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Looks like player 1 has a much easier time planning the placement of bombs, since they're going off next activation, not two turns away. Is this intentional to put pressure on ace players (so the bid isn't so strong)? Or is it an oversight?

Or is there enough herding advantage to placing the longer-term bombs that it works out?

edit: it seems to me like the first player token should be passed back and forth each even-numbered round or something, or who has to put a fuse marker on the bombs should change each other round.

I know in Armada, objectives generally give an advantage to the second player, as first is seen as far more preferable. In X-Wing, second player usually has the advantage, so I'm guessing it's an intentional balancing act.

Still, plopping down a proton right in front of a B-Wing is pretty mean.

Or a proximity mine right in front of Soontir...

Edit: Wait, no mines. This is a bit more fair. Very punishing for a second player with swarms or slow ships though...

1 minute ago, ClassicalMoser said:

Still, plopping down a proton right in front of a B-Wing is pretty mean.

Or a proximity mine right in front of Soontir...

It will affect some ships more than others, potentially giving a strong advantage to the first player.

Though thankfully it's all bombs, never mines.

Still, a bomb covers an area that's a bit more than range 2 across. That's a pretty long distance for a lot of ships to cover.

1 minute ago, theBitterFig said:

Still, a bomb covers an area that's a bit more than range 2 across. That's a pretty long distance for a lot of ships to cover.

Yea, I think this will work pretty well for the really agile aces that have the speed and repositions to get out of the danger zone. Swarms, low-mobility ships, etc will have a very tough time.

A lot of stuff seems to favor aces in the end. :/

55 minutes ago, Wazat said:

Looks like player 1 has a much easier time planning the placement of bombs, since they're going off next activation, not two turns away. Is this intentional to put pressure on ace players (so the bid isn't so strong)? Or is it an oversight?

Or is there enough herding advantage to placing the longer-term bombs that it works out?

First impression suggests it is so all the bombs go off on the odd number turns to represent a salvo onto the battlefield.

2 minutes ago, Frimmel said:

First impression suggests it is so all the bombs go off on the odd number turns to represent a salvo onto the battlefield.

That's what I figured, but there are consequences to this setup for the 2nd player. I was curious if they could have done better, or if the uneven advantage was intentional.

1 hour ago, Wazat said:

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Looks like player 1 has a much easier time planning the placement of bombs, since they're going off next activation, not two turns away. Is this intentional to put pressure on ace players (so the bid isn't so strong)? Or is it an oversight?

Or is there enough herding advantage to placing the longer-term bombs that it works out?

edit: it seems to me like the first player token should be passed back and forth each even-numbered round or something, or who has to put a fuse marker on the bombs should change each other round.

Theory: Being uneven for first player is intentional because it deincintivizes bids and FFG are planning to add Environment cards to OP as part of listbuilding.

2 minutes ago, MasterShake2 said:

Theory: Being uneven for first player is intentional because it deincintivizes bids and FFG are planning to add Environment cards to OP as part of listbuilding.

That's intriguing, though I'd be afraid of the environment cards that are brutal for certain lists. This one dooms swarm players and anyone flying slow clunky ships, for example. Aces won't mind so much.

It kinda feels like one more way to face a hard counter.

To everyone suggesting that it’s meant to balance out bids and 1st vs 2nd player: the problem I see is that NONE of the other environment cards do this. It’s seems very odd that only 1 card is meant to incentivize first player and all the others don’t.

9 hours ago, Herowannabe said:

To everyone suggesting that it’s meant to balance out bids and 1st vs 2nd player: the problem I see is that NONE of the other environment cards do this. It’s seems very odd that only 1 card is meant to incentivize first player and all the others don’t.

Aces want second player.

Swarms hate this environment.

Happy compromise (just avoid mirror matches)!

12 hours ago, MasterShake2 said:

Theory: Being uneven for first player is intentional because it deincintivizes bids and FFG are planning to add Environment cards to OP as part of listbuilding.

They've stated twice on different livestreams that these will not be added to OP events.

5 hours ago, MegaSilver said:

They've stated twice on different livestreams that these will not be added to OP events.

Immediately yes, that doesn't mean that they aren't looking at the prospect.

15 hours ago, Herowannabe said:

To everyone suggesting that it’s meant to balance out bids and 1st vs 2nd player: the problem I see is that NONE of the other environment cards do this. It’s seems very odd that only 1 card is meant to incentivize first player and all the others don’t.

The other problem is bids only matter in a fraction of matchups. If I bring a bunch of i1/2 ships into Imp Aces, "your opponent gets the condition they want but has to give you choice over who moves last" is a small comfort.

6 hours ago, svelok said:

The other problem is bids only matter in a fraction of matchups. If I bring a bunch of i1/2 ships into Imp Aces, "your opponent gets the condition they want but has to give you choice over who moves last" is a small comfort.

How are environments chosen? First player choice? Second player choice? Random?

2 hours ago, JJ48 said:

How are environments chosen? First player choice? Second player choice? Random?

Being as they're for casual games, at the moment though I doubt this will change, it is chosen via the 2 players deciding between them which one, if any, to make use of.

7 hours ago, JJ48 said:

How are environments chosen? First player choice? Second player choice? Random?

It's for casual play, so do what you want. Possible options are:

1. First player chooses
2. Second player chooses
3. Random choice
4. The player who won the bid must nominate one player to select an environment card and the other player to decide on player order.
5. Combine chance and choice. Shuffle all environment cards and deal 3 face-down on the table. The player who won the bid must nominate one player to select an environment card and the other player to decide on player order. The player selecting an environment card looks at the three face-down cards and chooses one, keeping it hidden. The other player then decides player order. The chosen card is then revealed and setup begins. (Optional rule: after choosing environment cards, the two cards that were not chosen are revealed).

You can also steal some ideas from legion, eg. each player brings 3 environment cards which forms the pool of possible cards for that battle.

If I was running a tourney with environment cards, I'd do #5 for sure, with the reveal of the un-chosen cards before deciding player order.

9 hours ago, gadwag said:

If I was running a tourney with environment cards, I'd do #5 for sure, with the reveal of the un-chosen cards before deciding player order.

I'd be very tempted instead to have each round be a given environment on all tables, different in each round, much like a lot of Warhammer World 40k events do a 'roll for scenario' for everyone before the game begins.

That way, the TO has the opportunity to filter out any environments they believe are totally unbalanced, and it also means everyone has to face the same environments over the course of the day. Equally, you can (if you wish) pre-publish what environments are going to be used; so people can trade off between optimising their squads for a theoretical 'meta' opponent and optimising them to fight in a given environment.

On ‎12‎/‎17‎/‎2019 at 6:10 PM, theBitterFig said:

Still, a bomb covers an area that's a bit more than range 2 across. That's a pretty long distance for a lot of ships to cover.

Far more with a seismic charge; placing it so you have two potential obstacles to hit is quite feasible, and that's a huge area of the board potentially within the blast zone.

True. I've annoyed a few people already via deploying a bomb right in front of their ship, then flying away. It can be very difficult to escape the blast radius, especially if you weren't really expecting it.

11 hours ago, Magnus Grendel said:

I'd be very tempted instead to have each round be a given environment on all tables, different in each round, much like a lot of Warhammer World 40k events do a 'roll for scenario' for everyone before the game begins.

That way, the TO has the opportunity to filter out any environments they believe are totally unbalanced, and it also means everyone has to face the same environments over the course of the day. Equally, you can (if you wish) pre-publish what environments are going to be used; so people can trade off between optimising their squads for a theoretical 'meta' opponent and optimising them to fight in a given environment.

This also allows the TO to set up each table with all the obstacles etc. that are required (providing they can find enough of them) instead of requiring players to bring their own, which is nice (although I don't know anyone with enough devices and rocks, so players would still need to bring them I think).