is rotate EVER worth it over Focus, TL, or even a Barrel Roll?
Yes sometimes. If it gets a shot and I don’t have to constantly rotate back.
The only thing I could ever post on this thread:
Better than it looks, but unfortunately not hyperspace:
Scimitar Squadron Pilot (27)
Proton Bombs (5)
Delayed Fuses (1)
Scimitar Squadron Pilot (27)
Proton Bombs (5)
Delayed Fuses (1)
Scimitar Squadron Pilot (27)
Proton Bombs (5)
Delayed Fuses (1)
Scimitar Squadron Pilot (27)
Proton Bombs (5)
Delayed Fuses (1)
Scimitar Squadron Pilot (27)
Proton Bombs (5)
Delayed Fuses (1)
Scimitar Squadron Pilot (27)
Proton Bombs (5)
Delayed Fuses (1)
Total: 198
View in Yet Another Squad Builder 2.0:
https://raithos.github.io/?f=Galactic Empire&d=v8ZsZ200Z208XWWWW69WW236Y208XWWWW69WW236Y208XWWWW69WW236Y208XWWWW69WW236Y208XWWWW69WW236Y208XWWWW69WW236&sn=Better Than It Looks%2C But Unfortunately Not Hyperspace&obs=
Feel free to exchange any Protons for Proxys, but I like guaranteed crits, reloadable bombs, and huge multi-ship area denial so YMMV. Kills anything slow super easy, and 6 2-primaries is enough to push whatever extra damage you can and/or force focus-saving for defense, thus keeping your bombers alive longer.
Super susceptible to bad crit trains though.
Edited by ClassicalMoser3 hours ago, BenDay said:At the risk of contributing to the original post, seismic charges are three points for two charges so, to me, even if one charge does one damage to one enemy ship you are coming out ahead. Even the cheapest ships are 5 to 7 points per hit point ( most bombs are less per charge than the target per hit point, cluster bombs 8 points WTF i bet this comes down ) As for the argument about guns being better, dropping a device is in addition to shooting. As for not having an opportunity, I don’t know. Anecdotaly I always have an opportunity, maybe not three opportunities. The trick is remembering to do it.
personally, I like bombs/mines, but I think they loose value when spammed (not always enough opportunities). Perhaps I am not considering the cost of the bomber correctly.....
Oh dude, no, bombs are at their absolute top when spammed. That's just MORE unavoidable damage.
1 hour ago, Blail Blerg said:Yes sometimes. If it gets a shot and I don’t have to constantly rotate back.
Perhaps, but I use those times to get a TL or Focus. I'm fine with not having a shot, because chances are my bomb's covering that already.
6 minutes ago, KCDodger said:Perhaps, but I use those times to get a TL or Focus. I'm fine with not having a shot, because chances are my bomb's covering that already.
I’ll try it and see
4 minutes ago, Blail Blerg said:I’ll try it and see
Good luck Blail. I expect to hear good things from my personal favorite squad.
On 2/17/2020 at 7:12 PM, Blail Blerg said:There is a lot of vitriol and hate for me and my skills for people who’ve never met me in this thread. Very surprising. And not welcome.
yeah theres a couple people you'll see go personal every time you post regardless of your point. Sadly they dont seem to be going anywhere
On 2/17/2020 at 6:19 PM, Blail Blerg said:Can you point me to where this has been useful? I find Tie Bombers die to anything. And they REALLY don't like crits. And cost enough that we're making some sort of trade away in list building.
I was referring mostly to Ks/Ys/punishers/sprays etc. TIE Barrage Rockets don't even have shields!
Edited by ficklegreendice
Psa to everyone in this thread:
Big words =/= Big brains.
I know you all feel like mama's little genius when you engage yourself in Socratic discourse relating to the physiological symptoms of uncouth or afornting behavior, or simply debating the fundamental unreliability or lack thereof of the upgrade category classified as "devices" in the tabletop entertainment apparatus known as X-wing Miniatures, but all it does is make you look insecure or annoying
I mean, I can understand where the OP is coming from. Bombs are never really 100% a sure thing when you bring them. And when you can't count on getting the situations where they are worth it all the time, it can definitely lead to either or type decisions in deckbuilding. I've seen enough that the bombs make things... interesting for the opponent in recent games that I do think they can be worthwhile inclusions. Even if not spammed.
3 hours ago, Roller of blanks said:Psa to everyone in this thread:
Big words =/= Big brains.
Socratic discourse relating physiological symptoms uncouth afornting behavior, debating fundamental unreliability thereof upgrade category classified tabletop entertainment apparatus insecure annoying
Ah, irony.
But man rude.
Rude bad.
3 hours ago, Roller of blanks said:Psa to everyone in this thread:
Big words =/= Big brains.
I know you all feel like mama's little genius when you engage yourself in Socratic discourse relating to the physiological symptoms of uncouth or afornting behavior, or simply debating the fundamental unreliability or lack thereof of the upgrade category classified as "devices" in the tabletop entertainment apparatus known as X-wing Miniatures, but all it does is make you look insecure or annoying
To be fair, not all of us are native speakers. That leads to a limited vocabulary, the use of very similar sounding words that might be perfectly normal in the native language, or simply a misunderstanding about how fancy or common certain words are.
On 2/18/2020 at 2:53 AM, asterborn said:Bombs don't give any points in Aces High, since points are only scored by attacking. Unless you play with house-rules
And I hate that so much that I'm willing to derail a thread.
Aces High really should award points for first opponent damage done, and final opponent damage done.
As written too many dumb loop-holes to deny points both for the 1st point and the final point.
Ok, so to get back on topic.
I struggle to get bombs to work. But mines I like.
I remember the dark days of nymiranda, bombs are terribly effective and the only thing stopping that coming back is the current high points cost.
I like to take a proton bomb in my scum lists because I invariably run either a firespray or hwk, and you can force opponents to worry about pressing home attacks and therefore making suboptimal moves at the risk of a crit. It's often good to never drop the thing and use it psychologically!
13 hours ago, Stay OT Leader said:I disagree with all of that, but it’s a philosophical thing so we’re unlikely to find much common ground there.
So you feel it's ok to be rude during a discussion if you think it will bring your opponent around to your way of thinking?
You don't think that a tirade directed at the person you disagree with, will cause him to ignore you? And you don't think rudeness is a sign of immaturity?
I'd like to know if you behave like this in a face to face debate.
I don’t think anything will bring Blail round. He’s here to lecture not listen.
And yes I do it face to face because that’s how adults talk to each other in the real world.
17 hours ago, KCDodger said:Oh dude, no, bombs are at their absolute top when spammed. That's just MORE unavoidable damage.
But how often do you have charges left or bombs that did nothing. For me spamming is used to exaggerates imbalances, but bombs seem balanced so should be used purposefully
Value is everywhere and it can be created on everything. So yes!
9 hours ago, Stay OT Leader said:And yes I do it face to face because that’s how adults talk to each other in the real world.
Adults? Really? Seems more or less the reverse of my experience.
Wow.
You seem like exactly the type of person I wouldn't enjoy conversing with. Like most people that communicate online more than they do in person, I usually agree with what you have to say, but I almost never appreciate the way you deliver it.
Also, can this thread die already? It's making me sad.