I'm considering buying one of the new second edition B Wings and was just wondering if either of these lists could/would work?

Gavin Darklighter (61)
Crack Shot (1)

Ship total: 62 Half Points: 31 Threshold: 3

Blade Squadron Veteran (43)
Marksmanship (1)
Autoblasters (2)
Jamming Beam (0)

Ship total: 46 Half Points: 23 Threshold: 4

Blade Squadron Veteran (43)
Marksmanship (1)
Autoblasters (2)
Jamming Beam (0)

Ship total: 46 Half Points: 23 Threshold: 4

Blade Squadron Veteran (43)
Marksmanship (1)
Autoblasters (2)
Jamming Beam (0)

Ship total: 46 Half Points: 23 Threshold: 4


Total: 200

Or

Gavin Darklighter (61)
Ship total: 61 Half Points: 31 Threshold: 3

Braylen Stramm (51)
Autoblasters (2)
Jamming Beam (0)

Ship total: 53 Half Points: 27 Threshold: 4

Blue Squadron Pilot (41)
Autoblasters (2)
Jamming Beam (0)

Ship total: 43 Half Points: 22 Threshold: 4

Blue Squadron Pilot (41)
Autoblasters (2)
Jamming Beam (0)

Ship total: 43 Half Points: 22 Threshold: 4


Total: 200

Could work, the list with marksmanship is probably better in practice, despite Braylen's stress rerolls. Up to two hit-to-crit conversions when you flank seems good to me. Mind you I've only flown autoblasters on scyks, so I don't know how well they work in practice for b-wings.

I think they're probably decent lists for a fun casual night or small kit tourney (I think I like #1 more, it commits harder to the theme). I'm not sure I'd buy a 3rd B-Wing just for it, though.

The Autoblaster shenanigans are kinda fun, but not really that much better than going without, and probably not much better than running some other 4th ship. Adding a few cheap toys to Gavin (FCS or R3 Astromech or both improves the efficiency of Experimental Scanners) is also nice, depending on what else you'd fit into the squad. A few options:

• Zeb with Leia (either Sheathipede or Attack Shuttle), and toys for Gavin (I'd go FCS & R3)
• Arvel Crynyd with Predator and Intimidation, and Toys for Gavin
• Red Vet X-Wing with Crack Shot, plus FCS for Gavin
• Cavern Angel Zealot with Deadman's Switch, and R3 added to Gavin
  • Does this make sense? I can't say I've ever heard of anyone flying one of these before, but having a CAZ that just intends to get into someone's face and die is almost tempting.

I don't really see the point of Autoblasters on named B-Wings, though. Named ones are better in general (Crack Ten, Crack Braylen, Crack/Predator Jake, and a Rogue E with Crack, R3 and FCS... Hrm...), but don't really need Autoblasters. Braylen really doesn't. Autoblasters are pretty much only good if out-of-arc and trying to snipe in extra crits when you've got bad dice mods. But Braylen has really good dice mods, so Autoblasters doesn't really add much. HLC would be better than a Marksmanship/Autoblasters combo, but even then, just Crack Shot is probably about as good, and the cheapness is also nice.

//

In general, I think most of the best B-Wing squads have tended to have 2 B-Wings. Maybe that's Ten and Braylen. Maybe that's two generics serving as a baseline to other named pilots--I know some Wedge/Cassian/2 Generic lists used to get played. Even in squads of massed generics, B-Wings seem to work best mixed. I think BBXX+Zeb has worked better than BBBB+Zeb. They can be a little lumbering, which is fine in moderation, but it's often best to for a squad to have diverse ship types. Tougher B-Wings mixed with Faster X-Wings is probably better than 4 of either.

Now, that's a budget-mindset. Like, if someone is trying to save money, two B-Wings is probably enough. More can be fun--don't let me hold you back--but I wouldn't put 3rd of 4th B-Wings too high on a recommended purchase list.

Its going to be extremely rare for low initiative generics to get out of an enemies front arc AND line up the bullseye to do the autoblaster crit trick. You probably get 1 Bwing to do it per avg game.

You would probably get more mileage out of selflessness on all three Bs.

11 minutes ago, wurms said:

Its going to be extremely rare for low initiative generics to get out of an enemies front arc AND line up the bullseye to do the autoblaster crit trick. You probably get 1 Bwing to do it per avg game.

You would probably get more mileage out of selflessness on all three Bs.

That Gavin, tho.

Without Gavin, this is 100% correct and Marksmanship/Autoblasters B-Wings are almost surely a waste of points. They just don't move well enough and are too low initiative.

Gavin might change things. Supposing he's got arc, and something like your B-Wing has just K-Turned and doesn't have bullseye. It's either 3 dice without mods (OK against some things) or 2 dice with a crit-turn and the Autoblasters effect. If the defender has good dice mods, that auto-crit is really nice. I'd have to dig up old spreadsheets I made, but crit-turn plus ABS is often pretty good against defenders with dice mods.

But like, if running Selfless B-Wings, it probably doesn't make sense to stick with Gavin, and then the entire squad probably should just be something else.

6 minutes ago, theBitterFig said:

That Gavin, tho.

Without Gavin, this is 100% correct and Marksmanship/Autoblasters B-Wings are almost surely a waste of points. They just don't move well enough and are too low initiative.

Gavin might change things. Supposing he's got arc, and something like your B-Wing has just K-Turned and doesn't have bullseye. It's either 3 dice without mods (OK against some things) or 2 dice with a crit-turn and the Autoblasters effect. If the defender has good dice mods, that auto-crit is really nice. I'd have to dig up old spreadsheets I made, but crit-turn plus ABS is often pretty good against defenders with dice mods.

But like, if running Selfless B-Wings, it probably doesn't make sense to stick with Gavin, and then the entire squad probably should just be something else.

Sure, lower init squads, maybe howlswarms it can work a few times to good effect? Its just Gavin has to have the defender is in arc though, init4 with no bid, plus the bwing has to be out of the defenders front arc for the crit to bypass. I guess it will work on scrubs or a couple shots on a sear swarm? Anyone decently capable with aces will not be hit more than once by these shenanigans, and a jousty kturning squad that is just gonna meet you face to face like Rebel Beef and Resistance has enough shields not to care so much. And if Gavin drops early, you are now left with 3 low init Bwings.

With Selfless, you keep Gavin alive, and your 3 bwings alive, and probably drive through more crits then AB tricks just by shear red dice volume alone.

I have yet to see AB be useful anywhere except maybe on Poe or Nien with enough bid to hunt Jedi. AB is just a lot of "If this AND this" to make it a central piece of a squad. I think it needs to just be used as an upgrade to help deal with certain matchups, like a sear swarm or howl swarm where you will see a lot of out of arc shots and can b-roll on lower init ships without shields and drive crits through.

Hmm, okay, did some thinking. Instead of being "negative nancy", combine best of both worlds. Gavin AB tricks, AND keep Gavin and Bwings alive longer without selfless and sacrificing ABs. Good ole Biggs.

Gavin Darklighter (61)
Crack Shot (1)

Blade Squadron Veteran (43)
Autoblasters (2)

Blade Squadron Veteran (43)
Autoblasters (2)

Biggs Darklighter (48)
Servomotor S-Foils (0)
Total: 200

I can't really disagree with the merits of anything you're saying, @wurms . Autoblasters really seem quite niche, other than on Scyks. I guess XG-1 or IG-88 B can use them for the mere fact of having a cannon, but mostly? Yeah, it's niche. T-70s do seem to be the other one. Their top-3 highest Init pilots are all fairly nimble, and all have tricks for getting out of arc. Heroic is so mentally hard to switch away from (blank-blank will instantly happen for major feelsbadman), but it's only worth half a hit point (which is good value for 1 point, but still). Going MMS/ABS on any T-70 ace could be scary.

There's always a challenge to reviewing squads. On the one hand, it's easy to direct someone to, say, Cassian/Ten/Braylen/Arvel, which was just Top 16 Worlds, and it'd be a better B-Wing squad. But it loses the heart of what the original poster suggests. I'm sure I fail at that sometimes, and steer folks away from the fun idea towards something popular or boring but known-to-be-good.

Biggs over a B-Wing does the trick, though. Without MMS, though, maybe Blues over Blades? That'd free up 4 points. Could be an R2 on Biggs, or stuff for Gavin. On the other hand, close formations are always a lot easier with same-initiative, so Blades have value in matching Biggs.

Autoblasters on Bwings are kind of a waste of points

Just use the 3 die primary!

Autoblasters are for 2-die schmuks who wouldn't be able to contribute more than a 24 point TIE Fighter on a good day. I love them on the Resistance's Transport, but they're pointless on Bwings

Nothing wrong with the Bs themselves, note, just that cannons are fairly useless on them. The 3-die primary is more than enough. Honestly, I'd probably run them without any upgrades at all!

On 11/15/2019 at 11:48 AM, ficklegreendice said:

Autoblasters on Bwings are kind of a waste of points

I've been flying Gavin, Braylen, Ten and Lt. Blount (B-wings with Marksmanship and Autoblasters). I got to shoot Vader through a cloud, with bullseye for the two auto-crits over lunch today. Is it the most competitive thing in the world? Probably not. Was it fun? Heck yeah

That's a pretty lucky shot! (The bullseye on a higher I ship which was also obstructed; **** ain't easy)

13 minutes ago, ficklegreendice said:

That's a pretty lucky shot! (The bullseye on a higher I ship which was also obstructed; **** ain't easy)

Yeah, absolutely - and I know it won't happen very often. I've played my list and not used autoblasters once the whole game. In this instance my opponent messed up and ended up on a cloud.

15 hours ago, eljms said:

Yeah, absolutely - and I know it won't happen very often. I've played my list and not used autoblasters once the whole game. In this instance my opponent messed up and ended up on a cloud.

It happens. Last sunday my opponent flew Blackout through a cloud instead of stopping behind it, by mistake, stopping right in front of Talonbane, and that was it, 5 damage and out(my starviper had plinked its shields off the turn before).

I've also had multiple crits go through on hard targets with autoblasters, and it's glorious. Echo behind an asteroid with evade, focus and force? My crits don't care.