16 minutes ago, penpenpen said:

Has this been compared to toy sales overall? I mean, if the toy business was puttering along as usual, Toys R Us would still be in business. Sure, it's an effect of brick and mortar sales losing to online stores, but but I wouldn't be surprised if physical toys are losing ground to video games and the like.

Marvel and Frozen toys are doing perfectly well, it's the Star Wars toy section which lost it's #1 position in the market.

The sources is Disney’s own 2018 annual report.

Also, is this actual 'losing' or corporate 'losing' where they made $9,999,999 instead of $1,000,000,000 and everyone in suits cries about it? Those are two very different things.

It's also all Disney in the top spots so $$$$

4 minutes ago, StarkJunior said:

Also, is this actual 'losing' or corporate 'losing' where they made $9,999,999 instead of $1,000,000,000 and everyone in suits cries about it? Those are two very different things.

Well, just read Disney’s annual report for 2018, where they admitted a decrease of toy sales since 2016.

Sure, Disney just lost $1.

Yeah, boo-hoo. Still millions in their pockets.

Spare me the corporate crying.

Also, that's across the board and the lack of disposal income amongst the largest age groups in the US is a factor + decline of child births compared to previous generations.

My generation has 'killed' how many industries now, too?

Anyway, Star Wars is fine. And will be fine.

7 minutes ago, StarkJunior said:

Yeah, boo-hoo. Still millions in their pockets.

Spare me the corporate crying.

Also, that's across the board and the lack of disposal income amongst the largest age groups in the US is a factor + decline of child births compared to previous generations.

My generation has 'killed' how many industries now, too?

Anyway, Star Wars is fine. And will be fine.

You behave like I attacked you personally. Why so thin skinned? But sure, continue with your mental gymnastics, if they make you feel more secure.

6 minutes ago, DarthDude said:

You behave like I attacked you personally. Why so thin skinned? But sure, continue with your mental gymnastics, if they make you feel more secure.

I don't think you attacked me at all. I just don't care if big corps lose money - pardon, 'didn't make the amount of profits they thought, but still made enough to buy the execs a yacht each'. Disney is basically just competing with itself in all arenas, so they're laughing all the way to the bank.

And I'm also sick of people trying to toss out data as definite proof Star Wars is somehow failing or dead or bad or whatever else. It's not. TRoS is gonna make big money, Mandalorian is the top streaming show in the world, and SW is still one of the biggest IPs in the world.

Toy sales are **** indicators for so many reasons, and like penpenpen said, a lot of it is eclipsed by video games and other interactive mediums.

So, all of their “consumer products” have seen a decline. We’re just cherry picking Star Wars products to align with the “TeH dIzNeE iZ kIlLiNg StAr WaRz BeCuZ tHeY’rE tEh EvUlZ” narrative. The largest remaining dedicated toy retailer going under, toys increasingly being marketed (and priced) as adults’ collectibles rather than kids’ playthings, and cancellation of a highly-promoted toy/video game hybrid (Disney Infinity) among other factors can’t contribute. The decline across the board can only indicate waning interest in Star Wars.

Just now, Nytwyng said:

So, all of their “consumer products” have seen a decline. We’re just cherry picking Star Wars products to align with the “TeH dIzNeE iZ kIlLiNg StAr WaRz BeCuZ tHeY’rE tEh EvUlZ” narrative. The largest remaining dedicated toy retailer going under, toys increasingly being marketed (and priced) as adults’ collectibles rather than kids’ playthings, and cancellation of a highly-promoted toy/video game hybrid (Disney Infinity) among other factors can’t contribute. The decline across the board can only indicate waning interest in Star Wars.

Yeah, it's the cherry-picking stuff to fit that false narrative that grinds my gears, because I love all the Disney-era Star Wars and it gets a little tiresome to have people try to 'prove' why its bad or whatever.

1 minute ago, StarkJunior said:

And I'm also sick of people trying to toss out data as definite proof Star Wars is somehow failing or dead or bad or whatever else. It's not. Toy sales are **** indicators for so many reasons, and like penpenpen said, a lot of it is eclipsed by video games and other interactive mediums.

Just relax, toy and media sales are in decline primarily due to Star Wars, but I did not say Star Wars as a brand is dead. Same like I never told most older fans dislike Star Wars, just mentioned a large part. All power to you and your firm belief in Disney. Nothing wrong with it. I did mention, I love Disney's Mandalorian, right?

7 minutes ago, Nytwyng said:

So, all of their “consumer products” have seen a decline. We’re just cherry picking Star Wars products to align with the “TeH dIzNeE iZ kIlLiNg StAr WaRz BeCuZ tHeY’rE tEh EvUlZ” narrative. The largest remaining dedicated toy retailer going under, toys increasingly being marketed (and priced) as adults’ collectibles rather than kids’ playthings, and cancellation of a highly-promoted toy/video game hybrid (Disney Infinity) among other factors can’t contribute. The decline across the board can only indicate waning interest in Star Wars.

The decline in toys and media is due to Star Wars, read their annual report.

And calling a differing opinion to yours a “TeH dIzNeE iZ kIlLiNg StAr WaRz BeCuZ tHeY’rE tEh EvUlZ” narrative is a bit immature, don't you think so?

13 hours ago, Seguleh said:

Hm. Why is Luke named Skywalker? Anakin was anakin Skywalker, right?

Then his mother (a Skywalker) got bought out of slavery, and the new family took her name? But the adoptive parents of Luke where not blood related to him or where they? Shouldn't he have a different name? Like Luke wetfarmer? Or did they let him keep the name so he is easier to find for the empire?

I never really thought about that, but....

Oh, and did Leia keep organza or did she become a Skywalker too? Or a solo?

In Episode IV on-screen did anyone actually call Luke "Skywalker" before he met Ben? I can only recall him being called "Luke" by Beru and Owen. Even in cut scenes I think he was only called "Luke" or "Wormy". If you refer to the original novel, he was referred to as Luke Skywalker outside of dialogue, but possibly only "Luke" in actual dialogue? So while he was technically always Luke Skywalker, how do we know he wasn't being called "Luke Lars" while he was growing up on Tatooine?

Just now, Sturn said:

In Episode IV on-screen did anyone actually call Luke "Skywalker" before he met Ben? I can only recall him being called "Luke" by Beru and Owen. Even in cut scenes I think he was only called "Luke" or "Wormy". If you refer to the original novel, he was referred to as Luke Skywalker outside of dialogue, but possibly only "Luke" in actual dialogue? So while he was technically always Luke Skywalker, how do we know he wasn't being called "Luke Lars" while he was growing up on Tatooine?

That's a good question - I can't recall if they did? Maybe during the Yavin sequences? Been a bit since I've watched ANH.

3 minutes ago, DarthDude said:

Just relax, toy and media sales are in decline primarily due to Star Wars

Suuure.

A company with as many holdings as Disney is seeing a decline in toy and media sales across the board because of one line.

2 minutes ago, StarkJunior said:

That's a good question - I can't recall if they did? Maybe during the Yavin sequences? Been a bit since I've watched ANH.

After Ben filled in more details of his heritage and he left his old life behind, you could assume he started going by Luke Skywalker.

2 minutes ago, DarthDude said:

The decline in toys and media is due to Star Wars, read their annual report.

You’re the one making the claim, so it’s incumbent upon you to provide the information.

4 minutes ago, DarthDude said:

And calling a differing opinion to yours a “TeH dIzNeE iZ kIlLiNg StAr WaRz BeCuZ tHeY’rE tEh EvUlZ” narrative is a bit immature, don't you think so?

When there are, indeed, trying to sell the narrative that Disney is indeed doing so...nah, not really.

Of course, some of the people pushing that narrative are the same ones who swore up and down that Lucas was trying to drive the property into the ground with the special editions, then with the prequels, and whatever else stuck in their craw on a particular day, and now regard the prequels fondly and pine for Lucas’ return after the tithe ones who helped drive him away.

4 minutes ago, Nytwyng said:

Suuure.

A company with as many holdings as Disney is seeing a decline in toy and media sales across the board because of one line.

Would you just read Disney's own annual report, please, as I suggested?

https://www.thewaltdisneycompany.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/01/2018-Annual-Report.pdf

A quick citation:

Quote

Lower comparable retail store sales reflected decreased sales of Star Wars and Moana merchandise in the current year, partially offset by higher sales of Mickey and Minnie merchandise.

And yeah, because Moana is comparably tiny to Star Wars it makes Star Wars the major culprit of the decline.

@skywalker name: hm, they could have fixed that issue with episode 1, they could have given anakin a different name 🤔

@toy disscussion: please don't slip again in this all toxic discussion this is becoming so tiresome. Let us appreciate that Darthdude showed us these numbers and they are interesting. And the original point of this discussion is a lack of toy-applicable ships in the new star wars movies.

In x-wing the resistance and first order have a really small ship pool. Besides 2 tie fighter versions the latter have just the shuttle of kylo ren and his fighter.

15 minutes ago, DarthDude said:

And yeah, because Moana is comparably tiny to Star Wars it makes Star Wars the major culprit of the decline.

“Yeah, yeah, sure it also calls out products based on a standalone movie that made $680 million, with a little more appeal to younger kids. But that doesn’t fit my narrative, so ignore it.”

19 minutes ago, Seguleh said:

And the original point of this discussion is a lack of toy-applicable ships in the new star wars movies.

Hasbro has proven over the years that new designs aren’t necessary to sell toys. They can repackage the same ships with or even without new features and sell it. Recolors of existing designs actually benefit toy companies, because they don’t need new molds. (The only reason the Falcon got a redesign and upgrade 10 or so years back is that the mold used since ‘79 or ‘80 finally broke.) From my perspective, A big problem is the overall drop in quality of the sorts of toys that sell through via parents for actual play. The 3.5” figure line, for example, has lost detail and points of articulation. Hasbro seems to be focusing more on trying to appeal to adult collectors, which means higher price points and more limited production to preserve at least the illusion of “rarity.”

19 minutes ago, Seguleh said:

In x-wing the resistance and first order have a really small ship pool. Besides 2 tie fighter versions the latter have just the shuttle of kylo ren and his fighter.

The Republic and Separatists are limited, too, despite the prequels and Clone Wars offering a multitude of designs. Meanwhile, most of what’s available for the Rebel, Empire, and Scum factions don’t come from the movies. With the sequel trilogy done, licensees like EA, Marvel, and FFG May find themselves with more freedom to add more designs as was done in the EU/Legends.

18 minutes ago, Nytwyng said:

“Yeah, yeah, sure it also calls out products based on a standalone movie that made $680 million, with a little more appeal to younger kids. But that doesn’t fit my narrative, so ignore it.”

You seem pretty obsessed with your "narrative" thingy, right? Must be painful to feel so entitled. *sigh*

1 minute ago, DarthDude said:

You seem pretty obsessed with your "narrative" thingy, right? Must be painful to feel so entitled. *sigh*

You’re the one telling us to ignore something because it doesn’t line up with your premise, so you tell me.

26 minutes ago, Seguleh said:

@toy disscussion: please don't slip again in this all toxic discussion this is becoming so tiresome. Let us appreciate that Darthdude showed us these numbers and they are interesting. And the original point of this discussion is a lack of toy-applicable ships in the new star wars movies.

You are right, first they demand sources and when they get them directly from the mouse itself they squirm and indulge in mental gymnastics and this "narrative" drivel and resort to personal attacks.

I'll stop it and let them happily live undisturbed in their bubble. *sigh*

1 minute ago, DarthDude said:

You are right, first they demand sources and when they get them directly from the mouse itself they squirm and indulge in mental gymnastics and this "narrative" drivel

Is that better or worse than providing the source while saying, “Just ignore the parts that don’t fit my point?”

3 minutes ago, DarthDude said:

and resort to personal attacks.

Such as?

Does any of this really matter?