After the last points update Resistance 5 pretty much vanished from competitive play. I know Lulo got a price hike but it was untouched otherwise. Did the meta change or was the price increase on Lulo enough to make it non viable.

Frankly?

Resistance players probably got sick of it.

Speaking as a Resistance Player, it didn't come down to one specific thing.

First: The L'ulo price increase hurt its bid against other I5 ships, and it often struggled against lists with multiple I6 Aces (so the most popular Imperial lists). The list still works, but it requires a bit more care, and a lot of people are now using the AAXX format with different ships with different Initiatives.

Second: New options became available. People want to use new toys.

I still see it around and I'll throw it on the table now and then, but it's not one of my go-to lists any more.

Was it ever anything other than “alright”?

2 agility, no regen, tough to take on some of the current meta monsters.

I just made this weekend top4 Czech Grands (44 players) with Poe/Lulo/Tallissan/Finn.

Lulo is strong. Talli is cheap.

37 minutes ago, gennataos said:

Was it ever anything other than “alright”?

It made Top 32 I think at the UKSO last year. Maybe Top 16, I forget. It's one of those lists that either sank or swam based on the regional meta. As a contender for the meta on the world stage, however, "alright" is about right.

Just now, Oldpara said:

I just made this weekend top4 Czech Grands (44 players) with Poe/Lulo/Tallissan/Finn.

Lulo is strong. Talli is cheap.

Sure, but I'd also say you're also a better player than around 90% of X-Wingers

The lack of bid made it struggle to compete

Poe + 3

AAAAA

XXAA

XXXX

XXXPP

TTTTA

Poe X Leia T

Rey Poe

Vennie + 2

Looking at all that, I think most resistance players settle on 5A because of its monumental time on target, Poe + 3 because Poe is cool and it has a 6554 init line, or low/mid init beef variants that honestly seem like the most difficult possible Resistance archetype to use well. Anyone running XXXX would probably fair better with 5555 I think. Its still solid with excellent matchups in general and a ton of flexibility. It just needs to contend with better modified trip ace jouster lists which is an up hill battle for basically everything to compare to right now.

1 hour ago, Oldpara said:

I just made this weekend top4 Czech Grands (44 players) with Poe/Lulo/Tallissan/Finn.

Lulo is strong. Talli is cheap.

Of course you did!

Congratulations!

Ace meta learned to solve it.

If we're being honest, if you want to fly an all-i5 list, then Obi-Wan + Plo + Ric is strictly better in almost every way. The Republic ships have Force, can use said Force to fully-mod attacks on command, can double-reposition, have access to Sense, and the one who can't do any of that can token stack like a Defender. They also have more total HP if you factor in the regen.

The only advantage the Resistance list has is the extra arcs allowing it greater time on target, but that doesn't even come close to evening out all of the advantages the Republic ships have.

It disappeared during the solved meta of Quad Phantoms and Rebel Beef, as those two could out do it (and pretty much anything else). It didn't come back as Lu'lo went up losing the bid, and Jedi and CIS listed being super efficient smothered anyone who did bring it. And as @DR4CO said, if people are running I5's, they just run Rebulic I5s. They have equal to or greater maneuverability than the A-wings and the raw damage potential of the X-wings in all three ships. All that backed by passive mods, regen, and possibly Sense.

Also, if you were flying a Resistance list without Big Deal, you probably built the list wrong. Before or after the fact, Finn's is super strong for his super cheap cost.

18 hours ago, Stryker359 said:

I'd also say you're also a better player than around 90% of X-Wingers

I'd say that's an underestimation. More like 99+%.

1 hour ago, 5050Saint said:

if you were flying a Resistance list without Big Deal, you probably built the list wrong.

Blanket statements like that make me twitchy.

@gennataos Didn't you win a tournament like 6 weeks ago with Poe Snap Lulo?

1 hour ago, 5050Saint said:

Also, if you were flying a Resistance list without Big Deal, you probably built the list wrong. Before or after the fact, Finn's is super strong for his super cheap cost.

I really disagree. But I don't want to derail anything for another Finn discussion.

As others have mentioned, the better i5s are in the Republic faction. Ello and Nien just cant compete even with Lulo and Talli's help against those pesky Jedi. Even though they're at a lower cost, force is too good yo.

Looking at what's been more effective, it's actually been in Cova, Finn, Greer, Talli, Blue As, and Jess. Honestly most Resistance lists should probably start with either Cova, Greer and Finn and decide if Finn should be Fat Finn or cheap Heroic Finn to see if you want 4 or 5 ship OR it's 3+ As and fill in last two ships as either pods or 2 more As.

3 minutes ago, GreenDragoon said:

@gennataos Didn't you win a tournament like 6 weeks ago with Poe Snap Lulo?

Yeah, but it was a #tinytrial, only 20 people with zero "known name" players. I don't think that counts for much.

4 minutes ago, RStan said:

Honestly most Resistance lists should probably start with either Cova, Greer and Finn and decide if Finn should be Fat Finn or cheap Heroic Finn to see if you want 4 or 5 ship OR it's 3+ As and fill in last two ships as either pods or 2 more As.

...and then lose in the cut to the meta monsters.

I swapped to Poe AAA due to time on target and the fact that Greer is absolutely crazy good. I never really liked 5555 however, always just felt "okay" and not great. 5A was better, but I felt it lacked offence and struggled against 3 agility swarms, especially Vader/Soontir + friends, and especially if you couldn't kill Vader or friends before you started to loose A-wings. The Poe AAA, for me, ends up being my favorite list and most competitive hyperspace list in my arsenal. It's flexible, maneuverable, allows me to have 2 consistent win conditions (either Poe end game, or Tallie/Lulo end game). And,most importantly, it's tons of fun!

It's been in my bag for most of the year now and I can't see it leaving baring a points shake up that kills it. I'm hoping that doesn't happen.

This was honestly my favorite list but once L'ulo went up in points it became pretty difficult to make it work.

Also, Finn is one of my favorite characters but I'm kinda hoping that the Fireball becomes a better filler ship.

Awesome replies guys, it pretty much confirmed my suspicions about the list. all the all Fivers went to Republic, I would have as well if I didn't fall in love with this stupid quirky semi faction.

3 hours ago, RStan said:

Looking at what's been more effective, it's actually been in Cova, Finn, Greer, Talli, Blue As, and Jess. Honestly most Resistance lists should probably start with either Cova, Greer and Finn and decide if Finn should be Fat Finn or cheap Heroic Finn to see if you want 4 or 5 ship OR it's 3+ As and fill in last two ships as either pods or 2 more As.

I don't love it. I've tried a few variants based off the core 3 high performers (Finn/Cova/Greer) and going from there. but I feel they perform better in their main standard archetype lists vs working together. I personally think Finn is over rated. To the point where when I face him I leave him to last unless my opponent feeds him to me. Cova is scarier and harder to take down in my opinion. Greer is stupid good in a pack, but kind of lack luster in a vacuum.

4 minutes ago, Wiredin said:

I don't love it. I've tried a few variants based off the core 3 high performers (Finn/Cova/Greer) and going from there. but I feel they perform better in their main standard archetype lists vs working together. I personally think Finn is over rated. To the point where when I face him I leave him to last unless my opponent feeds him to me. Cova is scarier and harder to take down in my opinion. Greer is stupid good in a pack, but kind of lack luster in a vacuum.

I plan to test out a Cova/Finn/Greer/Talli/Rose 5 ship combo in the near future. Seems good when I look at it all built in YASB. Will have to see on the table. I haven't spent much time using 30 Finn, but I've heard it's still amazing value and you have less of the issue of what you're concerned about in the 4 ship.

2 hours ago, Flurpy said:

Awesome replies guys, it pretty much confirmed my suspicions about the list. all the all Fivers went to Republic, I would have as well if I didn't fall in love with this stupid quirky semi faction.

A few weeks ago in St. Louis, four of the six builds I played against were four ship Resistance lists.

I believe two of the four were a T-70 and three As, while two of them had Finn.

Stupid Resistance...

On 12/1/2019 at 11:43 AM, Oldpara said:

I just made this weekend top4 Czech Grands (44 players) with Poe/Lulo/Tallissan/Finn.

Lulo is strong. Talli is cheap.

Care to share any thoughts on how you set up Turn 0 and how you flew it?

3 hours ago, Mistborn_Jedi said:

Care to share any thoughts on how you set up Turn 0 and how you flew it?

Well, ships are fast so you can adjust tactics according what's on the table.

Finn is obvious target for the enemy, so knowing your opponent's target priority is your advantage.

Tallissan and Lulo deep fast flank, Finn slow roll in the middle, Poe on the second flank either to hit hard or to run away from the trap using double repositions + Black One.