I really can't wait for some new points. Mostly, I just want to see more things that really aren't taken discounted more so we get more wacky lists.

2 hours ago, Blail Blerg said:

I really can't wait for some new points. Mostly, I just want to see more things that really aren't taken discounted more so we get more wacky lists.

Agreed. Since the start of 2nd I've barely seen so many ships (M3A, Kimogila, TIE Aggressor, YT2400, and so on) it would be nice to open up lists a little more by giving some of those ships some meaningful discounts. Speaking of meaningful discounts, I think that might be the way to go with the Talents. Crack Shot is probably a little too good at 1 point, but at 2 it's competing with Predator, which is probably better. What I'd like to see is Talents like Daredevil, Saturation Salvo and the various others that are pretty pricey come down a little to see if that makes list building a little more varied.

7 minutes ago, Jike said:

Agreed. Since the start of 2nd I've barely seen so many ships (M3A, Kimogila, TIE Aggressor, YT2400, and so on) it would be nice to open up lists a little more by giving some of those ships some meaningful discounts. Speaking of meaningful discounts, I think that might be the way to go with the Talents. Crack Shot is probably a little too good at 1 point, but at 2 it's competing with Predator, which is probably better. What I'd like to see is Talents like Daredevil, Saturation Salvo and the various others that are pretty pricey come down a little to see if that makes list building a little more varied.

The M3A probably needs a price drop to bring it in line with the TIE FO, and the YT-2400 is just laughable overpriced, but I think the Kimoglia is actually okay. The dial is decent enough, the statline is very good for the cost, it has a ship ability and a slew of upgrade slots. Pretty sure the main reason this ship seems little play is more tied to preference than anything else. A heavy fighter with a medium base, at middle initiative just feels weird to a lot of people.

As for the Aggressor I think it would be better off with a sensor slot, a new gunner or a new (Imperial only?) turret. Drop it too much and it just replaces the Bomber as a missile platform.

I saw somewhere that winning lists in EU, NA and worlds had an average Force score of 5.33. Force users are dominating and need to go up.

3 hours ago, Okapi said:

I think the Kimoglia is actually okay. The dial is decent enough, the statline is very good for the cost, it has a ship ability and a slew of upgrade slots. Pretty sure the main reason this ship seems little play is more tied to preference than anything else. A heavy fighter with a medium base, at middle initiative just feels weird to a lot of people.

It needs bullseye, but has bad initiative, lacks boost, and sports a red barrel roll that's a 4 point talent slot to fix. Lining up those bullseyes is hard and you can go games without being able to. Also agility 1 means it just melts.

18 minutes ago, Cerebrawl said:

It needs bullseye, but has bad initiative, lacks boost, and sports a red barrel roll that's a 4 point talent slot to fix. Lining up those bullseyes is hard and you can go games without being able to. Also agility 1 means it just melts.

It doesn't NEED bullseye except the named pilots. It's just a neat, hyper-situational bonus

It needs to cost the same as a 104th Arc so it can be cost efficient

7 minutes ago, ficklegreendice said:

It doesn't NEED bullseye except the named pilots. It's just a neat, hyper-situational bonus

It needs to cost the same as a 104th Arc so it can be cost efficient

With worse health quality, and no rear arc, for a better dial and barely usable ability. I'd prefer the 170 if I had the choice, just for that rear arc. Can also compare the Arc-170 with Firespray, 22 more points for +1 agility, +1 rear primary strength.

2 minutes ago, Cerebrawl said:

With worse health quality, and no rear arc, for a better dial and barely usable ability. I'd prefer the 170 if I had the choice, just for that rear arc.

Yes, but you don't get that choice

Better than to bridge the gap at least a little bit

4 minutes ago, ficklegreendice said:

Yes, but you don't get that choice

Better than to bridge the gap at least a little bit

Kimo is overpriced for what it does, which I suspect is at least partially due to the illicit slot tax. I think it should probably cost 41 as entry, so you cant field 5. 1 less than Arc-170, instead of 1 more.

4 minutes ago, Cerebrawl said:

With worse health quality, and no rear arc, for a better dial and barely usable ability. I'd prefer the 170 if I had the choice, just for that rear arc. Can also compare the Arc-170 with Firespray, 22 more points for +1 agility, +1 rear primary strength.

Very slightly worse health quality and a loss of a 2-dice rear gun, in exchange for a better upgrade bar, higher initiative, a better dial and a ship ability. If you find it barely usable that probably says more about your style than it does about the ship. Sure, it only actually triggers once in a while, but it provides a decent way of herding aces, and is a decent counter to large ships with evade or reinforce. If anything I'd probably bring the Republic ARC up points wise, to match the Kimogila, than the other way around.

Ew don't nerf the republic arc. It's fine as is

We REALLY don't want extra emphasis on high I. It's already incredible, and we need ship pricing like the Republic arc to have a reasonable chance against it

Game would better benefit from Kim buff than Arc nerf

Kimo barely sees play and do not show in tourney top lists, it needs a break, it is not competitive at current pricing, Torani is the only one worth running for fun in casual jank, 2 points less for them won't make them tourney destroyers either, but you might see one over a cartel marauder once in a blue moon.

14 minutes ago, Cerebrawl said:

Kimo barely sees play and do not show in tourney top lists, it needs a break, it is not competitive at current pricing, Torani is the only one worth running for fun in casual jank, 2 points less for them won't make them tourney destroyers either, but you might see one over a cartel marauder once in a blue moon.

torani made top 16 at worlds

Funny thing about the Kim is that the named pilots are already at Arc prices

Compare Torani's 48 to Wolfe's 50

Or Dalan's 46 to Jag's 48

Course their abilities are VASTLY more situational, but still worth noting

11 minutes ago, ficklegreendice said:

Funny thing about the Kim is that the named pilots are already at Arc prices

Compare Torani's 48 to Wolfe's 50

Or Dalan's 46 to Jag's 48

Course their abilities are VASTLY more situational, but still worth noting

I'd rather compare Wolfe to Koshka Frost. He's a bargain.

4 minutes ago, Cerebrawl said:

I'd rather compare Wolfe to Koshka Frost. He's a bargain.

...why?

They're nowhere near comparable

What? Just because the Arc has a 2-dice (ie NOT 3-dice) aux arc?

Not that I don't feel the spray couldn't be cheaper, but it's

1.) A bit more durable (1 more health + agi)

2.) A LOT more manueverable (really important given bigger base size)

3.) A LOT faster; can boost (HUGE advantage on an aux arc)

4.) Lest we forget, a WHOLE EXTRA RED DIE on aux arc

The comparison simply isn't there.

So which of these three looks like the worst deal?

I3 Kimogila: 3/1/7/2, ship ability, best dial, 43 points.
I2 ARC: 3/1/6/3, extra 2-die rear arc, 42 points.
I2 TIE Punisher: 2/1/6/3, worst dial, 38 points.

Just now, Rossetti1828 said:

So which of these three looks like the worst deal?

I3 Kimogila: 3/1/7/2, ship ability, best dial, 43 points.
I2 ARC: 3/1/6/3, extra 2-die rear arc, 42 points.
I2 TIE Punisher: 2/1/6/3, worst dial, 38 points.

Kimogila in my mind. Ship ability is unlikely to proc against anything not a large base or bigger. Especially at I2. It only really synergizes well with Torani, but that’s more points and still not great with that dial.

Punisher you run ordnance and it works. And ARCs are everywhere it seems. Plus they have an aux arc.

5 minutes ago, ScummyRebel said:

Punisher you run ordnance and it works.

What ordnance do you recommend? What list do you have with the I2 that works? Because then it is action-dependent and costs more than the ARC and Kimogila. And doesn't get 4 dice at range one etc etc.

1 minute ago, Rossetti1828 said:

What ordnance do you recommend? What list do you have that works? Because then it action-dependent and costs more than the ARC and Kimogila. And doesn't get 4 dice at range one etc etc.

Depends on build. I’ve never messed with the low init Punishers but I could see concussion missiles working with passive sensors. Plasmas aren’t good on the low init because hopefully higher initiative units have landed some shots. And protons gets spendy for anyone but alpha strikers I think. Only proton I’d consider not at the higher initiatives is maybe the gunboat with adv slam.

4 minutes ago, ScummyRebel said:

Depends on build. I’ve never messed with the low init Punishers but I could see concussion missiles working with passive sensors.

Well that's what I mean. Your Punisher is now 47 points, for about the same offense as the 43 point I3 Kimogila, but only if you get an action.

Honestly, I think the punisher has it worse due to the bomber existing

Plus, upgrading to deathrain is more than worth it. Dude is still the most fun I ever have in this game; even moreso now with fuses and Borons!

Obviously Deathrain is stupid expensive, but his ability is kinda just that good. You'd never think a fattie like the punisher could *dance* like Deathrain does!

6 hours ago, Okapi said:

...but I think the Kimoglia is actually okay. The dial is decent enough, the statline is very good for the cost, it has a ship ability and a slew of upgrade slots. Pretty sure the main reason this ship seems little play is more tied to preference than anything else. A heavy fighter with a medium base, at middle initiative just feels weird to a lot of people.

Kimos did well at yesterday's 9 player kit at the FLGS.

Winner was 2 kimos, 3 kihraxz. Just a battering ram of a lost which can choke a board. I didn't play against it, but folks felt overwhelmed by the mass of fire.

2nd place was Koshka, 4-LOM, and Dalan. Dalan wound up MVP for both sides in the game I played against him. Dalan stole a shield and put 3 hits into a focused E-Wing behind an obstacle. However, my opponent rolled 3 crits from the Rigged Cargo he dropped including a kill on 4-LOM and half points on Dalan on the last round. My opponent said that the Bullseye effects didn't matter that much in his previous games against Imperial aces, but when it lands, it lands HARD.

50 minutes ago, theBitterFig said:

Kimos did well at yesterday's 9 player kit at the FLGS.

Winner was 2 kimos, 3 kihraxz. Just a battering ram of a lost which can choke a board. I didn't play against it, but folks felt overwhelmed by the mass of fire.

Sounds hilarious, I have to try this.

I have run 2 Kimogilas together (naked or with CC or Crack) before. Medium base requires some practice, but it's doable. They are easily blocked though, and with 1 agility they melt then. Firepower is good, esp against ships with reinforce or also Tie/D, and having 2 i parallel is scary for opponents aces. I have one-shotted Soontir with them.

They are almost good. I wish though, they had boost instead of red barrel roll. Would be thematical, as well. These things are basically giant engines with armament and a tiny cockpit strapped on. Banking by boost also makes bulkseye easier, alas, the M12L cannot do it.

As someone who's very fond of the kimogila, I would welcome buffs. They're currently overpriced and suffering from a not-great combo of average dial and action bar. But I've also seen them work and it's fantastic when they do. If they get a bit of help in the next update I'll be all over that.

I like the 2 kimos and 3 kihraxz list. That's solid firepower and health, and though you're not depending on bullseyes, as you say, when they do land they land hard . A wise ace player knows better than to fall in a bullseye and will actually spend a lot of mental effort trying to squirm away from that threat. Pair that with the raw firepower of 5 3-dice ships and it's an encouraging list.