I will be playing X-Wing at a store event this weekend and would like to see if any of the more design minded folks have any insight. This will be a team event with two 200 point squads on either side. I will be on the Imperial side and I need to build a squad that complements my partner’s. His team is below. What insights or builds would you recommend to go with his list?

TIE/ln Fighter - •Del Meeko - 36
•Del Meeko - Inferno Three (30)
Outmaneuver (6)

TIE/ln Fighter - •“Scourge” Skutu - 34
•“Scourge” Skutu - Seasoned Veteran (32)
Predator (2)

TIE/ln Fighter - Obsidian Squadron Pilot - 24
Obsidian Squadron Pilot - (24)

VT-49 Decimator - Patrol Leader - 112
Patrol Leader - (68)
Proton Torpedoes (13)
GNK “Gonk” Droid (10)
•Grand Moff Tarkin (6)
Proximity Mines (6)
Stealth Device (3)
• Dauntless (4)
Skilled Bombardier (2)

Total: 206/200

View in the X-Wing Squad Builder

Thanks!

Remove that stealth device from the patrol leader immediately

Also drop Gonk, it's not worth it. Outmaneuver isn't worth it on a 2 dice TIE.

You don't really have the action economy to make proton torps worth it either. That's 32 points shaved off that could be used better.

That could fit you an upgrade of the generic to night beast, and add another named TIE, perhaps Wampa.

As for the main question: obvious answer to complement that is for you to run aces, but at those points per side you can't really afford to fly too fragile ones, so...

This maybe:

Darth Vader (67)
Hate (3)
Passive Sensors (3)
Afterburners (6)

Ship total: 79 Half Points: 40 Threshold: 3

Major Vynder (41)
Fire-Control System (2)
Adv. Proton Torpedoes (6)
Advanced SLAM (3)
Os-1 Arsenal Loadout (0)
Diamond-Boron Missiles (6)

Ship total: 58 Half Points: 29 Threshold: 4

Grand Inquisitor (52)
Sense (5)
Fire-Control System (2)

Ship total: 59 Half Points: 30 Threshold: 2


Total: 196

You can drop Sense if you want more bid.

The list... kind of doesn't make sense.

• The Decimator is all wrong.
  • It only has two good upgrades: Dauntless and Proximity Mine (Prox Mines and Proton Bombs are nice but not 100% necessary upgrades for a Deci... Proton might be better in a bigger 400 point team game, but it's also riskier).
  • It's typically good to add a force crew or Gunner (pretty much all of them have uses, but I'd go with Vader or Fifth Brother).
  • Also, it's might be worth upgrading to a named pilot. They're both decent.
  • Now, the bad. Basically, the ship is wicked overloaded. There are too many demands on the actions (Tarkin, Proton Torpedoes, and Gonk all compete for the one action you have), and simply having too many upgrades just gives away points too easily.
    • Tarkin isn't terrible, considering this would be a 400 point game, but a really awkward pick on a Decimator, which really wants to Reinforce every round if possible. Taking a lock and not using it is really tough.
      • Admiral Sloane would probably be a good alternative in this kind of a list. She'd be easier to use, and probably as effective as Tarkin under best-case scenarios.
        • The more I think about it, include Sloane somewhere, no matter what . She can fly on a Decimator, Reaper, or Lambda Shuttle, as it appeals to you and your friend, but run Sloane. In a high ship count game like a 400 pointer, she will probably be amazing.
    • Gonk is too slow (there are not actions to spare) and too expensive. Plus, the marginal value of one shield on a Decimator is really low. Consider: Shield Upgrade is 3 points. You'd have to use Gonk 3 times to be even *close* worth it, which means 6 actions. That's NEVER going to happen.
    • Stealth Device is simply worse than Hull on a Decimator.
    • Proton Torpedo is going to be wicked awkward to actually shoot on an Init 2.
• The TIEs are also not good.
  • Outmaneuver Del is odd. He probably can't really pull off Outmaneuver (lower initiative, not very mobile), and it's too expensive anyhow (TIE Fighters die easy, so probably shouldn't take expensive upgrades).
  • Scourge is fine (but Crack Shot is better... TIEs don't live to long, and cheaper and faster Crack Shot is going to be a little better than Predator).
  • Obsidian is kind of "why?"

//

So here's how I'd do a TIEs and Decimator list:

• Scourge Skutu (Crack Shot) 33
• Mauler Mithel (Crack Shot) 33
  • He's got a bonus red die, and is high initiative. That's really good.
• Gideon Hask (Crack Shot ) 31
  • I went with the extra red dice one, rather than the rerolls from Del Meeko, since I think he's probably better, but that'd come down to taste.
  • It could also be Wampa, if you want to save a point.
• Rear Admiral Chiraneau (Admiral Sloane, Fifth Brother, Dauntless, Proton Bomb) 103
  • Sloane can really be a pest, since TIEs can die very fast, and enemies being stressed will grant you rerolls. She doesn't always show up much on Decimators, since you can't really bring too much else with her while bringing lots of TIEs or Strikers or such, but this is a 400 point game.
  • Fifth Brother could be Seventh Sister, if that Fifth Brother was needed for the other squad.
  • If squads can go up over 200, I'd consider maybe going with Darth Vader instead. Being able to spend the force to strip a token or deal a damage can be really nasty in the right circumstances.
  • Also, maybe Minister Tua instead of Dauntless. They're pretty similar, but being able to do a clutch rotate action can be really nice.
  • But in general, do you see how this is a lot cleaner of a build? RAC kind of needs to take a Reinforce action each round, and nothing in the build makes RAC take a different action. Sloane and Fifth Brother are just passive effects.

Another way to save points would be to run Gideon Hask (Crack Shot), Del Meeko (Crack Shot), and Seyn Marana (Marksmanship) all together. They all kind of work together well. Not as well as a full swarm, but decent.

Overall, the list can probably be flown next to almost any other Imperial list. There aren't too many synergies to worry about, but Sloane helps kind of anything. @Cerebrawl might be right that slightly tougher aces might be a good pair to go with it.

//

But I wouldn't actually fly a list with both a Decimator and TIEs in it.

I'd fly a Decmator list, and a separate TIEs list . Consider: One of two basic directions for some TIEs:

• Standard Howlswarm (Howlrunner, Iden Versio, Gideon Hask, Del Meeko, and whatever other two other TIEs strike your fancy. Fill with Crack Shot where possible, maybe consider Swarm Tactics on Howlrunner if running Wampa)
  • Basically, a big nasty block of 6 TIEs all flying in formation. Howlrunner rerolls, Iden protects someone from an attack. Del hopefully grants rerolls by the time you need to defend. They all work best when they're in a fairly close, range 1 formation.
• Imperial 5s (Howlrunner, Mauler Mithel, Scourge Skutu, Duchess in a Striker, Maarek Stele in a TIE Advanced/x1 with Fire Control System. Crack Shot everyone, maybe Marksmanship on Maarek Stele instead)
  • This can fly a bit more loose (but keep Mauler and Scourge at Range 1 of Howl, to be sure, but I wouldn't get too far away with the rest), but it's all high initiative stuff, and you can ideally nuke some stuff down before you lose your ships. Probably a bit more beginner-friendly, if flying a 6-ship swarm is too intimidating.

Then, a second list with a Decimator ( with Admiral Sloane! ) (doesn't have to be Decimator, but there's clearly interest in it between you and your friend, and that's worth preserving) and some other stuff.

• Maybe that's RAC and Whisper or Darth Vader or maybe a TIE Defender (not great, but I love them anyhow). Basically, a loaded RAC and a loaded Ace.
  • There are probably some other threads which describe some good builds. Minister Tua is worth considering for RAC (perhaps instead of Dauntless), Vader crew is really good, Trick Shot is probably the best talent, but is optional.
• Maybe that's a fairly trim Decimator with Sloane, Fifth Brother, Dauntless, and a bunch of other generics, but more independent ones than TIE fighters (those need to stick close to each other).
  • What generics? What ones do you like? Maybe that's Star Wings with Passive Sensors and Proton Torpedoes. Maybe that's some generic Strikers for speed and solid guns. Maybe you like TIE Bombers with Barrage Rockets. Maybe it's a pair of TIE Phantoms. It's flexible.
    • The best plan would be to fly the kinds of ships you like, making sure not to take too many bad upgrades. There's usually a few "good enough" builds for most ships.
  • Might even be able to fit a Patrol Leader with a pair of cheap aces, like Grand Inquisitor and Soontir Fel.
• Maybe that's well-loaded RAC and well-loaded Captain Oicunn (take Intimidation if running Oicunn).
• Maybe that's a filler TIE plus TWO PATROL LEADERS. I've been playing around with two lately. One with Fifth Brother and Hull, the other with Seventh Sister and Hull. Duchess has been my 3rd ship, but that's be flexible. Adding Admiral Sloane to one of the Decimators (maybe Death Troopers to the other?), and cutting the Hull Upgrades above and swapping out Duchess for Wampa or a generic Striker would also work. Something like this would slot in nicely:
  • Patrol Leader (Fifth Brother, Death Troopers) 83 - Death Troopers to keep an opponent from clearing stress would be really nasty in this context.
  • Patrol Leader (Seventh Sister, Admiral Sloane) 86
  • Wampa (-) 30

But do you see where I'm going? In general, TIEs work best in a large-ish group. Howlrunner and Iden and Del are force-multipliers which strengthen a large number of ships, but aren't very impressive when there's just 2 or 3. Flying a group of 6 ships will be easier if all controlled by one player. Decimators are pretty independent. Maybe that's flying with an ace, maybe that's using two generics to choke off space and herd an opponent into the mass firepower of a TIE swarm.

By switching what's in either squad, and who has responsibility over what, it probably can work out into a stronger overall game.

//

Kind of a lot of text, but at least it's not a wall.

8 hours ago, SimonMagus said:

I will be on the Imperial side and I need to build a squad that complements my partner’s. His team is below. What insights or builds would you recommend to go with his list?

• First - probably most important question - are you allies? That is, do you count one another as 'friendly ships' (or 'enemy ships') or not?
  • Imperials have some great support crew, and great 'area debuff' effects, and you need to know if you're going to be applying (or inflicting!) them on your teammate.
• The squad as listed has some serious issues which people above have addressed however that's not your squad and hence (to a degree) not your problem. Pass on the comments and they may or may not get taken on board.
• How to support a Decimator and a bunch of TIE fighters (assuming that's what's left, regardless of the exact configuration)
  • You've got a relatively unmanouvrable squad; TIE's are nippy but unwieldy in swarms, and the Decimator is a brute of a ship that treats a dial-ed in instruction to turn like a vague suggestion.
  • Something fast and handy to watch their flanks and tail would be good.
  • I think @Cerebrawl is right that you don't want fragile aces - with 400 points on the board, there's likely to be too many arcs of fire for someone like Soontir Fel to dodge them all, so the top end aces are probably not going to make their money's worth for you.
  • TIE/v1 with Supernatural Reflexes are fast and flexible, but able to turtle up behind focus/evade in a pinch, which is good if needed. Supernatural Reflexes is eyewateringly expensive for the Grand Inquisitor, but for his lesser brethren it's far more reasonable (8 points on a generic Inquisitor, for example)
  • Strikers give you a fast flanking force which is cheap enough to take the casualties it will take, and - unlike the TIE/v1 - packs 3-dice primaries. 5 Strikers with Afterburners can drop a scary firing line on someone's flank for the first engagement, and very little can take 15 red dice in eight-rounds-rapid mode, even without multiple modifiers.
  • If you have access to them, gunboats are a nice idea as noted.

Question is, are you both limited by named pilots appearing once on a side. If yes... Then I would go with a Sloane Lambda with as many Tie Fighters you can fit, the most basic ones. Then second player can grab five 5s, those being Maarek Stele, Duchess, Scourge, Mauler and Howlrunner. You have lots of arcs, powerful flanking force, lots of blockers and a bucket of green dice.

13 hours ago, theBitterFig said:

Kind of a lot of text, but at least it's not a wall.

I just wanna say this was an awesome post and a great primer for solid imperial lists!