https://www.fantasyflightgames.com/en/news/2020/1/14/the-saga-concludes/

Not that I ever played it.

Not too surprising. There were plenty of warning signs.

Let’s not turn this into a panic about xwing, which is doing far better both in terms of player base and in terms of FFG communication to said player base (even if it’s via odd channels instead of directly)

9 minutes ago, ScummyRebel said:

FFG communication

Is pretty excellent compared to first edition. Those live streams allow you to glimpse into the devs minds without having to use the Force.

It wasn't a well designed-to-realized game. Like, if it was digital, sure. But the whole dice thing? But it's a card game? Whaaaa? It was doomed from the start to me. That's why I never bought it.

Destiny didn't seem to have a particularly wide uptake. It's a fun little game, and their draft system was clever, but competing in the same space as Magic, Pokemon, and YGO was always going to be a tough sell. The card pack cost being high because of the dice didn't help that at all.

Destiny was a really fun game that was hamstrung early on by two mistakes. The first was the logistics of booster pack supply in the first wave - the game got lots of positive buzz and then soon, prospective players found out that booster packs were out of stock pretty much everywhere with no ETA of a reprint. That held back the game's growth potential early on.

The other was a set of design choices made in set 2. That brought in cards that "cheated" the action economy that the game was built on. That caused balance problems was well as breaking up the quick-fire turn-about that made gameplay feel fast. The worst thing about those cards was that they removed a lot of the interactivity that normally existed (where there would be a turn in between rolling dice and resolving them, allowing the other player an opportunity to do something about it).

The last straw for a lot of lapsed and semi-lapsed players was the rotation last year that took the first cycle of releases out of tournament legality. That was pretty much a no-win scenario for the designers because those early sets had some badly-designed legacy cards that the game was better off without, but players like me (mostly with sets 1 and 2 cards and much less from later sets) got most of our collections wiped.

So, I'm disappointed but not surprised. It was not a flourishing game. I already lost 90% of my collection from tournament-legality in the rotation so I suppose I only lost the other 10% with this announcement.

I only bought in on the Awakenings stuff, and some 2-player set when it came on sale. There's a few stores with the first trilogy booster boxes on sale for £20 now, and I was honestly tempted until I tried to remember the last time I actually played a game of it.

It was fun, but man did it find zero traction in my area. Anyone I demo'd it to enjoyed it, but either didn't want another blind pack card game, or was put off by the cost weighed against other games they already played.

It's demise doesnt make me fear for X-wing, but maybe a little bit for Armada.

17 minutes ago, Dasharr said:

Destiny was a really fun game that was hamstrung early on by two mistakes. The first was the logistics of booster pack supply in the first wave - the game got lots of positive buzz and then soon, prospective players found out that booster packs were out of stock pretty much everywhere with no ETA of a reprint. That held back the game's growth potential early on.

The other was a set of design choices made in set 2. That brought in cards that "cheated" the action economy that the game was built on. That caused balance problems was well as breaking up the quick-fire turn-about that made gameplay feel fast. The worst thing about those cards was that they removed a lot of the interactivity that normally existed (where there would be a turn in between rolling dice and resolving them, allowing the other player an opportunity to do something about it).

The last straw for a lot of lapsed and semi-lapsed players was the rotation last year that took the first cycle of releases out of tournament legality. That was pretty much a no-win scenario for the designers because those early sets had some badly-designed legacy cards that the game was better off without, but players like me (mostly with sets 1 and 2 cards and much less from later sets) got most of our collections wiped.

So, I'm disappointed but not surprised. It was not a flourishing game. I already lost 90% of my collection from tournament-legality in the rotation so I suppose I only lost the other 10% with this announcement.

I never got fully invested in the game, but built semi-competitive decks by the few boosters I did buy and by trading, buying singles, etc. As soon as they announced the wipe every two years, I pretty much stopped buying into the game. Maybe a few boosters here and there cause I enjoyed the gameplay, but I spent alot of time building my decks by trading, buying singles etc. and then they are gonna be worthless. UGH. And no way was I gonna buy boxes and boxes and boxes to get two mauls or two vaders, etc.

I really enjoyed the gameplay early on. The dice and card combo idea was cool and refreshing. I myself couldnt keep up with the "Great Wipe" and stopped playing.

Imperial Assault got axed last year too. The writing was on the wall there for even longer.

FFG has said specifically that they're thinking more consciously about games in terms of lifespan instead of just "cool game idea let's run it till it dries out."

Imperial Assault had major issues and errata from Wave I as well. The first worlds was entirely comprised of 2 lists and something like 5-6 units. The last worlds was 60% composed of one specific list and the rest were a choice of 2 potential counters to that list that lost vs each other and didn't always win vs it anyway.

But Imperial Assault lives on in Campaign mode, which is what I got it for in the first place. Units still suffer from major balance issues, but we can homebrew corrections for that. There's even a continuity project to try to keep Skirmish alive, but I'm not too optimistic on how that will work out long-term.

Honestly it's a good thing that FFG is recognizing and retiring its poorer designs to invest more into the ones that really do work well and have a massive player base, both from a game design and a business perspective.

I'm mainly just happy that Armada is still chugging along; it's slow, but it's consistent. And Legion seems stronger than ever now that they're doing annual points adjustments there as well. It's a bit annoying that recent products have taken awhile to get out, but I'm sure it will be worth the wait in the long run.

Here's to may more happy years of Star Wars minigaming.

Legion seems to be what they tried to make competitive IA, which is a shame because the campaign for IA is actually really good, and I feel its overlooked by folks looking at things like Zombicide. I played it in a group for a bit before we sort of migrated into their RPG system (which the game tiles and minis are actually great for, too). It had a nice system, I really must see if I can find a copy to play with some friends after we're finished this Gloomhaven expansion.

I don't think Legion was ever really intended as a replacement for IA. It's not just propaganda; they're totally different games. I get the annoyance that people feel with having to repaint everything though. I had painted almost all my Imperials for IA, so the prospect of starting over with Legion is a major factor keeping me out of it (until they redo the core in hard plastic...). But with the recent success of stuff like Gloomhaven, I wouldn't be at all surprised if they rebooted Imperial Assault someday.

44 minutes ago, NakedDex said:

I really must see if I can find a copy to play with some friends after we're finished this Gloomhaven expansion

Same boat. I have the IA core and two box expansions (Jabba's Realm and Heart of the Empire) and I played through a full core campaign awhile back. Playing as the Empire was crazy kinds of fun, though in the future I'd probably use the app and join the team of Heroes. We're doing a Gloomhaven campaign now, but someday we might get back to Imperial Assault. Campaign only, though. If we do, I'd have to start painting them again...

Throwing this out there: Imperial Assault was a very poor value proposition from the start. $10 packs for a pvc miniature was never going to sell the way they wanted it to. Only the competitive skirmish players and some of the most hardcore campaign gamers bought many of those. I got 4 or so before I realized how overpriced they were. Legion is an opportunity for them to get it right, and if they redo Imperial Assault, there's a lot of opportunity there as well: Sell the extra figures in boxes, not individually. It's too many SKUs for retailers, it's too much overhead for stocking, and it's way too expensive for the consumer, leading to a decrease in sales... Just a bad model.