Thane's ability says While you perform an attack you may spend 1 focus, hit, or crit result to look at the defenders facedown damage cards choose 1 and expose it Snap Shot says: After an enemy ship executes a maneuver, you may perform this attack against it as a bonus attack ATTACK: your dice cannot be modified Can you use Thane's ability with Snap Shot
Thane and Snap Shot
4 minutes ago, wsmith32 said:Thane's ability says While you perform an attack you may spend 1 focus, hit, or crit result to look at the defenders facedown damage cards choose 1 and expose it Snap Shot says: After an enemy ship executes a maneuver, you may perform this attack against it as a bonus attack ATTACK: your dice cannot be modified Can you use Thane's ability with Snap Shot
Spending a result is a dice modification per the Rules Reference, so no.
From Page 9 of the Rule Reference:
DICE MODIFICATION
Players can modify dice by spending various tokens and by resolving abilities.
Dice can be modified in the following ways:
• Add: To add a die result, place an unused die displaying the result next
to the rolled dice. A die added in this way is treated as a normal die for all
purposes and can be modified and canceled.
• Change: To change a die result, rotate the die so that its faceup side
displays the new result.
• Reroll: To reroll a die result, pick up the die and roll it again.
• Spend: To spend a result, remove the die from the dice pool.
I wouldn't have realised had you not pointed that out
8 hours ago, Hiemfire said:Spending a result is a dice modification per the Rules Reference, so no.
From Page 9 of the Rule Reference:
DICE MODIFICATION
Players can modify dice by spending various tokens and by resolving abilities.
Dice can be modified in the following ways:
• Add: To add a die result, place an unused die displaying the result next
to the rolled dice. A die added in this way is treated as a normal die for all
purposes and can be modified and canceled.
• Change: To change a die result, rotate the die so that its faceup side
displays the new result.
• Reroll: To reroll a die result, pick up the die and roll it again.
• Spend: To spend a result, remove the die from the dice pool.
I am not so sure about this. Vader spends a token to do another action and this has nothing to do with dice. Thane needs dice rolled to trigger, but the “spend” does not interact with the dice, so where is the mod exactly? Looks like some E&C is needed here.
9 minutes ago, Pewpewpew BOOM said:I am not so sure about this. Vader spends a token to do another action and this has nothing to do with dice. Thane needs dice rolled to trigger, but the “spend” does not interact with the dice, so where is the mod exactly? Looks like some E&C is needed here.
Vader's ability has nothing to do with attack dice and is irrelevant to the discussion. Thane's ability is triggered with dice and is considered a mod because it is specifically called out in the Rules Reference under dice modification (Spending a result, which removes a die from the pool), as @Hiemfire clearly laid out. There is no discussion, nor need for clarification.
25 minutes ago, Pewpewpew BOOM said:I am not so sure about this. Vader spends a token to do another action and this has nothing to do with dice. Thane needs dice rolled to trigger, but the “spend” does not interact with the dice, so where is the mod exactly? Looks like some E&C is needed here.
Vader spends a Force Charge to use his ability as either pilot or crew. Thane spends a dice result to use his. Spending dice results is a dice modification as outlined in the Dice Modification section of the Rules Reference which I quoted. Go read it for yourself if you think I'm blowing smoke. Page 9, Dice Modification starts bottom of the righthand column and ends in the top of the left hand column on page 10.
Edited by Hiemfire1 minute ago, Ikka said:Vader's ability has nothing to do with attack dice and is irrelevant to the discussion. Thane's ability is triggered with dice and is considered a mod because it is specifically called out in the Rules Reference under dice modification (Spending a result, which removes a die from the pool), as @Hiemfire clearly laid out. There is no discussion, nor need for clarification.
Whoops! Thane spends a die result; Vader spends a token. My bad.
These are not the droids you’re looking for; move along.
An interesting thing to note is adding a die is not a modification , ie Sabacc and snap shot. Spending a die is, Thane and Snap snot. Finally some imperial bias going my way.
1 hour ago, Archangelspiv said:An interesting thing to note is adding a die is not a modification , ie Sabacc and snap shot. Spending a die is, Thane and Snap snot. Finally some imperial bias going my way.
But adding a die set to a focus is a modification. For example finn’s ability.
56 minutes ago, Xeletor said:But adding a die set to a focus is a modification. For example finn’s ability.
Rolling an extra dice isn't a mod, because it happens before modding. Finn's ability adds a result, which is a mod to the result.
Every ship in the following list can conditionally snap shot with 3 dice.
3 dice snappy
(44) "Pure Sabacc" [TIE/sk Striker] (as long as he doesn't have more than one damage card)
(6) Proximity Mines
(9) Fifth Brother
(6) Shield Upgrade
(7) Snap Shot
Points: 72
(32) "Scourge" Skutu [TIE/ln Fighter] (in bullseye)
(7) Snap Shot
Points: 39
(30) Gideon Hask [TIE/ln Fighter] (if defender is damaged)
(7) Snap Shot
Points: 37
(40) Storm Squadron Ace [TIE Advanced x1] (if he has a lock on defender)
(2) Fire-Control System
(7) Snap Shot
Points: 49
Total points: 197
7 hours ago, Pewpewpew BOOM said:Whoops! Thane spends a die result; Vader spends a token. My bad.
These are not the droids you’re looking for; move along.
To be precise, Vader spends a Force charge, and charges aren't tokens. The distinction isn't relevant to the thread topic, but there are some game mechanical effects where it matters whether something is a token or not.
7 hours ago, Cerebrawl said:(40) Storm Squadron Ace [TIE Advanced x1] (if he has a lock on defender)
(2) Fire-Control System
(7) Snap Shot
Points: 49
This one doesn't work, unfortunately, as the ATC only boosts primary attacks.
7 minutes ago, Okapi said:This one doesn't work, unfortunately, as the ATC only boosts primary attacks.
Oops. Missed that.
2 hours ago, Cerebrawl said:Oops. Missed that.
You can also add Snap + Trick A-Wings (RZ-1 and RZ-2) and Nantexs to the list. A Range 2 obstacle obstructed attack is about a situational as you can get.
15 hours ago, Cerebrawl said:Every ship in the following list can conditionally snap shot with 3 dice.
3 dice snappy
Graz can do it as well, if behind the snap shot target.
Ahaav, if snapping a non-small ship.
15 hours ago, Cerebrawl said:Rolling an extra dice isn't a mod, because it happens before modding. Finn's ability adds a result, which is a mod to the result.
So a lucky Sunny Bounder, rolling natural 2 hits or natural 2 crits on snap shot could unfortunately not use her ability, couldn't she?
Edited by ManagarmrDud
2 minutes ago, Managarmr said:So a lucky Sunny Bounder, rolling natural 2 hits or natural 2 crits on snap shot could unfortunately not use her ability, couldn't she?
Nope, though she doesn't have the talent slot to take Snap Shot either.
Okay someone brought this up my last game night, I wasn't sure of the answer.
Does Rebel Han's ability allow you to re-roll as his ability isn't considered a re-roll under the terms of dice modification?
23 minutes ago, Tyhar7 said:Okay someone brought this up my last game night, I wasn't sure of the answer.
Does Rebel Han's ability allow you to re-roll as his ability isn't considered a re-roll under the terms of dice modification?
No, you cannot reroll. Han’s ability is still a modification even if it is not a reroll for other rules purposes.
23 minutes ago, Tyhar7 said:Okay someone brought this up my last game night, I wasn't sure of the answer.
Does Rebel Han's ability allow you to re-roll as his ability isn't considered a re-roll under the terms of dice modification?
No, Han's ability is still a Dice Mod despite not being considered a re-roll.
Official ruling:
Just to point out a weird consequence of spending=modification that I saw in the rules sub-forum that I don't think most folks will have considered:
Midnight cannot take damage from an ion attack if she has a lock on the attacker. Ion weapons say to spend a result to cause the defender to suffer one damage but spending is a modification and so not allowed if Midnight has the attacker locked. No damage dealt but just one uncancelled hit/crit is enough to ion Midnight.
Only tangentially related to OP but I found it interesting.