In case anyone's interested in the odds of Norra (ARC) carrying C-3PO, here's a google doc .

(Also let me know if my odds are wrong; I tried but I'm not trained in this, hah!)

These calculations assume:
1) we are at range 1 of a foe, triggering Norra's ability
2) we start with a calculate token and spend it on C-3PO (possibly having a 2nd token left for dice mods -- see rows)
3) C-3PO always guesses "1", as there's little benefit to a different guess except in some very rare edge cases

I only calculated for 1 or 2 dice, since calculating 3 was more work than it was worth with my primitive, untrained methods. At the end I also compare to the average evades if we had only 1 calculate token and didn't spend it on 3PO. Looks like 3PO is going to be better.

I was up until 1:30 calculating this dumb stuff. I don't quite know why, I just found it interesting. I watched a video on youtube about whether the rebellion should have used ARC-170s instead of T-65s (short answer: no), which got me thinking about retrying a norra list, which got me wondering about those odds, which led to me getting 1.5 hours less sleep than is probably optimal. Hopefully my sleepy odds are not dead wrong, then. Now my not-tired brain tells me someone's probably already done this in far greater detail. Thanks brain.

The answer is; 3,720 to 1

Always tell me the odds!

I like that you're trying Norra.

I just find the mid init, med base non maneuverable named pilots kind of odd. like sitting duck platforms.

16 hours ago, Blail Blerg said:

I like that you're trying Norra.

I just find the mid init, med base non maneuverable named pilots kind of odd. like sitting duck platforms.

Norra might be good solely because of the durability from her ability allowing her to get in the scrum and just start messing some fools up-her job is to start the slapfight and be a big fat problem. She does lack maneuverability, but Expert Handling is an option unless you're using intimidation to support the rest of your squad while she gets in the mess. Veteran Tail Gunner can help you to grab some extra value out of your double arcs in the messy dogfights where she excels, but I wouldn't fatten her up too much since she can burn quite quickly if caught out.

hey Wazat have ya tried Lando Calrisian in the copilot seat with Nora cause he looks to really be both an offensive and defensive boon

18 hours ago, Blail Blerg said:

I like that you're trying Norra.

I just find the mid init, med base non maneuverable named pilots kind of odd. like sitting duck platforms.

At init 5 she's not quite mid init. She's a chunky "ace", but I agree that her poor reposition (red barrel roll) and medium base isn't doing her any favors in that area. Compared to Thane, for example, she's not nearly as mobile.

But I do like that Norra offers absurd damage absorption. When I've fought her in the past, if I didn't kill her early, I often couldn't kill her later because I just couldn't push damage past her defenses in time. And it's often hard to isolate her outside of range 1, especially if she out-inits your ships, or is blocking well. But even focus-firing her early, she soaks a lot of that damage without breaking a sweat, which wastes those crucial early rounds.

So in an ideal scenario, it's a tough choice. In reality she often gets rapidly murdered because Jedi dice are so consistent and they're so mobile, but there's at least potential there to tank like crazy. Pair her with Wedge and one or two other solid attackers or beef ships and that seems like a reasonable start to a team (e.g. like this or this ).

I like the idea of giving her intimidation since blocking becomes extra effective, and Norra definitely wants to be in the tussle as much as possible. I also considered Expert Handling just to be able to roll wherever she needs to be (blocking or range 1) and use her init well... but if I'm including 3PO then they usually fight over her single action. 3PO's presence only becomes meaningful if she's calculating, and I don't think adding a coordination ally simply for Norra's sake is a good plan. We need to work with that limited action economy.

I figure I want to fly her with Wedge (probably?), but I'm not sure of the other ally. Two generic T-65s barely fit to create a 4-ship list, or maybe Thane or Luke to spend more points on each ship? Or maybe Norra-Thane-Luke for all 5s.

23 hours ago, Wazat said:

Pair her with Wedge and one or two other solid attackers or beef ships and that seems like a reasonable start to a team (e.g. like this or this ).

Goes against the initial intent of the post, but when I've used Norra I find, while a solid piece, she has bumped frequently and I don't think she'll get the calculates long enough for our shiny friend to do much extra good. Based on the Norra/Wedge/B/B suggestion, I'd drop 3P0 and upgrade both the B-Wings to I3 and give them Selfless. With those 2 riding shotgun Norra becomes really tough to kill, and Wedge is still there as your ace hunter.

Or perhaps even just run 1x Selfless so the other 3 pilots all get Crack Shot - that seems solid.

Lately a mate of mine has been running Norra+C3PO+ Stealth Device which is a huge pain in the neck. Guessing 1 with C-3PO is pretty easy with an extra green dice. Even once you crack the stealth device, you basically have to stay outside range 1 in order to push damage through.

Just now, Rettere said:

Lately a mate of mine has been running Norra+C3PO+ Stealth Device which is a huge pain in the neck. Guessing 1 with C-3PO is pretty easy with an extra green dice. Even once you crack the stealth device, you basically have to stay outside range 1 in order to push damage through.

Huh, that's a neat idea. If Norra could run Heroic she'd be unstoppable.

I'll consider SD, since it's pretty cheap and could add a few rounds of extra havoc. I think Norra's main challenge is the approach to get into the relative safety of range 1. That's where SD is most vulnerable.

So any luck with the duck?

I tried stuff 3 Rebel Arcs with Force crew. meh.

They're overcosted. Such is I3 I4

On 1/28/2020 at 11:49 PM, Blail Blerg said:

I like that you're trying Norra.

I just find the mid init, med base non maneuverable named pilots kind of odd. like sitting duck platforms.

Norra on her own isn't great.

Norra paired with Luke and Wedge? You start forcing ugly target priority calls on your opponent. Luke and Norra pair up, while Wedge deploys seperately and pushes down a flank. Now, should your opponent make for Luke & Norra, they're facing two very durable pilots (you hurl Norra at the enemy like a brick through a window to guarantee her free evade), both of whom can hit very hard up close and aren't worried about holding tokens for the defence. Should they decide to make for Wedge, he turns and runs while Norra and Luke pursue. Flown well, it can do very good work.

any sort of weird ase 3 rebel list without 3 green dice is just asking to be spanked.

theres neither enough firepower nor enough defense in a list like that.

And if I'm any reasonable player, I'm gonna keep away from Norra while gunning for Wedge.

Surprise surprise again, its not a hard call, its only a feint, and i see thru the lies of jedi.

-------

this is a customary reminder psa that "hard priority choices" are usually only traps for worse players than oneself. They don't work, and they make me laugh at people after they try them.

7 hours ago, Blail Blerg said:

any sort of weird ase 3 rebel list without 3 green dice is just asking to be spanked.

theres neither enough firepower nor enough defense in a list like that.

And if I'm any reasonable player, I'm gonna keep away from Norra while gunning for Wedge.

Surprise surprise again, its not a hard call, its only a feint, and i see thru the lies of jedi.

-------

this is a customary reminder psa that "hard priority choices" are usually only traps for worse players than oneself. They don't work, and they make me laugh at people after they try them.

There is so much smug condescension and rudeness in this post... You absolutely could have worded that more respectfully.

Maybe but I’m very tired of that list building strategy cuz it doesn’t work.

First off - @Wazat - always enjoy your posts, thank you! Also, assume that it's you that does so much work on the wiki? If so, a huge thank you for that.

@Blail Blerg I want to engage on the idea that

1 hour ago, Wazat said:

"hard priority choices" are usually only traps for worse players than oneself

but rather than distract from this topic (Nora / 3PO odds) I've started a thread here .

33 minutes ago, eljms said:

Also, assume that it's you that does so much work on the wiki? If so, a huge thank you for that.

Yup that's me, along with Nspace and other awesome people who frequently contribute. Hopefully I've been helpful!

And we're always happy to have new contributors join and help out!

I just had a thought for Norra...

Defensively, she's Boba Fett. No kidding, that's how it works out mathematically. She lacks Boba's mobility (add the slightly-cheaper Expert Handling?), and his offensive potential. If ignored, Norra is just a 3-red single-mod shot. Pretty meh.

So what's the best way to give her offensive punch? I'm almost thinking K-2SO. He's as cheap as any other option, which is good. That'll let her Lock/Calculate, which starts to add up in terms of damage, and it lets her also support the rest of her squad, too. If her tossing a Calc to Wedge allows him to barrel roll more and get out of arc, maybe she actually becomes a tempting target.

On 2/1/2020 at 6:53 AM, theBitterFig said:

I just had a thought for Norra...

Defensively, she's Boba Fett. No kidding, that's how it works out mathematically. She lacks Boba's mobility (add the slightly-cheaper Expert Handling?), and his offensive potential. If ignored, Norra is just a 3-red single-mod shot. Pretty meh.

So what's the best way to give her offensive punch? I'm almost thinking K-2SO. He's as cheap as any other option, which is good. That'll let her Lock/Calculate, which starts to add up in terms of damage, and it lets her also support the rest of her squad, too. If her tossing a Calc to Wedge allows him to barrel roll more and get out of arc, maybe she actually becomes a tempting target.

Interesting... she could even Jam in a pinch to stop a missile shot. And the fact that K-2SO's assist is action-free is extremely handy for her; she has unimpressive action economy and will bump a lot.

But yea, the lack of offense is her main problem. She's way cheaper than Boba's base cost for good reason, and it sounds like running her almost naked is better than loading her heavy. K-2SO takes her to 63 points. She could use some offensive mods, but I don't think it would be wise to spend points giving her a force point with Ezra Gunner.

1 hour ago, Wazat said:

Interesting... she could even Jam in a pinch to stop a missile shot. And the fact that K-2SO's assist is action-free is extremely handy for her; she has unimpressive action economy and will bump a lot.

But yea, the lack of offense is her main problem. She's way cheaper than Boba's base cost for good reason, and it sounds like running her almost naked is better than loading her heavy. K-2SO takes her to 63 points. She could use some offensive mods, but I don't think it would be wise to spend points giving her a force point with Ezra Gunner.

Yeah, Ezra's really expensive. Even Kanan is, too. K-2SO is a lot cheaper, and pretty flexible.

Getting some K-2SO on the table, one thing he does well is pre-load a token onto someone who has a decent chance to get blocked. Norra in the scrum is probably one of those ships. I know Lando + K-2SO get paired a lot, and I'm mixed, since I think Lando's ability to leverage his boost without Engine Upgrade is a big strength of his, Lando is another ship which is wicked easy to block, and having K-2SO to ensure you've got at least a Calculate is handy.

And the way you can just chuck the token over to someone else feels good.