Ok, so this is a bit of a battle report, but also a squad list post, general epic/huge chatter and maybe even a rules question or two. So didn't really know where to put it. I also added some interesting observations in the lessons learned at the end. So it might be interesting to some of you.

Big wall post.... but I'm excited about the game.

Played my first huge ship game last night, 500 points Scum vs. Empire. We opted for a simple head-to-head deathmatch because we already had to keep track of new rules for wings and huge ships we didn't want to keep track of scenario as well.

My List:

I went wing crazy. Mostly to get a good feel of how wings work, move and placement etc.

• z-95 wing: - [99 total]
  • N'dru Shulak, Veteran Wing Leader, Afterburners, Expert Handling [41]
  • 2x Binayre Pirate, Cluster Missiles [29]
• Y-wing wing: - [112 total]
  • Drea Renthal, Veteran Wing Leader, Ion Cannon Turret, Veteran Turret Gunner, R4-Astromech [66]
  • Crymorah Goon, Ion Cannon Turret, Veteran Turret Gunner, R4-Astromech [46]
• Starviper wing: - [184 total]
  • Guri, Veteran Wing Leader, Afterburners, Advanced Sensors, Predator [84]
  • 2x Black Sun Assassin, Predator [50]

• C-ROC - [105 total]
  • Jamming Beam - 0
  • Tibanna Reserves - 3
  • Corsair Refit - 15
  • 0-0-0 - 5
  • IG-88D - 3
  • Targeting Battery - 9
  • Concussion Missiles - 6
  • IG-RM Droids - 2
  • Broken Horn - 4
• 500 points total

Choices: So Drea is in there because, guess what C-ROC pilot is non-limited. So rerolls on huge ship attacks. This lead me to take quite a number of non-limited wingmen.
N'dru is there purely for the initiative boost. With afterburners and a white barrel roll he can drag the pirates quite a bit making a target lock on them much more viable than on initiative 1.
Guri, well, she is one of the most maneuverable ships in the game, the wingmen adds additional firepower and health, even though the wing is a bit of a gamble because of the higher cost.
C-Roc loadout was the hardest. First game and all I wanted to test everything. 88D was there purely for the double calculate, but will see future play along with 88B in the fleet.
Jamming beam was a last moment addition, because 0 points and I have the slot. But keep reading.

Opponents List:

He went very light on the actual fleet, using mostly generics with minimum upgrades, and full blown on the raider.

• 2x Onyx Squadron Ace, Dreadnought Hunter. [85x2]
• 2x Storm Squadron Ace, Fire-Control System. [42x2]
• 1x Nu Squadron Pilot, Os-1, Diamon-Boron Missiles [38]
• Fully loaded Raider [208]
  • Boosted Scanner - 8
  • Captain Needa - 8
  • Turbolaser Battery - 15
  • Ordnance Tubes - 2
  • Concussion Missiles - 6
  • Ordnance Team - 4
  • Bombardment Specialists - 6
  • Corvus - 3
  • Adv. Proton Torpedoes - 6
• 500 points total

Deployment:

Opponent had initiative, so he deployed Nu-Squadron to his left, and then the Defenders together just right of centre. I put down the starvipers far on my left, with the rest of my force around the C-Roc. Opponent then put down the Raider (with the two tie advanced docked) facing my C-ROC. I was actually quite surprised how empty the table looked at this point.

Turn 1:

Nu-Squadron does a 3 left turn, followed by a 3 right turn slam trying to get to my flank. Defenders did a 3 bank turning towards my C-ROC.
I went in quite aggressive. Y-wings went 3 forward. Plan was to try and intercept the dreadnaught aggressors before they go full out on my C-ROC. Also to ignore the Raider turn 1 and kill support ships. So N'dru went 4 forward, followed by afterburner boost and then a roll to the left away from the raider. As planned this put the pirates in range for target locking. In the meantime Guri also dailed a 4 straight, but since the defenders had already turned away at this point I used advanced sensors to roll right-back first, then 4 fwd also followed by afterburner boost. [Edit. Doh! Couldn't have boosted after using advanced sensors. Thanks @Hiemfire for pointing it out]

C-ROC also went 3 fwd, wanting to make use of the extra evade gained and getting R3 of some ships.

Lastly Raider went 1 fwd. Opponent seemed quite stunned by how short a 1 fwd on a capital ship looks.

With my shooting I was able to take the shields of one defender. And the Y-Wings and C-ROC killed the Nu-Squadron pilot. Shooting the targeting battery first, then using a fully modded normal attack worked well. In return one Z-95 was taken down to 1 hull. Defenders were out of range 3 from the C-ROC, so no dreadnaught shots yet. (Dice was on fire for me. I rolled a lot of hits and opponent a lot of blanks).

Turn 2:

Both Tie Advanced deployed, one from fron and one from side of Raider, both turning towards Guri. Defenders moved closer to C-ROC. Z-95s overshot the defenders with right bank, afterburner boosted again to the right to get behind that nasty middle line of the Raider. Guri managed to pull her wing behind the defenders. Y-Wings banked towards the Raider, using the wing concept to jump my wingman over an asteroid.

C-ROC did a 0 move, not wanting to get too close too soon, because I doubted a huge ship can turn around in a game. At 45 degree banks a 180 will take 4 turns. I did double calculate (IG88) and reinforced front.

Raider did a unexpected left bank. It was now facing my y-wings head on, but had its back to most of my force. It target locked Drea (also gaining 2 calculate tokens as part of the same action, great economy), and Jammed one starviper.

Because of my 0 move the defenders ended up still being out of range 3. One tie advanced also ended up out of R3 from anything. So my opponent only had 1 tie advanced and the Raider shooting, while all my ships had shots.

I managed to kill one Tie advanced, and strip off all the shields from the Raider. In return I lost one shield on Y-Wing and 1 on Starviper. Here we also had an interesting effect from Precision shot as discussed here:

The precision shot caused 2 jams on the raider AND flipped his ordnance hardpoint. Leaving him with only the normal shot, and turbolaser.

I also discovered how amazing Jamming beam can be at the right time. The C-ROC shoots before the Raider. And in this layout the raider had a ton of weapons that all depended on having a target lock. So strip the target lock, and no pain! It basically reduced the raider to taking its primary attack only. Now make no mistake, at R1 and bullseye that shot rolls a lot of dice, but its still just the one shot.

Turn 3.

Things started getting quite crowded now. All my ships were basically facing the Raider. And both the huge ships were facing each other.

Y-wings were in for a hard time, face-to-face with the Raider, so a collusion was going to be hard to avoid. I did a 1 bank hoping for him to stand still. Defenders went for the C-ROC, while the Starvipers continued their pursuit of the defenders in return. Z-95s made a right turn and roll away from the Raider.

C-ROC did a 3 bank left. I was once again trying to have the 1 evade die, and thinking that I might hit the defenders and interrupt their plans. Its more than 0. Again reinforce front and double calculate.

Raider banked back to its original course right over the Y-Wing wingman. But was only a 1-bank so Y-wing only lost a shield.

Foto was taken in middle of shooting, after Tie advanced already died.

N'dru and the vipers killed the advanced. (unmodded defense vs shooting at defender with evade and focus token).

C-ROC, binary pirate and Drea did quite a number on the Raider. Think about 3 crits and 3 normal damage. (so in the bigger picture still not really much. 20 hull is a LOT). But once again I used the Jamming beam against the Raider stripping the calculates.

Raider and defenders got some shots in on the C-ROC, but took my shields and did 2 normal damage. Between the single evade die and the reinforce I managed to mitigate quite a bit.

Turn 4

Both defenders were now close to the C-ROC, facing the same problem the Y-Wings had a turn ago. Face-to-face with a huge ship. One banked left and one right trying to go around.

Y-wings surrounded one defender.

My Z-95 wing split up, one turning towards the raider, the other making a miraculous move across an asteroid, but somehow just missing my Y-Wing as well as the opposing Defender.

Starvipers moved to stay behind the defenders.

C-ROC turned back towards the raider, bumping the defender that banked right out of the way. Once again miraculously missing the Raider. There was literally about 2mm between the two huge ships. (I was actually hoping for a collusion from the Raider, because it had a face-up crit stating it takes 2 addional crit dmg if it overlaps another ship/object) Opponent placed the Defender in between my fleet and the C-ROC.

Raider didn't move, so no extra free crits.

Starvipers killed one defender, but not before it managed to get 2 more dmg on the C-ROC.

C-ROC, Z-95 and Y-wing plinked Raider a bit, but once again I hit it with the Jamming beam stripping the calculates (I made the mistake of leaving the target lock)

Raider hit the C-ROC with range 1 proton torpedo and range 1 bullseye primary... and somehow only managed to put through 2 or 3 non-crit damage. Game called after that shot.

Foto taken after red Defender was destroyed.

*EDIT. Oh. Obiously this is my very one sided view of the battle. Opponent may have a completely different perspective. That being said, it was a fun game and I thank him for it!

Lessons learned (in no particular order)

• 500 points sounds a lot, but it really fills up fast. I suspect in 300 points a raider would suffer without proper support.
• 6 Obstacles is probably too few for a 6x3 table (although one of the epic battle scenarios uses this, which is what we used for our deployment zones and obstacle number)
• Against huge ships Jamming can be quite devastating. The fact that the C-ROC shoots before the raider, and this particular raider really depended on the Target Lock for its additional shots was amazing. Also the C-ROC survived a lot on the reinforce. One Jam could have removed that.
• Turbolaser requires a target lock. Yes it's obvious, it's right there on the card. But easily missed.
• The Huge ship bank moves are actually quite massive, the tail-end swing is also surprisingly big if you don't expect it. The Straight moves on the other hand seems quite small.
• Precision shot mechanic is counter intuitive. In turn 3 the C-ROC got one of the bullseye crits. I'm in the Raiders bullseye, it is far from mine. But the effect triggers.
• Wing economy is amazing. Having a wing leader that can boost/barrel roll, and then just drag the rest with AND then let low initiative pilots take target lock effectively at higher initiative is just awesome.
• Guri is amazing wing leader. Even though I goofed up one turn, all the rest were legit, and was still really good. I think she might also be the only pilot (or rather Starvipers are the only ships) that can actually barrel roll using advanced sensors without overlapping the wingmen. The banked-roll they do just nicely fits over the wingman.

18 minutes ago, Bort said:

In the meantime Guri also dailed a 4 straight, but since the defenders had already turned away at this point I used advanced sensors to roll right-back first, then 4 fwd also followed by afterburner boost.

You goofed a bit here. The boost from Afterburners is an action and Advanced Sensors blocks all other actions for the rest of that ship's Activation Phase.

7 minutes ago, Hiemfire said:

You goofed a bit here. The boost from Afterburners is an action and Advanced Sensors blocks all other actions for the rest of that ship's Activation Phase.

Ohhh.... right. Doh! I need to fly Guri a bit more to get used to all the option combinations. She can do so much its hard to keep track. I remember not to take other actions, but for some reason the boost from afterburner slipped through.

3 hours ago, Bort said:

• 6 Obstacles is probably too few for a 6x3 table (although one of the epic battle scenarios uses this, which is what we used for our deployment zones and obstacle number)

For 6' x 3' you are supposed to use 12 obstacles. The one scenario is just written silly, as it instructs you to use " Obstacles per side : 6" and therefore also 12 in total.

1 minute ago, Singulativ said:

For 6' x 3' you are supposed to use 12 obstacles. The one scenario is just written silly, as it instructs you to use " Obstacles per side : 6" and therefore also 12 in total.

Oh ok cool. As we weren't planning on playing the actual scenario I didn't pay too much attention.

6 hours ago, Bort said:

Y-wing wing: - [112 total]

• Drea Renthal, Veteran Wing Leader, Ion Cannon Turret, Veteran Turret Gunner, R4-Astromech [66]
• Crymorah Goon, Ion Cannon Turret, Veteran Turret Gunner, R4-Astromech [46]

Small remark: a legal wing has to "consist of one wing leader and two to fve wingmates."

Drea Renthal as wing leader of one other y-wing ist not a wing (at least at setup).

Excellent report. It's nice to see that your lessons learned seem to be aligning with my projections and experience. It's gratifying to see that range control is as important for huges as it is for standard ships. Also, I'm willing to bet that your opponent would have been much happier with Targeting Battery over Turbolaser! Can't strip a lock I don't have yet...

You also mentioned how empty the table looked. I wonder if one table is too cramped for 500 a side, or table-and-a-half. Two tables are vast enough that 800 a side can still devolve into two mini-games if people deploy in corners.

1 minute ago, ChahDresh said:

You also mentioned how empty the table looked. I wonder if one table is too cramped for 500 a side, or table-and-a-half. Two tables are vast enough that 800 a side can still devolve into two mini-games if people deploy in corners.

You could adjust the deployment zones accordingly and allow deployment only at the central 3' length of the 6' side of the play area.

8 hours ago, Bort said:

Lessons learned (in no particular order)

• 500 points sounds a lot, but it really fills up fast. I suspect in 300 points a raider would suffer without proper support.

I've found 350 pts per side is a good number for a 3x3 mat match.

Also, one thing I was doing wrong is, if you have two actions that link into calculate, you can't calculate twice since you can only perform any specific action once. Like using Bombard Team and then Ordnance Team you can only net 1 Calc (unless you have like a IG88D or C3PO).

On 12/4/2019 at 7:51 PM, mcintma said:

I've found 350 pts per side is a good number for a 3x3 mat match.

Also, one thing I was doing wrong is, if you have two actions that link into calculate, you can't calculate twice since you can only perform any specific action once. Like using Bombard Team and then Ordnance Team you can only net 1 Calc (unless you have like a IG88D or C3PO).

Yup. Just because the Huge ship has 2x actions doesn't mean it is excluded from the no-2x of same action rule that applies to all ships. Actually did come up in our game as well.

On 12/4/2019 at 5:41 PM, Singulativ said:

Small remark: a legal wing has to "consist of one wing leader and two to fve wingmates."

Drea Renthal as wing leader of one other y-wing ist not a wing (at least at setup).

So another goof up. Oh boy.

That does make me sad though. Because I only own 2x of most small ships.

Now the only wings I can make are z-95, starviper and M3-A. So Guri and Serissu are good options, but beyond that I have nothing.

On 12/4/2019 at 6:48 PM, ChahDresh said:

Excellent report. It's nice to see that your lessons learned seem to be aligning with my projections and experience. It's gratifying to see that range control is as important for huges as it is for standard ships. Also, I'm willing to bet that your opponent would have been much happier with Targeting Battery over Turbolaser! Can't strip a lock I don't have yet...

Well, actually you can. If you dump a load of jam tokens on him his target lock will vanish the moment he gets it.

16 hours ago, Bort said:

Well, actually you can. If you dump a load of jam tokens on him his target lock will vanish the moment he gets it.

Aren't negative tokens removed with energy though?

49 minutes ago, Wintercross said:

Aren't negative tokens removed with energy though?

Only stress tokens are.

4 hours ago, Hiemfire said:

Only stress tokens are.

Huh, I was under the impression it was more than just stress =/

On 12/4/2019 at 9:48 AM, Bort said:

Deployment:

Opponent had initiative, so he deployed Nu-Squadron to his left, and then the Defenders together just right of centre. I put down the starvipers far on my left, with the rest of my force around the C-Roc. Opponent then put down the Raider (with the two tie advanced docked) facing my C-ROC. I was actually quite surprised how empty the table looked at this point.

Another note: the huge ships are placed BEFORE all other ships. It makes a lot of sense if you think of it (the huge ship simply may not fit in the place, which you planned to put it, if you placed all other ships before that).

From rules reference, pdf page 32: Place Forces: Place huge ships before all other ships. If there are multiple huge ships, they are placed in descending order according to their initiative value

You never forget your first huge ship.

17 hours ago, Jedu said:

Another note: the huge ships are placed BEFORE all other ships. It makes a lot of sense if you think of it (the huge ship simply may not fit in the place, which you planned to put it, if you placed all other ships before that).

From rules reference, pdf page 32: Place Forces: Place huge ships before all other ships. If there are multiple huge ships, they are placed in descending order according to their initiative value

Haha. Ironically I remembered seeing something like this in the rules while reading it, only I had it the exact opposite way. I (for some unknown reason) believed that the Huge ships deploy last, which is what we incorrectly did. It also makes for a completely different game plan, since huge ships is a big focus point.

On 12/7/2019 at 4:40 AM, Wintercross said:

Huh, I was under the impression it was more than just stress =/

That was going to be how things worked, according to a live stream that was done. But between that live stream and launch they changed their minds.

4 hours ago, Faerie1979 said:

That was going to be how things worked, according to a live stream that was done. But between that live stream and launch they changed their minds.

Equally likely is that they just misspoke on stream. Happens all the time. Like when Farmer sometimes says "Mynock Squadron Podcast." I honestly don't think they had time to change printing at that late stage of the game, so it's more likely to have just been a slip of the tongue.

4 hours ago, Parakitor said:

Equally likely is that they just misspoke on stream. Happens all the time. Like when Farmer sometimes says "Mynock Squadron Podcast." I honestly don't think they had time to change printing at that late stage of the game, so it's more likely to have just been a slip of the tongue.

Or a lapse into an earlier set of playtesting rules. That happens, too-- experiments that were rejected linger on in memory.