I cant believe we have to wait another freaking month when the game is already in the elites hands already.

.............................

What? Is this a troll thread? They have had livestreams for each pack, plus Team Covenent streams for all the cards. And we have 1 article so far, with more likely to follow.

4 hours ago, Supertoe said:

The worst part is, you can already tell FFG has no intentions of supporting this game very long. We've had what, one preview? Meanwhile every last figure and card in a star wars expansion gets a preview.

We're looking at the new RuneWars for sure.

Would you be saying this if the release had been mid-Oct rather then Nov 1st? Or is it just knee jerk frustration at the slight delay?

9 hours ago, jonboyjon1990 said:

Would you be saying this if the release had been mid-Oct rather then Nov 1st? Or is it just knee jerk frustration at the slight delay?

Wait is it Nov 1st? They made it seem like late-NOV. Big difference.

And I say that their lack of previews and marketing is concerning either way. It pales in comparison to what they do for Star Wars and Keyforge.

And yeah, it's a knee-jerk reaction. Probably completely wrong-headed. I'll freely admit that. But it's not a troll. A lot of FFG's fans have been screwed over so many times by them, it becomes hard to ever trust them again. We've seen too many games not sell well enough because FFG had too many delays or too little marketing, thus screwing over the fanbase of that game (Battlelore, Runebound 3e, heck even Imperial Assault).

I don't even know how to respond to this...

I can't get past the 'elites'. I can't figure out how a co-operative game would have 'elites' or how that can even be a term applied to a hobby. So confused.

FFG has a very simple business model. It's easier and more profitable to make a new game than retain players investing in a current game. If it wasn't financially successful they wouldn't do it. The LCG model is essentially a broken model outside of co-operative games. It doesn't lend itself well to longevity at all. We've seen some* games not sell well due to delays and marketing. I don't think that can be attributed to all games FFG has produced that 'failed'. The tabletop market is way too saturated right now as is.

We've actually had something like 5 previews direct from FFG - the initial release article, the Cap article, the Green Goblin article, last week's Player Phase preview, and at least the Cap livesteam (possibly more). There's also been a lot of previews from other sites and content creators like Team Covenant.

<shrug> People will always find something to complain about. If they'd blown it all out in the first week they'd be saying the game was already dead because we were only getting monthly previews of new packs (which happen to release monthly).

On 9/28/2019 at 4:51 PM, Supertoe said:

Wait is it Nov 1st? They made it seem like late-NOV. Big difference.

And I say that their lack of previews and marketing is concerning either way. It pales in comparison to what they do for Star Wars and Keyforge.

And yeah, it's a knee-jerk reaction. Probably completely wrong-headed. I'll freely admit that. But it's not a troll. A lot of FFG's fans have been screwed over so many times by them, it becomes hard to ever trust them again. We've seen too many games not sell well enough because FFG had too many delays or too little marketing, thus screwing over the fanbase of that game (Battlelore, Runebound 3e, heck even Imperial Assault).

Yeah fair enough - no worries. Obviously at the moment who knows when it's out?

Original talk from FFG was simply "October". Then I and others started putting 2 and 2 together and assuming that lack of preview articles on the Core Set and the lack of an Upcoming Page update, indicated that it'd be mid to late October at the earliest. FFG tend to do weekly articles for a big release for 4-6 weeks ahead of the actual release. They just started previews for the Core Set on Friday, which does suggest a very late Oct/very early Nov release. Then they gave the FFG Live schedule for Oct with Tuesday 29th Oct described as

Quote

celebrate the impending release of Marvel Champions: The Card Game

So hopefully they mean the release is that Friday, November 1st.

Some other FLGS sources are now saying that the Core Set and the Green Goblin pack will both be released on Friday 15th.

But regardless of all the above I think saying:

Quote

you can already tell FFG has no intentions of supporting this game very long. We're looking at the new RuneW ars for sure.

Is a bit much.

FFG have shown that they will always pump more resources and releases into their IP games than games without an IP - see Legion vs Runewars, Journeys in Middle Earth vs Descent/Runebound etc.

The Marvel IP is massive - it's probably the biggest, oldest and most universally IP in entertainment. Co-op LCGs have shown themselves to be really successful - FFG are probably rubbing their hands with glee - thinking if Arkham is this big, with a dark, niche horror theme - imagine how big Marvel Champions could be?

And now the villain phase, which makes 6 previews in 8 weeks. Soooo... yeah.

The LCG model would work for a competitive game if FFG would stop deciding they needed to be overdesigned. The complicated you make these games, the harder they are to grab new players. Also a lack of rotation just makes this worse. If a competitive LCG wants to work they need to rotate often and just allow new players to get in without feeing like they need to buy a mountain of cards. Also the mechanics they come up with for the Competitive LCGs they make are just far too complex to hook or keep many new players.

6 hours ago, Buhallin said:

And now the villain phase, which makes 6 previews in 8 weeks. Soooo... yeah.

To be fair, I posted that when it was 4 in 8 weeks. But still...

Legion: 7 articles, 4 weeks

X-Wing: 6 articles, 4 weeks

Not that it's a fair comparison between two different types of games, but I'm just saying that number isn't particularly impressive or even average.

But again, FFG doesn't exactly have much fan confidence right about now. Netrunner, Imperial Assault, Runebound, RuneWars, Elder Sign, 40k: Conquest, Star Wars Destiny, Doom, all have been mismanged in some way or left to die a silent death without proper community interaction. Descent would've been added to that list if not for the AMA earlier. And for the record, I only play about a third of those games myself.

2 hours ago, Fracturedorb said:

The LCG model would work for a competitive game if FFG would stop deciding they needed to be overdesigned. The complicated you make these games, the harder they are to grab new players. Also a lack of rotation just makes this worse. If a competitive LCG wants to work they need to rotate often and just allow new players to get in without feeing like they need to buy a mountain of cards. Also the mechanics they come up with for the Competitive LCGs they make are just far too complex to hook or keep many new players.

I think it also messes things up to have a bit of everything in each pack. It makes you buy like 5 packs just to build one deck. And a lot of the cards you dont use.

I am not saying faction packs all the time. But instead focus packs on 2-4 factions, maybe 5 at most. One faction could get 7 cards give or take, and that gives a good core to a deck. Then 2 other factions get 4 or 5 cards to flesh out their side. That leaves 3-5 cards for a 4th faction or some neutrals. Then you just mix up which factions.

So you get a pack for a faction, you see the fun things another faction has. So you buy another pack to flesh out that second faction, and so on.

5 hours ago, Supertoe said:

To be fair, I posted that when it was 4 in 8 weeks. But still...

Legion: 7 articles, 4 weeks

X-Wing: 6 articles, 4 weeks

Not that it's a fair comparison between two different types of games, but I'm just saying that number isn't particularly impressive or even average.

But again, FFG doesn't exactly have much fan confidence right about now. Netrunner, Imperial Assault, Runebound, RuneWars, Elder Sign, 40k: Conquest, Star Wars Destiny, Doom, all have been mismanged in some way or left to die a silent death without proper community interaction. Descent would've been added to that list if not for the AMA earlier. And for the record, I only play about a third of those games myself.

I mean, it still seems a bit dramatic- the game isn’t even out yet. I predict a few more articles leading up to release and then at least 1 a month going forward to preview the upcoming pack. There’s very little to go on to indicate that they don’t intend to support this - the very fact they’ve announced things like the Wrecking Crew in the first 4 releases mean they’re not planning to just drop all the biggest names first thing and then have no where to go with it.

This property is huge - the comics are long established and well loved, and the MCU means that some of the characters have incredible recognition even amongst people who have never seen one of the films or read a comic book. Marvel is a lot more popular than Star Wars right now - there’s no reason at all to believe that FFG aren’t going to support this game properly. I think all of the changes to the standard LCG model are designed to give the game additional longevity and mass appeal -

- easier to pick up and play

- stand alone hero packs and scenarios to encourage people to only buy what they want

To me, these suggest they want (or expect) the game to have wider appeal than some of their other products, and are structuring it in a way that you could still buy into it in 5 years time without feeling like you have to buy everything to catch up.

Geez, we usually wait until at least after a game is released to start speculating that it's dying....

2 hours ago, Vlad3theImpaler said:

Geez, we usually wait until at least after a game is released to start speculating that it's dying....

I’ve noticed a trend towards melodrama as a response to recent announcements.

10 hours ago, Supertoe said:

To be fair, I posted that when it was 4 in 8 weeks. But still...

Legion: 7 articles, 4 weeks

X-Wing: 6 articles, 4 weeks

Not that it's a fair comparison between two different types of games, but I'm just saying that number isn't particularly impressive or even average.

But again, FFG doesn't exactly have much fan confidence right about now. Netrunner, Imperial Assault, Runebound, RuneWars, Elder Sign, 40k: Conquest, Star Wars Destiny, Doom, all have been mismanged in some way or left to die a silent death without proper community interaction. Descent would've been added to that list if not for the AMA earlier. And for the record, I only play about a third of those games myself.

So, basically if their averages hold true, we’re due to get ~10 more articles to catch up

Based on the two previews, it wouldn’t surprise me if there were one for deck building still to come.

19 hours ago, Supertoe said:

To be fair, I posted that when it was 4 in 8 weeks. But still...

Legion: 7 articles, 4 weeks

X-Wing: 6 articles, 4 weeks

Not that it's a fair comparison between two different types of games, but I'm just saying that number isn't particularly impressive or even average.

If you know it's not a fair comparison, why even bring it up?

On 10/2/2019 at 4:36 PM, Buhallin said:

If you know it's not a fair comparison, why even bring it up?

With the explosion of popularity of board games, lots of folks want them to replicate video/ computer game cadence of BIG RELEASE - EXPANSIONS - SMALLER CONTENT. The reality is when board games try to do this, it is content overload and the games usually become unwieldy. My shelf of unopened and rarely played games can attest to that.

There are a lot of good parallels between video and board games AND I definitely am enjoying this renaissance period for the board game hobby...but the release cadence of video games is not something FFG or others should try to replicate. Board games should always feel 'content complete' and standalone after their release. I should be able to play many, many times and not feel the 'need' for expansions. Additional content is welcome, but certainly not a must. I applaud FFG during the AMA for saying 'we don't want to ride a horse until its dead, but give each game a life cycle'

Marvel Champions and other LCGs are brilliant in that they support an easy release schedule which works best in co-op. Rarely do expansions for LCGs change game mechanics dramatically, rather they add different types of cards for theme and function. They add new cards that you may or may not want to buy. (i.e. I didn't buy every LOTR pack upon release and still felt my game was sufficient).

So, TLDR, when I hear complaints about release date, game is dead, no expansions...I immediately assume that person is a video/MMO gamer and those communities thrive on that behavior.

So the last I recall of the proposed release schedule was Core Set for October, Green Goblin for November and Cap for December...no firm dates provided. When I look at the upcoming products page the Core Set and Capt America are on the boat, but I don't see anything for Green Goblin. As the Goblin should be due out before Capt America I find this strange.

Anybody hear whether there may be a delay with the Green Goblin scenario pack release?

32 minutes ago, Janaka said:

So the last I recall of the proposed release schedule was Core Set for October, Green Goblin for November and Cap for December...no firm dates provided. When I look at the upcoming products page the Core Set and Capt America are on the boat, but I don't see anything for Green Goblin. As the Goblin should be due out before Capt America I find this strange.

Anybody hear whether there may be a delay with the Green Goblin scenario pack release?

The upcoming products page is rarely accurate and should definitely not be used to judge whether products are delayed or not...

On 10/2/2019 at 5:36 PM, Buhallin said:

If you know it's not a fair comparison, why even bring it up?

You'll find the answer is already in my post

Look, I'm just as excited about the game as you. But it's okay to have differing viewpoints, or to view something about the game or FFG negatively. We don't have to be unwavering stans.

Hopefully Disney pressures FFG into supporting this game as much as they do with the star wars games 😍

47 minutes ago, Supertoe said:

You'll find the answer is already in my post

Look, I'm just as excited about the game as you. But it's okay to have differing viewpoints, or to view something about the game or FFG negatively. We don't have to be unwavering stans.

I'm not saying you have to be. But presenting unfair comparisons - that you even admit are unfair - doesn't help anyone. I might as well say "My commute home was 15 minutes longer than usual last night - that's worse than average, so the game's already dying!"