Ok, so I try to understand how to approach it. Please let me know if I understand that correctly:

1. Vigilance is used when you are ambushed by combat (you did not expect it, for example you are at party and suddenly plasma bolts start to fly and people bodies hit the floor around you).

2. Cool is used as general and more common roll for initiative for any kind of normal combat situation and in standard fight.

Now what about situation like that (taken from last session): Player A is Mercenary, currently hired as body guard. He follows his employee and scans around looking for trouble, threats, potential security breaches, he is ready for combat etc. They are on some sort of gala. Rest of players are some other classes and they want to blend it, get some info. Gala goes on and on, suddenly random people in crowd start to pull out some blasters and explosives and screaming "for the rebellion, death to Empire!" and fight breaks out.

Now I would ask Mercenary player A to roll Cool because he was expecting combat and was actively ready for it. Rest of the players roll for Vigilance because they are surprised and caught off-guard.

Later when players investigate the case and it leads them to some old apartments at ruined city on the planet. When they enter the room, they see armed people who also look at them - players roll for Cool cause it's standard fight and they came here following the lead of very dangerous people (so fight can happen).

Do I understand that correctly? So mostly in fights I should ask for Cool and when team is caught off-guard (ambushed, betrayed etc.) they roll for Vigilance, yes?

Also if I have combat character in party who fully expects fight everywhere (he is veteran merc and always armed) - he should for Cool mostly as he roleplays that he is ready for combat because he doesn't trust anyone till he gets credits.

Sorry for long post, I just want to make sure I understand it.

That pretty much is the long and short of it.

You should probably just tell the edgelord combat wombat to cut it out though and just put some points in Vigilance like everybody else. A lunatic who is always expecting a fight to break out sounds like an extremely Vigilant character.

13 minutes ago, micheldebruyn said:

That pretty much is the long and short of it.

You should probably just tell the edgelord combat wombat to cut it out though and just put some points in Vigilance like everybody else. A lunatic who is always expecting a fight to break out sounds like an extremely Vigilant character.

But it fits his story (Obligation - Betrayal) and his character (do not trust anyone, he is there just for credits) so him expecting a fight after few years of being merc and bounty hunter is fully expected and not "edgy". Only idiot would relax in such dangerous line of work in Outer Rims. So I don't have problem with that, sounds cliche but 90% of players characters in RPGs are cliche in most ways.

I honestly don't think someone like Boba Fett, Cad Bane, Aurra Sing or Bossk would not expect a fight all the time when they either trace a target or deal on everyday basis with underground scums. They all scream Cool and frosty.

In short, if you're comfortable with the hardened merc always being on guard, Cool is the skill he will use for initiative every time. That said, there are talents in the game that allow you to always roll one skill or the other for initiative checks, so you could interpret what he's doing as abusing the system. As GM, you'd be within your rights to require this guy to do something to compensate. Maybe if everyone else is rolling Vigilance, he has to flip a Destiny Point to roll Cool in an ambush situation. Or if he's roleplaying his character as extremely paranoid and always on guard, give him setbacks on social checks and any tasks that require concentration.

But if it's not a problem for you or the other players, you can just let him roll Cool all the time.

We absolutely know that characters like Boba Fett, Cad Bane, Aurra Sing, or Bossk don't expect a fight 100% of the time, and can relax, have down time, be people instead of robots...

We actually see Boba chilling with some girl in Jabba's palace.

There's a Sentry talent called Constant Vigilance that allows the character to always roll Vigilance check for initiative and this fits more for how you are describing the combat crunchy. He's always looking for a chance to fight so it shouldn't really be a Cool check, he just never lets his guard down.

I don't think they've added that talent to any other trees but on Sentry, it's a 20 point talent. Find a talent on his existing tree that he doesn't care for and swap it out, or let him spend 20 points on it as on off-tree talent (I've let a couple players do that if the talent really fit the character but the tree did not).

31 minutes ago, Varlie said:

There's a Sentry talent called Constant Vigilance that allows the character to always roll Vigilance check for initiative and this fits more for how you are describing the combat crunchy. He's always looking for a chance to fight so it shouldn't really be a Cool check, he just never lets his guard down.

I don't think they've added that talent to any other trees but on Sentry, it's a 20 point talent. Find a talent on his existing tree that he doesn't care for and swap it out, or let him spend 20 points on it as on off-tree talent (I've let a couple players do that if the talent really fit the character but the tree did not).

But RAW says- Cool when you expect/are prepared to fight, Vigilance when you are supprised. It doesn't make sense to use Vigilance when you are sentry/watchman/guard and suddenly things go south- you are there to be prepared and be first to react to that, so If he would have to roll Vigilance I'd say he is kind of bad sentry/guard who let himself be suprised.

I don't think Secret Service would roll Vigilance when something goes bad around President. They would roll Cool because that is their job- to be prepared always.

1 minute ago, Benny89 said:

But RAW says- Cool when you expect/are prepared to fight, Vigilance when you are supprised. It doesn't make sense to use Vigilance when you are sentry/watchman/guard and suddenly things go south- you are there to be prepared and be first to react to that, so If he would have to roll Vigilance I'd say he is kind of bad sentry/guard who let himself be suprised.

I don't think Secret Service would roll Vigilance when something goes bad around President. They would roll Cool because that is their job- to be prepared always.

The talent is called constant vigilance, meaning you're always vigilant and ready to go. As opposed to cool which is for when you know the fight is coming and can mentally prepare for it. Vigilance is for snapping into instant combat mode, cool is for when you have time and mental preparation.

11 minutes ago, Darth Revenant said:

The talent is called constant vigilance, meaning you're always vigilant and ready to go. As opposed to cool which is for when you know the fight is coming and can mentally prepare for it. Vigilance is for snapping into instant combat mode, cool is for when you have time and mental preparation.

Thanks, yes, that's what I am talking about. I don't like blury rules, so I want to have clearn distinction between two. I like when rules are clear for everyone at table.

12 minutes ago, Benny89 said:

It doesn't make sense to use Vigilance when you are sentry/watchman/guard and suddenly things go south- you are there to be prepared and be first to react to that, so If he would have to roll Vigilance I'd say he is kind of bad sentry/guard who let himself be suprised.

Vigilance...it's in the name. If you are "vigilant" you will be less surprised when there is a sudden change. So Vigilance is exactly the skill for this situation. Vigilance is for when you don't know if, when, or where something will happen. It's how well you can keep from falling asleep at your post, or getting distracted by the Twi'lek dancers at a fancy ball. It's usually used in combat, but you can certainly apply it in any other situation where there is meaningful change even in a social encounter.

Cool is for when you are setting up an ambush, and how well you can keep yourself from fidgeting (and snickering to your friends) as you wait for the enemy to arrive at *just* the right position.

1 minute ago, whafrog said:

Vigilance...it's in the name. If you are "vigilant" you will be less surprised when there is a sudden change. So Vigilance is exactly the skill for this situation. Vigilance is for when you don't know if, when, or where something will happen. It's how well you can keep from falling asleep at your post, or getting distracted by the Twi'lek dancers at a fancy ball. It's usually used in combat, but you can certainly apply it in any other situation where there is meaningful change even in a social encounter.

Cool is for when you are setting up an ambush, and how well you can keep yourself from fidgeting (and snickering to your friends) as you wait for the enemy to arrive at *just* the right position.

So what would Bodyguard from Secret Service roll or marine on patrol in enemy territory?

1 minute ago, Benny89 said:

So what would Bodyguard from Secret Service roll or marine on patrol in enemy territory?

Vigilance. These skills really are the dictionary definitions of the words.

1 minute ago, Benny89 said:

So what would Bodyguard from Secret Service roll or marine on patrol in enemy territory?

Vigilance since they need to be alert and on point and can't prepare for the violence since it could come at any time.

Just now, Darth Revenant said:

Vigilance since they need to be alert and on point and can't prepare for the violence since it could come at any time.

Doesn't being on alert meaning you are prepared?

Ehh, I don't like this Vigilance/Cool system.... I prefer when there is just one stat for Initiative...

4 minutes ago, Benny89 said:

Doesn't being on alert meaning you are prepared?

Not in the same way, because you don't know what or when.

Seriously, go to Google, and type "define vigilance". You get: "the action or state of keeping careful watch for possible danger or difficulties".

5 minutes ago, Benny89 said:

Ehh, I don't like this Vigilance/Cool system.... I prefer when there is just one stat for Initiative...

It's really simple: ambusher uses Cool; ambushee uses Vigilance.

5 minutes ago, Benny89 said:

Doesn't being on alert meaning you are prepared?

Ehh, I don't like this Vigilance/Cool system.... I prefer when there is just one stat for Initiative...

I'll echo what Whafrog said. There is a difference in being vigilant and ready to go at a moments notice and being able to mentally prepare for a fight and psych yourself up for it before it happens.

1 minute ago, whafrog said:

It's really simple: ambusher uses Cool; ambushee uses Vigilance.

Ok, then help me with different scenario - players move through Area X looking for the group of marauders than took Technology Y. They wonder around looking for them. Suddenly a group of marauders run from around the hill in their direction.

Cool or Vigilance?

33 minutes ago, Benny89 said:

But RAW says- Cool when you expect/are prepared to fight, Vigilance when you are supprised. It doesn't make sense to use Vigilance when you are sentry/watchman/guard and suddenly things go south- you are there to be prepared and be first to react to that, so If he would have to roll Vigilance I'd say he is kind of bad sentry/guard who let himself be suprised.

I don't think Secret Service would roll Vigilance when something goes bad around President. They would roll Cool because that is their job- to be prepared always.

6 minutes ago, Benny89 said:

Doesn't being on alert meaning you are prepared?

Ehh, I don't like this Vigilance/Cool system.... I prefer when there is just one stat for Initiative...

As others have said, Vigilance is exactly what Secret Service use. They are constantly scanning the crowds, in communication with other agents, looking for anyone who looks suspicious. Cool, at this point before anything starts, has little to do with it. Being alert and knowing what to watch for is what matters.

Just now, Benny89 said:

Ok, then help me with different scenario - players move through Area X looking for the group of marauders than took Technology Y. They wonder around looking for them. Suddenly a group of marauders run from around the hill in their direction.

Cool or Vigilance?

Vigilance, they don't see the marauders coming and can't prepare. Vigilance for the marauders as well if they didn't see the group first.

Just now, Varlie said:

As others have said, Vigilance is exactly what Secret Service use. They are constantly scanning the crowds, in communication with other agents, looking for anyone who looks suspicious. Cool, at this point before anything starts, has little to do with it. Being alert and knowing what to watch for is what matters.

Hm, ok, it starts to make more sense now.

To take it one step further and explain Cool. Instead of Secret Service, think about a group of SWAT team about to his a big target knowing they are facing people with lots of guns.

They psyche themselves up and charge in using Cool to charge in and take control (and hope that the bad guys aren't being vigilant and ready for the attack). If they can catch them off-guard through use of drones and other cameras, thermal imaging to know where everyone is, they rush in and take control as fast as they can.

15 minutes ago, Benny89 said:

Ok, then help me with different scenario - players move through Area X looking for the group of marauders than took Technology Y. They wonder around looking for them. Suddenly a group of marauders run from around the hill in their direction.

Cool or Vigilance?

Vigilance is when the party is not expecting or looking for a fight. They may still be all fully armed and armored, but there aren't supposed to be any enemies anywhere. This includes standing guard, body-guarding, secret service stuff... This is the same for complete lunatics who say they are alway sexpecting or looking for a fight.

Cool is for situations where everybody knows combat can start at any moment. Like infiltrating an Imperial base, tracking through enemy terrain, cleaning out a dungeon, attacking something, having a duel...

11 minutes ago, Benny89 said:

Ok, then help me with different scenario - players move through Area X looking for the group of marauders than took Technology Y. They wonder around looking for them. Suddenly a group of marauders run from around the hill in their direction.

Cool or Vigilance?

Vigilance. " Suddenly a group of marauders..." that's the secret phrase.

2 minutes ago, whafrog said:

Vigilance. " Suddenly a group of marauders..." that's the secret phrase.

Meh...

They're specifically there to hunt marauders. A group of marauders shows up. I don't see what even can be 'suddenly' about this.