I saw the suggestion of using Intensify Firepower with a swarm of Gunnery Team Hammerhead Scouts on CGYSO, and I'm assuming something like this or even identical to this has been tried numerous times before. Has anybody seen it in action? What's the weaknesses here? Squads?

Name: Untitled Fleet
Faction: Rebel
Commander: General Dodonna

Assault:
Defense:
Navigation:

6x Hammerhead Scout Corvette (41)
• Gunnery Team (7)
• Task Force Antilles (3)
= 51 Points (306 points total)

Pelta Assault Ship (56)

• General Dodonna (20)
• Ray Antilles (7)
• Intensify Firepower! (6)
= 89 Points

Squadrons:
= 0 Points

Total Points: 395

My suggestion is remove TFA on all 6, that frees up 18pts.

Change dodonna for cracken, rieekan or mothma

Then you can use the leftover for a higher bid

Ray could be replaced for a veteran captain and put Hondo on a hammerhead. This would alow the Pelta to do other commands. Could you squeeze projection experts in?

TFA could be replaced by 6 sets of D-Caps for a 50% fire bonus on one turn before things get closer or look to get a few QBTs to discourage fast flankers.

gotta take Opening Salvo as your red mission. Then maybe solar corona and Planetary ion cannon.

Wasn't the 3rd of 4th place list from last year's worlds like 8 Hammerheads with Leia?

5 hours ago, Mad Cat said:

Ray could be replaced for a veteran captain and put Hondo on a hammerhead. This would alow the Pelta to do other commands. Could you squeeze projection experts in?

...

gotta take Opening Salvo as your red mission. Then maybe solar corona and Planetary ion cannon.

This is good advice! Thanks a lot! Missions especially tends to puzzle me a bit, as I'm rather new to the game.

8 hours ago, DrakonLord said:

My suggestion is remove TFA on all 6, that frees up 18pts.

5 hours ago, Mad Cat said:

TFA could be replaced by 6 sets of D-Caps for a 50% fire bonus on one turn before things get closer or look to get a few QBTs to discourage fast flankers.

Seems like TFA isn't considered quite optimal? I kinda thought it would give the swarm some staying power, but it may be less effective than it looks on paper.

9 hours ago, DrakonLord said:

Change dodonna for cracken, rieekan or mothma

Due to the Hammerheads relative poor maneuver abilities, I envisioned reducing speed at engagement, and just trying to maintain front towards the enemy for as long as possible. I realize that if I were flying Cracken of Mothma, I'd probably have to go in with a different mentality.

Anyway, removing TFA and substituting Veteran Captain and Hondo for Ray gives me a total of 25 points to play with (including any bid). Cracken/Rieekan/Mothma would eat 6-10 of those and Disposable Capacitors 18
so it seems like I'd probably have to chose one or two of a better admiral, DCs and a bid. I'm struggling a bit to evaluate the effects of the suggested admirals vs the DCs. Rieekan could plausibly allow the fleet two extra attacks each turn after the point of contact, which could be 7 dice of offense for 3+ turns. That is considerable. DCs would give up to 12 additional dice on the first turn of firing only, which is far less, but early strikes are of course considerably more valuable.

The whole thing might be a little fragile without either a defensive admiral or defensive titles, though... Rieekan kinda fixes both.

The most potent first strike version of this I can come up with based on the good suggestions here would be the Disposable Capacitor version, perhaps even with Task Force Organa for additional dice control, which could be squeezed in at 399 points.

The safer and more robust would be no DCs, Rieekan plus projection experts on the Pelta, for 389.

4 hours ago, antisocialmunky said:

Wasn't the 3rd of 4th place list from last year's worlds like 8 Hammerheads with Leia?

This is interesting! I wasn't able to google up a list of it. Does anybody know of it?

1 hour ago, Indecisive Mogwai said:

This is good advice! Thanks a lot! Missions especially tends to puzzle me a bit, as I'm rather new to the game.

Seems like TFA isn't considered quite optimal? I kinda thought it would give the swarm some staying power, but it may be less effective than it looks on paper.

Due to the Hammerheads relative poor maneuver abilities, I envisioned reducing speed at engagement, and just trying to maintain front towards the enemy for as long as possible. I realize that if I were flying Cracken of Mothma, I'd probably have to go in with a different mentality.

Anyway, removing TFA and substituting Veteran Captain and Hondo for Ray gives me a total of 25 points to play with (including any bid). Cracken/Rieekan/Mothma would eat 6-10 of those and Disposable Capacitors 18
so it seems like I'd probably have to chose one or two of a better admiral, DCs and a bid. I'm struggling a bit to evaluate the effects of the suggested admirals vs the DCs. Rieekan could plausibly allow the fleet two extra attacks each turn after the point of contact, which could be 7 dice of offense for 3+ turns. That is considerable. DCs would give up to 12 additional dice on the first turn of firing only, which is far less, but early strikes are of course considerably more valuable.

The whole thing might be a little fragile without either a defensive admiral or defensive titles, though... Rieekan kinda fixes both.

Mad cats advice with Dcaps is good, as for missions i really only play kill the other team so im no use there lol.

TFA is good, but it doesnt remove the damage, all it does is move it.

If your staying slow and gunlining it rieekan or mothma would be good. I prefer rieekan cause with the right flying you shouldnt expect to lose more than a ship a turn, turn 3 onward. Mothma with trc90s is fun but havent tried her with HHs yet.

Usually when i fly HHs i run something like this

Long range black die (74/400/400) ================================= Hammerhead Torpedo Corvette (36 + 45: 81) + Commander Sato (32) + Ordnance Experts (4) + Proximity Mines (4) + Assault Proton Torpedoes (5)

Hammerhead Torpedo Corvette (36 + 13: 49) + Ordnance Experts (4) + Proximity Mines (4) + Assault Proton Torpedoes (5)

Hammerhead Torpedo Corvette (36 + 13: 49) + Ordnance Experts (4) + Proximity Mines (4) + Assault Proton Torpedoes (5)

Hammerhead Torpedo Corvette (36 + 13: 49) + Ordnance Experts (4) + Proximity Mines (4) + Assault Proton Torpedoes (5)

Hammerhead Torpedo Corvette (36 + 13: 49) + Ordnance Experts (4) + Proximity Mines (4) + Assault Proton Torpedoes (5)

Hammerhead Torpedo Corvette (36 + 13: 49) + Ordnance Experts (4) + Proximity Mines (4) + Assault Proton Torpedoes (5)

2 x Lancer-class Pursuit Craft (2 x 15) 4 x A-wing Squadron (4 x 11)

( remove proximity mines and put tycho in is another example)

1 hour ago, DrakonLord said:

Mad cats advice with Dcaps is good, as for missions i really only play kill the other team so im no use there lol.

I liked it a lot, and maximising a fearsome alpha strike appeals a lot to me. I don't think I can scrounge up more than two Dcap cards, though. Maybe I'll try it later sometimes.

1 hour ago, DrakonLord said:

Usually when i fly HHs i run something like this

This looks terrifying! I'm unsure how to fly Sato, and have nover played with proximity mines, so there's a lot of unknowns to me here, but six shooters with black dice, ordnance experts and APTs at long range must rip stuff apart.

How has it been working for you?


Edit: Since you seldom roll more than two black dice per attack with that setup anyway, how would Task Force Organa work as a replacement for Ordnance Experts? It could free up 18 points.

8 minutes ago, Indecisive Mogwai said:

I liked it a lot, and maximising a fearsome alpha strike appeals a lot to me. I don't think I can scrounge up more than two Dcap cards, though. Maybe I'll try it later sometimes.

This looks terrifying! I'm unsure how to fly Sato, and have nover played with proximity mines, so there's a lot of unknowns to me here, but six shooters with black dice, ordnance experts and APTs at long range must rip stuff apart.

How has it been working for you?

Alright, depends on the matchup and the version im running, the most current version is this:

LR crits (79/397/400) ===================== Hammerhead Torpedo Corvette (36 + 32: 68) + Commander Sato (32)

Hammerhead Torpedo Corvette (36 + 14: 50) + Ordnance Experts (4) + Disposable Capacitors (3) + Assault Concussion Missiles (7)

Hammerhead Torpedo Corvette (36 + 14: 50) + Ordnance Experts (4) + Disposable Capacitors (3) + Assault Concussion Missiles (7)

Hammerhead Torpedo Corvette (36 + 14: 50) + Ordnance Experts (4) + Disposable Capacitors (3) + Assault Concussion Missiles (7)

Hammerhead Torpedo Corvette (36 + 14: 50) + Ordnance Experts (4) + Disposable Capacitors (3) + Assault Concussion Missiles (7)

Hammerhead Torpedo Corvette (36 + 14: 50) + Ordnance Experts (4) + Disposable Capacitors (3) + Assault Concussion Missiles (7)

Tycho Celchu (16)

2 x Lancer-class Pursuit Craft (2 x 15) 3 x A-wing Squadron (3 x 11)

So round 1 deploy speed 2, take nav token, setup for attack. 2 rogue craft, 3 fast Awings and Tycho means i should be able to launch into distance 1 of a ship round 2.

Round 2/3 initial engagement, CF here. Dcaps plus red die standard, change bpth to black with sato, CF a black, total 3 black die with rerolls hoping for a crit (15 black die across the fleet at long range). Speed down to 1.

Continue till i need to disengage, set dial to nav and run for it.

Love using sato, despite the small setup needed hes fun. Proximity mines are good for funneling opponents into my trap, or if they go for taking out the mines well thats less shots going towards me.

The fleet list I saw was something ridiculous like this:

Quote

Name: Organa Zerg
Faction: Rebel
Commander: Leia Organa

Assault:
Defense:
Navigation:

Hammerhead Torpedo Corvette (36)
• Leia Organa (38)
• External Racks (3)
• Task Force Organa (1)
= 78 Points

Hammerhead Torpedo Corvette (36)
• External Racks (3)
• Task Force Organa (1)
= 40 Points

Hammerhead Torpedo Corvette (36)
• External Racks (3)
• Task Force Organa (1)
= 40 Points

Hammerhead Torpedo Corvette (36)
• External Racks (3)
• Task Force Organa (1)
= 40 Points

Hammerhead Torpedo Corvette (36)
• External Racks (3)
• Task Force Organa (1)
= 40 Points

Hammerhead Torpedo Corvette (36)
• External Racks (3)
• Task Force Organa (1)
= 40 Points

Hammerhead Torpedo Corvette (36)
• External Racks (3)
• Task Force Organa (1)
= 40 Points

Hammerhead Torpedo Corvette (36)
• External Racks (3)
• Task Force Organa (1)
= 40 Points

Hammerhead Torpedo Corvette (36)
• External Racks (3)
• Task Force Organa (1)
= 40 Points

Squadrons:
= 0 Points

Total Points: 398

TF Organa is quite useful when you literally have so many ships on board that most of them can't get a clear shot.

I do also have a Sato List:

Quote

Name: Sato Hammer Toss (Ordinance)
Faction: Rebel
Commander: Commander Sato

Assault:
Defense:
Navigation:

Hammerhead Torpedo Corvette (36)
• Ordnance Experts (4)
• Disposable Capacitors (3)
• Assault Proton Torpedoes (5)
= 48 Points

Hammerhead Torpedo Corvette (36)
• Ordnance Experts (4)
• Disposable Capacitors (3)
• Assault Proton Torpedoes (5)
= 48 Points

Hammerhead Torpedo Corvette (36)
• Ordnance Experts (4)
• Disposable Capacitors (3)
• Assault Proton Torpedoes (5)
= 48 Points

MC75 Ordnance Cruiser (100)
• Commander Sato (32)
• Lando Calrissian (4)
• Ordnance Experts (4)
• Early Warning System (7)
• Assault Proton Torpedoes (5)
• External Racks (3)
= 155 Points

Squadrons:
• Han Solo (26)
• Tycho Celchu (16)
• Shara Bey (17)
• Hera Syndulla (28)
• Rogue Squadron (14)
= 101 Points

Total Points: 400

I prefer having a points fortress over just a ton of Hammerheads. APTs are the best crit for this due to their reliably damage and the fact that stacked crits can be quite brutal. Just cruise towards the enemy at speed 2 and Concentrate Fire all the way in.

On 11/28/2019 at 11:23 AM, DrakonLord said:

Alright, depends on the matchup and the version im running, the most current version is this:

LR crits (79/397/400) ===================== Hammerhead Torpedo Corvette (36 + 32: 68) + Commander Sato (32)

Hammerhead Torpedo Corvette (36 + 14: 50) + Ordnance Experts (4) + Disposable Capacitors (3) + Assault Concussion Missiles (7)

Hammerhead Torpedo Corvette (36 + 14: 50) + Ordnance Experts (4) + Disposable Capacitors (3) + Assault Concussion Missiles (7)

Hammerhead Torpedo Corvette (36 + 14: 50) + Ordnance Experts (4) + Disposable Capacitors (3) + Assault Concussion Missiles (7)

Hammerhead Torpedo Corvette (36 + 14: 50) + Ordnance Experts (4) + Disposable Capacitors (3) + Assault Concussion Missiles (7)

Hammerhead Torpedo Corvette (36 + 14: 50) + Ordnance Experts (4) + Disposable Capacitors (3) + Assault Concussion Missiles (7)

Tycho Celchu (16)

2 x Lancer-class Pursuit Craft (2 x 15) 3 x A-wing Squadron (3 x 11)

So round 1 deploy speed 2, take nav token, setup for attack. 2 rogue craft, 3 fast Awings and Tycho means i should be able to launch into distance 1 of a ship round 2.

Round 2/3 initial engagement, CF here. Dcaps plus red die standard, change bpth to black with sato, CF a black, total 3 black die with rerolls hoping for a crit (15 black die across the fleet at long range). Speed down to 1.

Continue till i need to disengage, set dial to nav and run for it.

Love using sato, despite the small setup needed hes fun. Proximity mines are good for funneling opponents into my trap, or if they go for taking out the mines well thats less shots going towards me.

Life/work suddenly happened all at once, so I didn't get to answer this properly as fast as I hoped, but I really appreciate the full answer. The Dcaps/Sato combo looks really fun/terrifying, and I can't wait to try it.

Newbie question: how much worse would this be if you replaced all of the Ordnance Experts with Task Force Organa? You don't reroll more than two dice out of a small pool all that often, and your flagship will probably be tailing anyway, and can probably exhaust to reroll without consequence even if all other ships are within firing range. It would free up 15 additional points.

On 11/28/2019 at 3:16 PM, antisocialmunky said:

The fleet list I saw was something ridiculous like this:

TF Organa is quite useful when you literally have so many ships on board that most of them can't get a clear shot.

Lol! I have absolutely no idea how I would fly this efficiently. Also, no idea how I could physically field so many Hammerheads.

On 11/28/2019 at 3:16 PM, antisocialmunky said:

I do also have a Sato List:

I prefer having a points fortress over just a ton of Hammerheads. APTs are the best crit for this due to their reliably damage and the fact that stacked crits can be quite brutal. Just cruise towards the enemy at speed 2 and Concentrate Fire all the way in.

It's rather different conceptually than the previous swarm lists, but I totally get why you prefer having a single robust ship for your admiral. Also makes it much easier for your forces to converge simultaneously on a single center of gravity than with the swarms.

59 minutes ago, Indecisive Mogwai said:

Life/work suddenly happened all at once, so I didn't get to answer this properly as fast as I hoped, but I really appreciate the full answer. The Dcaps/Sato combo looks really fun/terrifying, and I can't wait to try it.

Newbie question: how much worse would this be if you replaced all of the Ordnance Experts with Task Force Organa? You don't reroll more than two dice out of a small pool all that often, and your flagship will probably be tailing anyway, and can probably exhaust to reroll without consequence even if all other ships are within firing range. It would free up 15 additional points.

Honestly not that much worse, you would just run the fleet slightly different, and you would have a bid.

Do that change for 15spare pts, change from ACM to APTs for 10spare pts

28pts spare, take away 2 Awings for 22more pts = 50pts, thats another HH, sweet 😂

LR crits (57/396/400) ===================== Hammerhead Torpedo Corvette (36 + 33: 69) + Commander Sato (32) + Task Force Organa (1)

Hammerhead Torpedo Corvette (36 + 9: 45) + Disposable Capacitors (3) + Assault Proton Torpedoes (5) + Task Force Organa (1)

Hammerhead Torpedo Corvette (36 + 9: 45) + Disposable Capacitors (3) + Assault Proton Torpedoes (5) + Task Force Organa (1)

Hammerhead Torpedo Corvette (36 + 9: 45) + Disposable Capacitors (3) + Assault Proton Torpedoes (5) + Task Force Organa (1)

Hammerhead Torpedo Corvette (36 + 9: 45) + Disposable Capacitors (3) + Assault Proton Torpedoes (5) + Task Force Organa (1)

Hammerhead Torpedo Corvette (36 + 9: 45) + Disposable Capacitors (3) + Assault Proton Torpedoes (5) + Task Force Organa (1)

Hammerhead Torpedo Corvette (36 + 9: 45) + Disposable Capacitors (3) + Assault Proton Torpedoes (5) + Task Force Organa (1)

Tycho Celchu (16)

2 x Lancer-class Pursuit Craft (2 x 15)

A-wing Squadron (11)

I mean this fleet is just me pushing as many HHs into a fleet as possible throwing as many black crits at long range as possible.

I prefer ACM over APT unless i have dodonna but their both great 👍

Quote

Name: Sato Hammer Toss Life Boat
Faction: Rebel
Commander: Commander Sato

Assault: Suprise Attack
Defense: Rift Ambush
Navigation: Solar Corona

Hammerhead Torpedo Corvette (36)
• Disposable Capacitors (3)
• Assault Proton Torpedoes (5)
• Task Force Organa (1)
= 45 Points

Hammerhead Torpedo Corvette (36)
• Disposable Capacitors (3)
• Assault Proton Torpedoes (5)
• Task Force Organa (1)
= 45 Points

Hammerhead Torpedo Corvette (36)
• Disposable Capacitors (3)
• Assault Proton Torpedoes (5)
• Task Force Organa (1)
= 45 Points

Hammerhead Torpedo Corvette (36)
• Disposable Capacitors (3)
• Assault Proton Torpedoes (5)
• Task Force Organa (1)
= 45 Points

Hammerhead Torpedo Corvette (36)
• Disposable Capacitors (3)
• Assault Proton Torpedoes (5)
• Task Force Organa (1)
= 45 Points

Hammerhead Torpedo Corvette (36)
• Commander Sato (32)
• Assault Proton Torpedoes (5)
• Task Force Organa (1)
= 74 Points

Squadrons:
• Han Solo (26)
• Shara Bey (17)
• Tycho Celchu (16)
• Hera Syndulla (28)
• Rogue Squadron (14)
= 101 Points

Total Points: 400

That's my all HH list, I like having real squad cover because that's the weakest part of the list and people will shoot them out first to disable the rest of the list. The reason I prefer APT is that many crits are defensive and can help reduce damage to your squishy MSU:

Quote

Coolant Discharge x2 - Ship - Only one attack you perform each round can target a ship.
Damaged Munitions x2 - Ship - When attacking a ship, before you roll your attack pool, remove 1 die of your choice.
Depowered Armament x2 - Ship - You cannot attack at long range.

Blinded Gunners x2 - Crew - While attacking, you cannot spend Icon Dice Accuracy icons.

And a bunch cause repeating damage:

Quote

Thruster Fissure x2 - Ship - when you change your speed by 1 or more, suffer 1 damage.

Ruptured Engine x2 - Ship - After you execute a manuever, if the speed on your speed dial is greater than "1", suffer 1 damage.

Crew Panic x2 - Crew - Before you reveal a command dial, you must either suffer 1 damage or discard that dial. If you discard it, do not reveal a dial this round.

And of course the amazing highroll if you can hit with your first crit (crit effects apply before damage).

Quote

Projector Misaligned x2 - Ship - Your hull zone with the most remaining shields loses all of its shields. If multiple hull zones are tied, choose between the tied hull zones. Then flip this card face down.