7 minutes ago, Wiredin said:

did they spoil her card?

She's I5 is all we know. I5 is enough though.

8 minutes ago, Dezlin said:

no reason to make the foils free by making the base chassis more expensive if the overall price is the same. You can always fly them naked for cheaper if you just want a tanky brawler instead of a powerhouse.

Except it's not thematic to the chassis at all. They were never affordable and they were never just cannon ships. This was my whole beef with rebel beef. If you want tanks take Xs or Ys. B-Wings are destructive monsters with loads of weapons. I'm all for diversity as I think that's what the game should generally be optimized for, but in this case it's just not true to the subject matter anyway.

8 minutes ago, Wiredin said:

I'm assuming this is a no go... but with vectored thrusters you cannot focus/roll/evade(lock)? right?

No, for two reasons:

1st, you can't equip it because you don't have a red roll in your action bar (only in your linked action bar) so it's a non-starter

2nd, even if you could (for quick build or whatever) you still couldn't use it that way because it doesn't change the color of anything, it just adds a single, unlinked white barrel roll to your action bar, all by itself.

in that case drop the points of the bwing and make the foils still cost something. More options are better than forced upgrades.

You have to adjust the pilots, and leave the S-foils at 0.

Because the config is a built in feature thematically.

And because, this is the important part:

Each pilot will interact with it differently, and not on a scalable method.

So 0 the cost, and then adjust each pilot. More point cost control, better balance.

1 minute ago, Dezlin said:

in that case drop the points of the bwing and make the foils still cost something. More options are better than forced upgrades.

The B-Wing doesn't need any help. Generic B-Wings were the staple of jousting efficiency through 1st edition and most of 2nd as well, and they're still going strong.

By the same reasoning we should drop the cost of the Star Wing and the U-Wing and the X-Wing and increase all of their configs as well? The point of most configs is that it's like a ship ability that couldn't fit on the card itself, not an aftermarket upgrade. They're intended to be auto-include. I see this more as a redesign of the B-Wing than as a new mandatory upgrade. The config slot isn't competing with anything here (unless they eventually make a config for the B-6 prototype).

so I guess it's a good thing I ordered 2 hot shot kits...... there's nothing wrong with 4 Blue Sq with FCS/HLC/B-foils is there?

Here's another thing which is good about the B-Wing S-Foils: you don't get to do the Cannon attack first. If you want to set someone up with a jamming beam or tractor beam, you'll need a second equipped cannon. The way that 1e TIE/D did the cannon attack *first* meant that the tractors and jams weakened the target for the primary weapon attack. Tractor/Autoblaster to get a "normal" attack after a Tractor means you're spending still more points, and you might not get your normal number of attack dice.

Basically:

Tractor -> Attack = Toxic BS which is why everyone hates the Nantex.

Attack -> Tractor = Still often a bully (see the Shadowcaster), but not quite as much of a **** move.

*edit*

4 minutes ago, Wiredin said:

so I guess it's a good thing I ordered 2 hot shot kits...... there's nothing wrong with 4 Blue Sq with FCS/HLC/B-foils is there?

Nothing wrong as long as it fits, which it should.

But even at the same cost I'd probably take Tractor before HLC...

1 hour ago, Hiemfire said:

Yay... Ciktrago Vizago just got nerfed again... He's bound to the squad building limitations with his swap, per Max, so no double deadmans K-Fighters or Lancers...

That was already in the Rules Reference/FAQ.

2 minutes ago, theBitterFig said:

Here's another thing which is good about the B-Wing S-Foils: you don't get to do the Cannon attack first. If you want to set someone up with a jamming beam or tractor beam, you'll need a second equipped cannon. The way that 1e TIE/D did the cannon attack *first* meant that the tractors and jams weakened the target for the primary weapon attack. Tractor/Autoblaster to get a "normal" attack after a Tractor means you're spending still more points, and you might not get your normal number of attack dice.

Basically:

Tractor -> Attack = Toxic BS which is why everyone hates the Nantex.

Attack -> Tractor = Still often a bully (see the Shadowcaster), but not quite as much of a **** move.

Exactly. And I really like this BUT:

It won't make cannons viable on its own. HLC at 4 is actually pretty overpriced (basically just a predator that can't crit and costs double) and Ion Cannon at 5 doesn't make any sense at all.

As scary as Tractor-HLC or Tractor-Ion may be... I'm not sure it's worth fully 6-7 points and the foils over just the B-Wing, and it may just leave the B-Wing itself by the roadside...

Sorry I'm posting so much I'm just absolutely ecstatic to see thematic justice for the B-Wing. It was the one thing I felt most let down by in the 2.0 release, and I had hoped against hope that they'd eventually get a config to help the weapons loadouts.

When I saw it was foils I was afraid it would be primary-based or just for extra maneuverability, which was more anti-thematic.

Consider me fully blown away by what they did here. And the mechanic of spending the lock does so much to balance it and add thematics. And that you usually won't want to close them up at all. It's all just so perfect. They finally did it right. They nailed it. I'm so happy.

Zizi got me all hot and bothered... but now B-foils has me sweaty with lust.

Just now, Wiredin said:

Zizi got me all hot and bothered... but now B-foils has me sweaty with lust.

Can we talk about how the Resistance has three I5 A-Wings and the Rebels only have two named A-Wing pilots at all? And no I5-6 between them?

As someone who doesn't play Resistance, it's a sad day

If phasma takes off, captain jostero players are gonna be thrilled. Her power is very thematic and I could see an omega fanatical swarm where she spreads the damage amongst the other ships before breaking off to flank. I just dont think it would be good.

Rush looks fun. I didn't expect that ability. Could be great but he might become an i6 after suffering a devastating critical result.

Holo looks very playable. The key will be finding the right squadmates.

26 minutes ago, theBitterFig said:

Cannon/FCS B-Wings just got powerful (whether they're good or not... who knows... but powerful). Ten Nunb more than Braylen, kinda, since red Lock plays better with Ten than Braylen.

Ten likes the Red Lock in order to double-up the mods on one attack, but Braylen likes it to be able to get the re-rolls on the first attack, then spend the lock to get the bonus attack. It really works with both pilots quite nicely.

It makes me think that Gina Moonsong is likely to have some sort of stress-related mechanic as well... (which just means that she'll have something completely different, just to make me look stupid ).

14 minutes ago, Wiredin said:

so I guess it's a good thing I ordered 2 hot shot kits...... there's nothing wrong with 4 Blue Sq with FCS/HLC/B-foils is there?

I'd go Ion Cannons (Init 2 Bullseyes at Range 2-3 are ), but I'd guess it will fit.

9 minutes ago, ClassicalMoser said:

Nothing wrong as long as it fits, which it should.

But even at the same cost I'd probably take Tractor before HLC...

Or mixed... 2 Ion, 2 Tractor. That's some pretty mean levels of control right there, while not giving up much damage from a squad of 3-red ships.

7 minutes ago, ClassicalMoser said:

and Ion Cannon at 5 doesn't make any sense at all

Disagree. Ion VTG isn't bad. Ion control can already be potent. The only thing really holding it back is loss of damage. S-Foil B-Wings can bring damage and Ion at the same time.

//

Open question: is Passive Sensors worth it? B-Wings aren't super great for locks, and they aren't super fast to make range control easy. PS for two essentially unmodded shots with Primary and Ion Cannon would be a slight statistical improvement in damage: 2.375 hits expected, compared to 2.25 with a focus, plus potential control effects.

1 minute ago, ClassicalMoser said:

Can we talk about how the Resistance has three I5 A-Wings and the Rebels only have two named A-Wing pilots at all? And no I5-6 between them?

As someone who doesn't play Resistance, it's a sad day

absolutely we can. I'm an A-Wing freak. when @Rytacklesays he loves a-wings... he has a casual interest in a-wings compared to me. The fact we have no updates to the RZ1 pilots makes me incredibly sad. Where is my Sabine or Hera in an A-wing? Where is my 2.0 equivalent to Tycho? I demand justice for the original RZ1!!!!!!

6 minutes ago, ClassicalMoser said:

Exactly. And I really like this BUT:

It won't make cannons viable on its own. HLC at 4 is actually pretty overpriced (basically just a predator that can't crit and costs double) and Ion Cannon at 5 doesn't make any sense at all.

As scary as Tractor-HLC or Tractor-Ion may be... I'm not sure it's worth fully 6-7 points and the foils over just the B-Wing, and it may just leave the B-Wing itself by the roadside...

While you're correct, having the new linked action be Barrel Roll -> Lock (red) does help HLC a bit, since it makes it easier to line up the shot for the cannon, at least.

It's also interesting that the S-Foils can trigger off of any attack. That means a B-Wing could fire Torpedoes, then spend the lock to get a bonus cannon attack. Which could make for an interesting option in a battle against Huge ships: equip a B-Wing with an Ion Cannon and Ion Torpedoes... fire the torpedoes, then spend the lock to fire the Ion Cannon. Probably not worth the cost, but it's quite amusing to think about!

4 minutes ago, theBitterFig said:

Disagree. Ion VTG isn't bad. Ion control can already be potent. The only thing really holding it back is loss of damage. S-Foil B-Wings can bring damage and Ion at the same time.

Control is strong, but the range vs possible coverage of a turret for the exact same price as what I question here. Not to mention it's much easier to get a double-tap out of a turret than a cannon as there aren't many forward-arc gunners yet of any kind.

1 minute ago, Freeptop said:

It's also interesting that the S-Foils can trigger off of any attack. That means a B-Wing could fire Torpedoes, then spend the lock to get a bonus cannon attack. Which could make for an interesting option in a battle against Huge ships: equip a B-Wing with an Ion Cannon and Ion Torpedoes... fire the torpedoes, then spend the lock to fire the Ion Cannon. Probably not worth the cost, but it's quite amusing to think about!

Proton torpedoes with FCS

Then spend the lock for HLC

There's two 4-dice attacks in one turn, the equivalent of Dash on a good day, and while the second can't crit, the first is virtually guaranteed to crit and denies range bonus, so it comes out evenly, more or less (and now you can reload those torps – Braylen loves red reload).

These things will live up to their reputation tearing up capital ships for sure.

30 minutes ago, TasteTheRainbow said:

Was that a “Lieutenant Kallus” VCX Pilot?

Yes, we already know who the pilots are in the box. Was spoiled at Gencon and should be listed on the product page.

12 minutes ago, MegaSilver said:

That was already in the Rules Reference/FAQ.

No it wasn't, that tied him to the restrictions listed on the upgrade cards themselves. Max's statement added the squadbuilding restrictions to it. From the RR FAQ:

Q: Can Cikatro Vizago [] exchange an upgrade card onto
a ship that could not normally equip it (such as equipping a
Stealth Device to a Z-95 Headhunter and then exchanging it
with a Rigged Cargo Chute on a YV-666)?
A: No. Cikatro Vizago cannot move the Rigged Cargo Chute to the Z-95 due
to the Z-95 not meeting the “Medium or large ship” restriction on Rigged
Cargo Chute, as described in Upgrade Cards.

29 minutes ago, ClassicalMoser said:

She's I5 is all we know. I5 is enough though.

Except it's not thematic to the chassis at all. They were never affordable and they were never just cannon ships. This was my whole beef with rebel beef. If you want tanks take Xs or Ys. B-Wings are destructive monsters with loads of weapons. I'm all for diversity as I think that's what the game should generally be optimized for, but in this case it's just not true to the subject matter anyway.

No, for two reasons:

1st, you can't equip it because you don't have a red roll in your action bar (only in your linked action bar) so it's a non-starter

2nd, even if you could (for quick build or whatever) you still couldn't use it that way because it doesn't change the color of anything, it just adds a single, unlinked white barrel roll to your action bar, all by itself.

...no, but you CAN pair Debris Gambit up with the Closed S-Foil BR to Evade linked action. I think they even clarified this in an FAQ update that had us scratching our heads and wondering why they were saying that and trying to figure out who even could do this.

Just now, Hiemfire said:

No it wasn't, that tied him to the restrictions listed on the upgrade cards themselves. Max's statement added the squadbuilding restrictions to it. From the RR FAQ:

Q: Can Cikatro Vizago [] exchange an upgrade card onto
a ship that could not normally equip it (such as equipping a
Stealth Device to a Z-95 Headhunter and then exchanging it
with a Rigged Cargo Chute on a YV-666)?
A: No. Cikatro Vizago cannot move the Rigged Cargo Chute to the Z-95 due
to the Z-95 not meeting the “Medium or large ship” restriction on Rigged
Cargo Chute, as described in Upgrade Cards.

I think a fair number of people, however, took "could not normally equip it" and used that to rule out two of the same upgrade, since you cannot normally equip two of the same.

1 minute ago, theBitterFig said:

I think a fair number of people, however, took "could not normally equip it" and used that to rule out two of the same upgrade, since you cannot normally equip two of the same.

Said fair number of people need to learn to read.

during the question section did they answer the part about pricey ships like the E/Defender and their lack of play?