2 minutes ago, jocke01 said:

Points is one way yes. I think the thing you should attack is coms relay on the mortar and mk2. The coordinate + free give away order combined with triggers and aggressive tactics is a bit too powerful compared to other Corps units in the factions. As well as removing the point of order tokens and command cards since you get almost full control of all units.

Errata either the coms slot on those units or just require coms relay to be on a unit with 2 or more models. I think that will help drop the power of shoreline and the rebel (allbeit weaker) variant. Maybe give a point increase on the t21-b as well, since it's extremly more powerful than other imperial guns.

On your point on the keyword. Getting a free aim is way more powerful than a dodge these days, espechially combined with targeting scopes and aggressive tactics.

The Comms Relay is the bigger problem, imo. The aim isn't good, either, but I think all the Comms shenanigans are just ridiculous

10 minutes ago, Darth evil said:

What can you really do about Shoretroopers? You can't take away their surges because they have none, you can't take either keywords away because if you do then Veterans would require the same treatment, all your left with is points. And they are already 2 points more per model than Stormtroopers, maybe you can go to 3 points but at 4 the unit becomes unplayable imo.My gut says the T-21b will lose range 4

I feel like the issue is more with the ability to get orders consistently, which stems from the mortar's ability to move orders from Comm Relay. A fix could be "Coordination orders don't issue orders" or something

Perhaps adding "non emplacement trooper" to Comms Relay so that they can't use this upgrade but can still use Linked Targeting Array

An errata to Comms Relay that only allowed orders issued from a commander or operative to be relayed could work, I think. So it would read:

"When you would be issued an order by a friendly Commander or Operative , you may choose a friendly unit at range 1-2. Issue an order to the chosen unit instead."

47 minutes ago, PalpShuttle said:

I feel like the issue is more with the ability to get orders consistently, which stems from the mortar's ability to move orders from Comm Relay. A fix could be "Coordination orders don't issue orders" or something

30 minutes ago, Lochlan said:

An errata to Comms Relay that only allowed orders issued from a commander or operative to be relayed could work, I think. So it would read:

"When you would be issued an order by a friendly Commander or Operative , you may choose a friendly unit at range 1-2. Issue an order to the chosen unit instead."

This would destroy the Separatist droid playability, so I don't think it is an answer.

2 minutes ago, NeonWolf said:

This would destroy the Separatist droid playability, so I don't think it is an answer.

Separatist droids are using comms relay? Sure I haven’t followed meta at all but I thought they were basically using that to chain link order tokens to all the B1s. I’m not seeing how this breaks that....

1 minute ago, ScummyRebel said:

Separatist droids are using comms relay? Sure I haven’t followed meta at all but I thought they were basically using that to chain link order tokens to all the B1s. I’m not seeing how this breaks that....

Heh, never mind, not enough coffee. Was thinking y'all were talking about Coordinate.

1 hour ago, Lochlan said:

An errata to Comms Relay that only allowed orders issued from a commander or operative to be relayed could work, I think. So it would read:

"When you would be issued an order by a friendly Commander or Operative , you may choose a friendly unit at range 1-2. Issue an order to the chosen unit instead."

I like this option better than trying to restrict emplacement troopers from using Comms Relay. It allows Comms Relay to function the way (I assume) it was intended, and future-proofs against possible new units with Coordinate: (something other than emplacement trooper). The only change I would recommend is that it also allow nominated commanders so you can still use them after your main commander is defeated and you can use them with the upcoming tank pilots.

1 minute ago, GooeyChewie said:

I like this option better than trying to restrict emplacement troopers from using Comms Relay. It allows Comms Relay to function the way (I assume) it was intended, and future-proofs against possible new units with Coordinate: (something other than emplacement trooper). The only change I would recommend is that it also allow nominated commanders so you can still use them after your main commander is defeated and you can use them with the upcoming tank pilots.

After your commander is defeated, you nominate a new commander and they actually go up in rank. You remove their normal order token and replace it with a comnander token. So the original proposed wording would be fine for that situation.

1 hour ago, Darth evil said:

Because they are the most mirrored units in the entire game next to Leia/Veers

First of all, that honor goes to Scout Troopers and Rebel Commandos. Second, ruining one unit because it "mirrors" a unit that is considered OP doesn't even begin to make one lick of sense.

17 minutes ago, KommanderKeldoth said:

After your commander is defeated, you nominate a new commander and they actually go up in rank. You remove their normal order token and replace it with a comnander token. So the original proposed wording would be fine for that situation.

That’s not...

*looks up rule*

...something I realized until today! Thank you!

2 hours ago, Darth evil said:

What can you really do about Shoretroopers? You can't take away their surges because they have none, you can't take either keywords away because if you do then Veterans would require the same treatment, all your left with is points. And they are already 2 points more per model than Stormtroopers, maybe you can go to 3 points but at 4 the unit becomes unplayable imo.My gut says the T-21b will lose range 4

I don't think taking away keywords is really an option. Doesn't seem to make much sense to completely remove a keyword from a unit through an errata. Add a keyword like the T-47, sure that makes sense but I feel like starting to take keywords off cards would become really confusing really fast. I'd agree that a 1 or 2 point increase on every model would work really good

I would like to think that the tanks will change the meta, but I wonder if that is just wishful thinking? Both tanks look like they could take a beating and do a lot more then Empire and Rebels?

On the bright side the meta is a bit more diverse....................................

2 hours ago, NeonWolf said:

This would destroy the Separatist droid playability, so I don't think it is an answer.

It'll be a problem for droids eventually too. Being able to remove all but a single type of order from the bag is a pretty huge imbalacing factor in the game no matter where it comes from.

5 minutes ago, LunarSol said:

It'll be a problem for droids eventually too. Being able to remove all but a single type of order from the bag is a pretty huge imbalacing factor in the game no matter where it comes from.

I think it makes sense for Droids to have it, as it's a unique faction/identity, but to be able to do the same with a 5 pt upgrade, is kind of absurd

7 minutes ago, manoftomorrow010 said:

I think it makes sense for Droids to have it, as it's a unique faction/identity, but to be able to do the same with a 5 pt upgrade, is kind of absurd

This exactly. We can deal with 1 faction having lots of token control because everything else about them is kind of bad for now but now that empire has that power too it messes up the game a little

26 minutes ago, bllaw said:

This exactly. We can deal with 1 faction having lots of token control because everything else about them is kind of bad for now but now that empire has that power too it messes up the game a little

Especially combined with Aggressive Tactics. Units with white attack and defense with no surges need AT to even perform reasonably well. Units with black attack and red defense, however, just become ridiculous. And when you can get orders to four or more of them easily each turn...

I think you're slight underestimating the durability of points efficient wound counts, but I also just generally think Aggressive Tactics is.... Aggressively priced to say the least.

In terms of the dominant units: I think there's lots of good ways to fix Tauntauns. Shoretroopers are a lot harder simply because they don't have great unique design space. They are functionally similar to Stormtroopers, making it very hard to keep one from replacing the other based on whichever happens to be the most efficient for their points.

A novel idea, but one that would be too hard to implement due to logistical reasons would be to reclassify them as special forces.

it would limit options in an imperial army for taking shores and sniper teams while then forcing imp players to play with other core trooper units.

of course as the order token is not at all easy to replace so its virtually a non starter but I think that would at the least be a move in the right direction.

I feel like Comms Relay would barely be used without Shore/Mortar so it shouldn’t change.

But ... maybe take away critical 1? It’s weird that the ATST mortar lacks crit 1 but this mortar has it. Taking away some of the points efficiency is more important than making Comms Relay irrelevant IMHO.

13 minutes ago, smickletz said:

I feel like Comms Relay would barely be used without Shore/Mortar so it shouldn’t change.

But ... maybe take away critical 1? It’s weird that the ATST mortar lacks crit 1 but this mortar has it. Taking away some of the points efficiency is more important than making Comms Relay irrelevant IMHO.

it would then render the Mortar practically unplayable, Crit 1 is how this thing actually does any damage.

42 minutes ago, smickletz said:

It’s weird that the ATST mortar lacks crit 1 but this mortar has it. Taking away some of the points efficiency is more important than making Comms Relay irrelevant IMHO.

This is the "X-Wing 1.0 Effect" in action. We are going to see more of this as Legion progresses. Original/older units won't have the same keywords as newer units and will eventually have to be "patched" or they won't be played. This is what ultimately led to the X-Wing 2.0 reset.

Errata:

Comms Relay: only functions with orders issued by a commander or operative

Aggressive Tactics: goes up to 15 points

Ram X keyword: allows you to re-roll x attack dice instead of providing x gaurunteed crits

I predict points adjustments:

Tauntauns - 110pts

Mortar - 48pts

57 minutes ago, lologrelol said:

I predict points adjustments:

Tauntauns - 110pts

Mortar - 48pts

can't see an increase that high for the Mortar, not sure about my math but thats roughly what 30% increase