So,

I've got at least 1, and hopefully 2, local tournaments this weekend. Now I'm normally known for flying either large-based scum (see my double YV and triple G1 threads) so this time I've decided to try something completely different.

Mini-swarm

(66) Corran Horn [E-wing]
(2) "Chopper"
(2) Fire-Control System
(3) Elusive
Points: 73

(36) Jake Farrell [RZ-1 A-wing]
(1) Crack Shot
Points: 37

(34) Arvel Crynyd [RZ-1 A-wing]
(3) Intimidation
Points: 37

(30) Lieutenant Blount [Z-95-AF4 Headhunter]
Points: 30

(23) Bandit Squadron Pilot [Z-95-AF4 Headhunter]
Points: 23

Total points: 200

Now this is a bit of a strange one for me, it started with me wanting to get back to my old 1.0 favourite in Corran Horn and then went from there.

My goal was to get as far from my usual slow large ships as possible, so A-wings were the next logical step as escorts for Mr Horn - I only have 2, so in they both went.

Now at this point I'd run out of fast ships in my collection, so I decided to add a bit of filler, in went two Z-95's.

With points to spare the A-wings got upgraded to Jake and Arvel and a few basic upgrades to suit them, but not make them too expensive.

This left just enough points to up one of the Z-95's to Lt Blount as I don't like running with a bid most of the time.

So that's how I ended up with my list, and just to add to the fun I'm going into this weekend with zero practice games with the list.

Wish me luck, and any suggestions on how to actually fly this mess of ships would be greatly appreciated

I'm not a huge Chopper/Elusive fan, and particularly on Corran (since he's got such great overlap with R2 Astromechs, and those turns when you can double-up on disarm tokens). I think it's also really hard to afford the action loss, both to use Chopper, or to pull reds to refill Elusive. E-Wings really kind of need their focus tokens.

However, there really isn't anything to trim. Taking Z-95s without Blount, taking lower A-Wings with fewer upgrades doesn't really make sense.

I think if I wanted to run these 5 ships, I'd change Corran's layout entirely. I think I'd go with R3 Astromech for double locks. Love R3 when I was flying Torpedo Knaves. That forces less of a commitment on approach, and allows him to be a bit more opportunistic. On top of that, I'd consider swapping FCS for Predator. Corran wants bullseye anyhow, and close to half the value of a lock is in the first rerolled die anyhow. If not Predator, then just Crack Shot.

Depending on whether keeping FCS, there might be a couple of spare points, which are best on more Crack Shots. Blount could use one, and it'd also be nice on Arvel. He won't get the block every time, and even then, Crack Shot is a nice tool to push damage.

12 minutes ago, theBitterFig said:

I'm not a huge Chopper/Elusive fan, and particularly on Corran (since he's got such great overlap with R2 Astromechs, and those turns when you can double-up on disarm tokens). I think it's also really hard to afford the action loss, both to use Chopper, or to pull reds to refill Elusive. E-Wings really kind of need their focus tokens.

However, there really isn't anything to trim. Taking Z-95s without Blount, taking lower A-Wings with fewer upgrades doesn't really make sense.

I think if I wanted to run these 5 ships, I'd change Corran's layout entirely. I think I'd go with R3 Astromech for double locks. Love R3 when I was flying Torpedo Knaves. That forces less of a commitment on approach, and allows him to be a bit more opportunistic. On top of that, I'd consider swapping FCS for Predator. Corran wants bullseye anyhow, and close to half the value of a lock is in the first rerolled die anyhow. If not Predator, then just Crack Shot.

Depending on whether keeping FCS, there might be a couple of spare points, which are best on more Crack Shots. Blount could use one, and it'd also be nice on Arvel. He won't get the block every time, and even then, Crack Shot is a nice tool to push damage.

Thanks for the input, and yeh there isn't much in the way of wiggle room on the build

at this point the list is packed, but I'll throw a copy of Predator and R3 astro in the case and see what I fancy flying in the morning.

As a Corran fan, I give you my thumbs up! I used the Elusive/Chopper combo for a long time, but I prefered AS instead of FCS, as I could spend the elusive charge before getting it back by doing a red. Having Jake there for the focus can mitigate the downside of being tokenless. Against swarms you can dance pretty well with AS, even getting your action before bumping into someone you want to bump. I also enjoyed getting a TL on a R0 target before doing a segnor and being able to fire that ship. I was also able to recharge a proton torpedo once, which was awesome! After many many games playing that build I decided to go for the FCS, R2 + spare parts route, and it performed quite better in my opinion, but a lot less fun...

I'd suggest you try it, and tell us how it went.

13 hours ago, theBitterFig said:

I'm not a huge Chopper/Elusive fan, and particularly on Corran (since he's got such great overlap with R2 Astromechs, and those turns when you can double-up on disarm tokens). I think it's also really hard to afford the action loss, both to use Chopper, or to pull reds to refill Elusive. E-Wings really kind of need their focus tokens.

However, there really isn't anything to trim. Taking Z-95s without Blount, taking lower A-Wings with fewer upgrades doesn't really make sense.

I think if I wanted to run these 5 ships, I'd change Corran's layout entirely. I think I'd go with R3 Astromech for double locks. Love R3 when I was flying Torpedo Knaves. That forces less of a commitment on approach, and allows him to be a bit more opportunistic. On top of that, I'd consider swapping FCS for Predator. Corran wants bullseye anyhow, and close to half the value of a lock is in the first rerolled die anyhow. If not Predator, then just Crack Shot.

Depending on whether keeping FCS, there might be a couple of spare points, which are best on more Crack Shots. Blount could use one, and it'd also be nice on Arvel. He won't get the block every time, and even then, Crack Shot is a nice tool to push damage.

I think building Corran around his ability in second edition is a bit of a trap, having played him that way a few times.

Trying to line up bullseye for double taps and maximise around those two shots often comes at the cost of making the most of normal full arc shots.

He's an I5 with a 1e TIE Defender statline and one of the best dials in the game if you give him R4. Play him with only that in mind and he's a really solid pilot.

In my, admittedly limited, experience with him it's better to just set up a lock with the E-Wing's ability, pursue, focus on the engagement turn and rely on a fully modded with optional FCS normal shot. Then use his dial and natively full action bar to disengage. He shoots early, so you have a decent chance of deciding to keep your focus for defence, which is solid on 3 greens.

The much maligned linked action is really not bad if you use a 5 straight and boost to disengage, taking a lock to set up the next pass and then clearing the stress with an R4 hard 2 to get back into the fight next turn.

Take the double tap if and when you get it. The synergy with R2 comes at the expense of an amazing dial or a second lock to keep your target choice flexible. And personally I think it's better to take an attack of opportunity and not get hit yourself before disengaging instead of letting yourself get hit for a double tap and hoping you take little enough damage that R2 can regen it.

In the spirit of treating Corran's ability as opportunistic, I think Marksmanship works well on him. If you've got two shots landing at least a damage each - the ideal scenario for his double tap - then making that two crits is surprisingly powerful. I'd agree that Crack Shot is, as ever thanks to being cheap, a solid choice. You might only get one double tap a game, and CS can be paired with FCS and a focus to give strong mods on both attacks without too much required of you for setup.

Don't reposition for bullseye with Corran unless you're also dodging all arcs by doing so. It isn't worth losing the focus or evade. Don't waste points trying to maximise a double tap that may simply never happen.

Took the FCS/Pred/R3 in the end

Ok game one down, a 133/200 loss Vs a Seer Swarm, I completely mis-played Arvel into the first engagement, my bandit killed 2 full health vultures in consecutive turns. Then my lack of practice with the list showed and I had two horrible turns of self bumping, let's see what round 2 brings.....

Ok round 2 Vs RAC and Rexla - lost 54/200.

RAC was on 1 hp but I lost Corran and Jake too early.

Into lunch 0-2, let's see if I can scrape a win today?

Not looking good, now 0-3

Game 3 was Vs Kylo, Blackout, Muse.

Managed to get Muse of the table quickly (bio-hex codes and squadleader needed to die) and got Blackout down to 1 hull both for no loss. Then I preceded to get arc-dodged every turn and picked apart. 3 turns in a row with no shots due to the silencers double repositioning after Corran wasn't a great feeling.

Ok round 4 - yeh didn't manage a win.

Up against Kath and Emmon, that matchup hurt - managed to get it down to Emon Vs Corran and misjudged the firesprays last move to endup getting shot up for with no return shot

A little bit off topic, but... Going out of comfort zone and with an E-Wing to boot gave me this idea:

• Braylen Stramm
• Jake Farrell: Composure, Predator
• "Dutch" Vander: Dorsal Turret
• Gavin Darklighter: FCS, R4 Astromech

You have double mods on everything most of the time. Braylen just needs to Focus > Roll for his. E-Wing can acquire Locks on Range 1 thanks to Y-Wing. A-Wing flies around and can share Focus Tokens to Y-Wing if possible, if not just aim Bullseye for some pew pew pew. Turret allows Y-Wing to fly around the battle and mitigates it's poor maneuverability. Anything shooting things is E-Wings arc can swap a Hit to a Crit as well, for free.

17 minutes ago, Schanez said:

A little bit off topic, but... Going out of comfort zone and with an E-Wing to boot gave me this idea:

• Braylen Stramm
• Jake Farrell: Composure, Predator
• "Dutch" Vander: Dorsal Turret
• Gavin Darklighter: FCS, R4 Astromech

You have double mods on everything most of the time. Braylen just needs to Focus > Roll for his. E-Wing can acquire Locks on Range 1 thanks to Y-Wing. A-Wing flies around and can share Focus Tokens to Y-Wing if possible, if not just aim Bullseye for some pew pew pew. Turret allows Y-Wing to fly around the battle and mitigates it's poor maneuverability. Anything shooting things is E-Wings arc can swap a Hit to a Crit as well, for free.

Not a bad little list, though I have to say that the E-wings inability to lock at range 1 wasn't an issue at all in the tournament, FCS+Predator+Focus and the choice of two targets (in 3 of my games, I only had 2 target's) means that you don't need to spend the lock most of the time. I'm now 100% a believer that the E-wing should have R3 mechs stapled to them.

I have a feeling this isn't the end of my E-wing experiment, the ship IS fun to fly, and three of my games yesterday could so easily have swung the other way (the last game being decided by a 50/50 call on a left or right bank, I guessed wrong). Though I'm definitely looking at other wingmates, and possibly getting both my E-wings on the table

22 hours ago, Surak said:

Not a bad little list, though I have to say that the E-wings inability to lock at range 1 wasn't an issue at all in the tournament, FCS+Predator+Focus and the choice of two targets (in 3 of my games, I only had 2 target's) means that you don't need to spend the lock most of the time. I'm now 100% a believer that the E-wing should have R3 mechs stapled to them.

I have a feeling this isn't the end of my E-wing experiment, the ship IS fun to fly, and three of my games yesterday could so easily have swung the other way (the last game being decided by a 50/50 call on a left or right bank, I guessed wrong). Though I'm definitely looking at other wingmates, and possibly getting both my E-wings on the table

My problem with R3 Astromech on an E-Wing is that Red 1 Hard. And honestly, with FCS I would feel like Predator is a waste of points. You can only reroll a die once and with three dice, and you always trying to aim the bullseye just in case, the times one will be pointless will be aplenty. Don't get me wrong, it is a great droid for an E-Wing, especially one with FCS. But an R4 turns the E-Wing into a godly knife fighter, I'd argue for an R4 with a Predator and that's it.

Good luck in your testing! I am putting my Imperial Aces idea through some heavy flying myself. Left my Tie Swarm comfort zone as well

2 minutes ago, Schanez said:

My problem with R3 Astromech on an E-Wing is that Red 1 Hard. And honestly, with FCS I would feel like Predator is a waste of points. You can only reroll a die once and with three dice, and you always trying to aim the bullseye just in case, the times one will be pointless will be aplenty. Don't get me wrong, it is a great droid for an E-Wing, especially one with FCS. But an R4 turns the E-Wing into a godly knife fighter, I'd argue for an R4 with a Predator and that's it.

Good luck in your testing! I am putting my Imperial Aces idea through some heavy flying myself. Left my Tie Swarm comfort zone as well

I can absolutely see your argument, but in every single match on Saturday I needed both FCS and Predator to push damage through with Corran (and even then it wasn't always enough) - the number of times I rolled blank-blank-paint was just silly.

If I wanted to trim some points, or had a bit more faith in my dice (yes it's probably mostly a perception thing, but in my community my dice luck has become (in)famously bad) I would definitely switch to R4's.

At the moment I'm playing with these as ideas

E-wing test 1

(66) Corran Horn [E-wing]
(3) R3 Astromech
(2) Fire-Control System
(2) Predator
Points: 73

(61) Gavin Darklighter [E-wing]
(3) R3 Astromech
(2) Fire-Control System
(2) Predator
Points: 68

(55) Wedge Antilles [T-65 X-wing]
(0) Servomotor S-foils
(2) Predator
Points: 57

Total points: 198

Or

E-wing test 2

(66) Corran Horn [E-wing]
(3) R3 Astromech
(2) Fire-Control System
(2) Predator
Points: 73

(61) Gavin Darklighter [E-wing]
(3) R3 Astromech
(2) Fire-Control System
(2) Predator
Points: 68

(49) Bodhi Rook [UT-60D U-wing]
(0) Pivot Wing
(6) Leia Organa
(2) Fire-Control System
(2) Predator
Points: 59

Total points: 200

Or

E-wing test 3

(66) Corran Horn [E-wing]
(3) R3 Astromech
(2) Fire-Control System
(2) Predator
Points: 73

(61) Gavin Darklighter [E-wing]
(3) R3 Astromech
(2) Fire-Control System
(2) Predator
Points: 68

(55) Norra Wexley [ARC-170 Starfighter]
(4) Veteran Tail Gunner
Points: 59

Total points: 200

Hopefully I'll get chance to test these before the next tournament

2 hours ago, Surak said:

(...)the number of times I rolled blank-blank-paint was just silly.(...)

Tell me about it... My "Duchess" loved to roll Blank - Blank - Focus when all I had was a Fifth Brother Force Charge to mod my dice... Now I slapped her with Targeting Computer and suddenly she throws Hit - Hit - Hit and does not allow me to push those Crits through... Dice, I'm telling you!

2 hours ago, Surak said:

(...)

At the moment I'm playing with these as ideas

E-wing test 1

(66) Corran Horn [E-wing]
(3) R3 Astromech
(2) Fire-Control System
(2) Predator
Points: 73

(61) Gavin Darklighter [E-wing]
(3) R3 Astromech
(2) Fire-Control System
(2) Predator
Points: 68

(55) Wedge Antilles [T-65 X-wing]
(0) Servomotor S-foils
(2) Predator
Points: 57

Total points: 198

Or

E-wing test 2

(66) Corran Horn [E-wing]
(3) R3 Astromech
(2) Fire-Control System
(2) Predator
Points: 73

(61) Gavin Darklighter [E-wing]
(3) R3 Astromech
(2) Fire-Control System
(2) Predator
Points: 68

(49) Bodhi Rook [UT-60D U-wing]
(0) Pivot Wing
(6) Leia Organa
(2) Fire-Control System
(2) Predator
Points: 59

Total points: 200

Or

E-wing test 3

(66) Corran Horn [E-wing]
(3) R3 Astromech
(2) Fire-Control System
(2) Predator
Points: 73

(61) Gavin Darklighter [E-wing]
(3) R3 Astromech
(2) Fire-Control System
(2) Predator
Points: 68

(55) Norra Wexley [ARC-170 Starfighter]
(4) Veteran Tail Gunner
Points: 59

Total points: 200

Hopefully I'll get chance to test these before the next tournament

I really like the U-Wing list. I am not quite sure, if the pilot ability would overwrite the ship ability, but if it does, ****... That's a very difficult decision, who to target there. Leia Organa is just so good, that people might focus the U-Wing over your damage dealers.

40 minutes ago, Schanez said:

I really like the U-Wing list. I am not quite sure, if the pilot ability would overwrite the ship ability, but if it does, ****... That's a very difficult decision, who to target there. Leia Organa is just so good, that people might focus the U-Wing over your damage dealers

Yeh the U-wing list is definitely the front-runner of the three, then the Arc, then Wedge.

I will definitely report back as I get them on the table

2 hours ago, Schanez said:

I really like the U-Wing list. I am not quite sure, if the pilot ability would overwrite the ship ability, but if it does, ****... That's a very difficult decision, who to target there. Leia Organa is just so good, that people might focus the U-Wing over your damage dealers.

It doesn't work for range 1 locks. "If a card ability uses the word “cannot,” that effect is absolute and cannot be overridden by other effects." (RR 1.06, p. 2, Golden Rules).

//

Recently, I've been thinking about 2x Rogue E-Wings with Crack Shot and R3 Astromech. They're 58 points each, and that'd leave 84 for something else. So what is that? Nearly un-upgraded Han or Lando YT1300? Stacked Corran? Stacked Luke? Miranda (with bombs? with Hotshot Gunner?) + Blount? A cheap blocker (Tala, for example) and Wedge or a 3rd E-Wing?

7 hours ago, theBitterFig said:

Recently, I've been thinking about 2x Rogue E-Wings with Crack Shot and R3 Astromech. They're 58 points each, and that'd leave 84 for something else. So what is that? Nearly un-upgraded Han or Lando YT1300? Stacked Corran? Stacked Luke? Miranda (with bombs? with Hotshot Gunner?) + Blount? A cheap blocker (Tala, for example) and Wedge or a 3rd E-Wing?

Drop the crack shots and make it lando with Nunb. 85pts and worth every pt. Such a nice ship and fits the Boom n zoom archetype well

@theBitterFig thanks for the rules clarification, it wasn't the main reason for Bohdi, but it's certainly something that would have come up in play.

@Amc879 The Lando falcon sounds like a fun wingmate to two E-wings,

I've done a bit of a review of what worked and what didn't from the tournament and come up with this;

E-wing +mini-swarm

(66) Corran Horn [E-wing]
(3) R3 Astromech
(2) Fire-Control System
(2) Predator
Points: 73

(30) Lieutenant Blount [Z-95-AF4 Headhunter]
(3) Swarm Tactics
Points: 33

(23) Bandit Squadron Pilot [Z-95-AF4 Headhunter]
Points: 23

(23) Bandit Squadron Pilot [Z-95-AF4 Headhunter]
Points: 23

(23) Bandit Squadron Pilot [Z-95-AF4 Headhunter]
Points: 23

(23) Bandit Squadron Pilot [Z-95-AF4 Headhunter]
Points: 23

Total points: 198

This basically doubles down on the bandit+Blount pairing that actually caused most of my damage output, and I'm actually really happy with how the Corran build did once you remove the dice variance from the equation.

I have no idea if it's good, but it looks very cool.

7 hours ago, Amc879 said:

Drop the crack shots and make it lando with Nunb. 85pts and worth every pt. Such a nice ship and fits the Boom n zoom archetype well

Maybe. But Crack Shot pushes damage and I don't really want to give it up.

Maybe I'd try to make a go at Lando without it... or maybe just Han... But Lando can be really handy. His pilot ability does some cool stuff. Really cool stuff with Corran in particular, like boosting him into a lock into a 4-straight to really spice up an opening.

Corran Horn (66)
Crack Shot (1)
Fire-Control System (2)
R3 Astromech (3)

Ship total: 72 Half Points: 36 Threshold: 3

Lando Calrissian (80)
Nien Nunb (5)

Ship total: 85 Half Points: 43 Threshold: 7

Jake Farrell (36)
Crack Shot (1)

Ship total: 37 Half Points: 19 Threshold: 2


Total: 194

View in Yet Another Squad Builder 2.0: https://raithos.github.io/?f=Rebel Alliance&d=v8ZsZ200Z21X116W113WW4WY43XWWWW52WWWY50X116WW&sn=Unnamed Squadron&obs=

That's what I've been toying with; being able to engage with TL+focus on Lando and TL+Focus+evade on Corran is potent. I'm not sure whether or not having only 6 points of bid is worth bothering with, but further testing should sort that out.

4 hours ago, Nyxen said:

That's what I've been toying with; being able to engage with TL+focus on Lando and TL+Focus+evade on Corran is potent. I'm not sure whether or not having only 6 points of bid is worth bothering with, but further testing should sort that out.

I'd just slap Jake with Predator for double mods as well. You have 5 - 5 - 4 when it comes to initiative, so... I don't think you need bid that much. Swarms move before you either way. Aces shoot first as well. Maybe for the 5s, but then... Ehh...

59 minutes ago, Schanez said:

I'd just slap Jake with Predator for double mods as well. You have 5 - 5 - 4 when it comes to initiative, so... I don't think you need bid that much. Swarms move before you either way. Aces shoot first as well. Maybe for the 5s, but then... Ehh...

Fair points, but my main worry there is republic regen as Obi-Wan and Plo are both popular, and squirrelly, additions at I5.

4 minutes ago, Nyxen said:

Fair points, but my main worry there is republic regen as Obi-Wan and Plo are both popular, and squirrelly, additions at I5.

We see quite a few I5 pilots around here as well - in fact a 3+ point bid at the weekend would have possibly won me my third game as Corran would have been moving after blackout and Kylo

Ah yeah... Obi and Plo. Well considering the point rebalance coming January, I wouldn't worry too much about those lists in the long run. If you want to outbid the Jedi, you are looking at some 10 points of bid at least. With those ships, that's not possible. Maybe if you swap Lando for something else. Or...

• Wedge Antilles: Crack Shot, R2 Astro
• Lando Calrissian: Nien Nunb, Leia Organa
• Jake Farrell: Crack Shot, Predator

That's a 10 point bid with a 6 - 5 - 4 Initiative and a lot of Action economy. Frees up Jake to fly around doing whatever he wants. Can sub Leia for Jyn Erso and sntach Millenium Falcon title for the rerolls.

9 hours ago, Nyxen said:

Corran Horn (66)
Crack Shot (1)
Fire-Control System (2)
R3 Astromech (3)

Ship total: 72 Half Points: 36 Threshold: 3

Lando Calrissian (80)
Nien Nunb (5)

Ship total: 85 Half Points: 43 Threshold: 7

Jake Farrell (36)
Crack Shot (1)

Ship total: 37 Half Points: 19 Threshold: 2


Total: 194

View in Yet Another Squad Builder 2.0: https://raithos.github.io/?f=Rebel Alliance&d=v8ZsZ200Z21X116W113WW4WY43XWWWW52WWWY50X116WW&sn=Unnamed Squadron&obs=

That's what I've been toying with; being able to engage with TL+focus on Lando and TL+Focus+evade on Corran is potent. I'm not sure whether or not having only 6 points of bid is worth bothering with, but further testing should sort that out.

Lando and Corran are fun together. Probably works better with a 3rd ship like a Jake than loading everything to the gills.

I'd also just go 4 points of bid and add Predator to Jake. Bid is nice, but I don't think the 4-6 difference is that huge.