So with the new costs I've realized that 6 academies leave 68 points to add a nice endgame resistance piece.

In that design space in order of aceness:

-Delta squadron defender 67 -raw stats very good blocker with built in evade and boost.

-Naked Vader 67 -raw damage output but low re-positioning ability (hyperspace legal )

-Whisper 57 +upgrades (?) -very good against middle PS ships but will suffer against real aces.

-Soontir 54 + upgrades (crackshot, TC, hull for 64?) - classic ace for endgame.

What do you guys think?

I would go with Soontir, having him circle the battle and always threatening to swoop in for the kill

I'd probably look at the TIE defender. When you've got a big swarm on the board, being able to chop and change activation order is a good thing to make sure no one else gets in your TIE/D's way...

It's not a blocker in this situation; it's a ship with a 3-dice attack that's next to impossible to kill without concentrated fire - and concentrated fire is hard to do with its 6 lil' siblings swarming round your feet.

In a hyperspace environment, obviously Vader from your list, though Duchess with Hull Upgrade, Fifth Brother and Outmanoeuvre shouldn't be ignored.

"Duchess" - Ruthless, Targeting Computer + 7 Academy Pilots/6 Academy Pilots: Targeting Computer.

Agile Ace with lots of pew pew power. Insane amount of blockers. Bleeds points very slowly. Is Hyperspace legal.

@Magnus Grendel : Having all ships at the same initiative is indeed very useful and reduces the mental load of running the swarm.

I'm thinking of it as a great blocking option because it significantly increases the blocking range of the swarm blob (from 6.3 base length to 8.5 base length so above a range 3 shot).

And it does it while retaining a defensive mod! On offense it is about the same as having 2 more 2 attack dice ties so about a wash.

I'm just worried that in the endgame it's not going to add a lot of weight against the mid PS value ships that I see as the most problematic matchup.

@Schanez / @Magnus Grendel : thanks for the duchess suggestion! I'll try her in my next game.

Mining Guild Sentry (22)

Mining Guild Sentry (22)

Mining Guild Sentry (22)

Mining Guild Sentry (22) c

Mining Guild Sentry (22)

Mining Guild Sentry (22)

Fenn Rau (68)
Total: 200

View in Yet Another Squad Builder 2.0

I've ran whisper and 6 acads to some decent success in limited number of games.

18 hours ago, Schanez said:

"Duchess" - Ruthless, Targeting Computer + 7 Academy Pilots/6 Academy Pilots: Targeting Computer.

Agile Ace with lots of pew pew power. Insane amount of blockers. Bleeds points very slowly. Is Hyperspace legal.

Duchess6Ties

(42) "Duchess" [TIE/sk Striker]
(3) Targeting Computer
Points: 45

(22) Academy Pilot [TIE/ln Fighter]
(3) Targeting Computer
Points: 25

(22) Academy Pilot [TIE/ln Fighter]
(3) Targeting Computer
Points: 25

(22) Academy Pilot [TIE/ln Fighter]
(3) Targeting Computer
Points: 25

(22) Academy Pilot [TIE/ln Fighter]
(3) Targeting Computer
Points: 25

(22) Academy Pilot [TIE/ln Fighter]
(3) Targeting Computer
Points: 25

(22) Academy Pilot [TIE/ln Fighter]
(3) Targeting Computer
Points: 25

Total points: 195

I'm not convinced of the value of Targeting Computer. Yes, all right, being able to take an action to lock if you have no shot and aren't being shot at is nice, but when within engagement range of the enemy 90% of the time either you've got a shot, or you could be shot, or both, and the actual damage increase from a lock is no greater than from a focus.

Duchess is high initiative enough, and squirrelly enough, to regularly be able to engage from a 'safe' spot. So I can see giving her a targeting computer, stripping it off her buddies, and having 7 wingmen.

You've then got a choice between a 1 point initiative bid and ruthless.... that's swings and roundabouts but I'd err on the side of Ruthless - anyone bringing an I5 'ace' squad is going to be coming with 5+ points of bid on general principle, and a fair amount of swarms will be either I2 or I3 so controlling the first player token won't help you. By comparison, 21 hull points of disposables is a good argument for Ruthless, and that frees up Duchess even more by letting her use red moves and barrel rolls and still have dice modification that's actually slightly better than a focus token whilst she does so.

39 minutes ago, Magnus Grendel said:

I'm not convinced of the value of Targeting Computer. Yes, all right, being able to take an action to lock if you have no shot and aren't being shot at is nice, but when within engagement range of the enemy 90% of the time either you've got a shot, or you could be shot, or both, and the actual damage increase from a lock is no greater than from a focus.

Duchess is high initiative enough, and squirrelly enough, to regularly be able to engage from a 'safe' spot. So I can see giving her a targeting computer, stripping it off her buddies, and having 7 wingmen.

You've then got a choice between a 1 point initiative bid and ruthless.... that's swings and roundabouts but I'd err on the side of Ruthless - anyone bringing an I5 'ace' squad is going to be coming with 5+ points of bid on general principle, and a fair amount of swarms will be either I2 or I3 so controlling the first player token won't help you. By comparison, 21 hull points of disposables is a good argument for Ruthless, and that frees up Duchess even more by letting her use red moves and barrel rolls and still have dice modification that's actually slightly better than a focus token whilst she does so.

Initially I went for 6 Fighters and Duchess, but then decided, that I1 will rather want to take Focus/Evade either way. So that's how the 7 Fighters came to be.

You can block every maneuver the enemy Ace will attempt, setting up a massive killbox and being able to usually throw four dice attacks with Duchess.

The return of Targeting Computer on a 2 Attack ship is negligible. You are as likely to roll a Blank as you are a Focus. And the Focus Token can also help you with defence.

I don't like the idea of Vader as an end game piece. While I agree, he is amazing at pushing damage through, he wants to fly with at least an FCS to preserve Force Charges. And due to his deadliness, he will get focused hard, leaving you with a bunch of flying coffins.

Soontir Fel is a decent idea. He is extremely wiggly and agile. With his free Focus Tokens, I'd slap him with a Targeting Computer and Elusive for a start. You are left with 9 points to play with. Shield Upgrade is decent, Afterburners as well.

I am rather fond of the idea of Grand Inquisitor with Sense, Mag-Pulse Warheads and FCS. You can Sense a target, block them or use Warheads to strip tokens either way. Deplete will help your swarm and Ace survive a little bit longer. Also a 3 Agility + 2 Force + Evade is better at survival, than 3 Agility + 3 Force that Vader has.

Now you got me thinking! what about:

7 academies 154 pts

Inquisitor, sense 40pts.

Not sure what to do about the last 6pts, but adding sense to the swarm should be excellent to setup blocks and to inform action taking for the Ties.