Discuss.
is Wat+Kraken that good?
What are Belbullabs even good for?
Wat (with Kraken and an appropriate squad) and Greivous are both great, with Impervium and S1 it's one of the most efficient ships in the game in terms of survivability.
I use it as a support ship to carry the Tactical Relay. The 3-attack is mostly a bonus.
Grievous, on the other hand, is worthy flying like an attack craft.
Edited by Vector StrikeThey are superb....
....for mis-naming! Bellyrub is my favourite.
Outside of the relay they carry, they are a native 3-dice attack ship that can preposition with mods if it really, really has to. It can usually take one decent smack and not explode as well, which is a nice bonus.
Bulbasaurs are great relay carriers...... also 3 die primary ain't to be sniffed at.
Tactical Relay. And a cheap 3-dice gun.
Pilot abilities and Tactical Relays. Local guy has been reaking havoc with a Sear swarm.
I have seen a lot of success running Grievous with Outmaneuver, Afterburners, and Soulless One as a kinda-sorta ace. Yeah his pilot skill is low and he lacks blue on his dial, but good re-positioning and good modified attacks when out of arc let him rip through enemy ships. It is important to have a feint or some other scary ship on the board, cause he does melt under focused fire pretty quick. I like to run with either a scimitar and some drones or another bubble and some hunters. Wanna try pairing him with some of the Nantex pilots when I get a chance.
What are they good for? 3 red dice. It's meaningfully cheaper than an X-Wing. It's tougher than a Striker or Interceptor. Compared to a Kihraxz, it has useful linked actions. Their blues are tragic, but that's a problem for next turn.
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Feethan Ottraw Autopilot is good at being cheap. 36 isn't the cheapest native 3-red ship (TIE Interceptor and TIE Striker are 34), but it's close. It can easily be part of a 5-ship list. Being only Calculate instead of Focus kinda matters on offense, but it's not uncommon one of these needs to spend their token to defend.
- I can't wait to try out a pair of these with Berwer Kret. I'm thinking 2 of these, Ensnare Berwer, and non-Ensnare Sun Fac (points-wise, I can't get Ensnare).
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Skakoan Ace I haven't flown. In theory, the thing they do well is provide a Talent slot. Not much in the faction does.
- Flying 4 of these with a Hyena to provide DRK-1 Probes for long-range Locks might be good. 4 ships with Focus/Lock/(maybe Crack Shot), shooting at Init 3, plus a 2-dice pop-gun to assist (and maybe it's DBS-404, maybe making 4-dice Range 1 attacks).
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Sear is well known to be solid. His "crack shot" effect is potent, and its range is HUGE.
- Sear + Swarm = Good.
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Wat Tambor has done OK for me when I've flown him, but I still don't know if I like him. In the heart of a big swarm, Sear seems better. If I'm running multiple Bubble-buddies, Grievous is probably my 2nd choice.
- I guess the strength of Wat in a list is that he doesn't need to flank, he can stick with the main group.
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Grievous with Crack Shot is an amazing 45 point toss-in. A great pocket ace or filler ace. Toss him on the opposite side of the board from the rest of your list, and with the Boost and 5-straight he'll be able to close in on the flank. If left alone, it's not too hard for him to get double-mod shots, and even 4-dice Crack Shot. If Sear's around, and you've got a way of getting Calculate on Grievous (DFS-311 is my favorite), he can even double-crack-shot.
- I've mostly put him in with multiple Belbullab lists, but I think he could probably slide in along side a more traditional swarm, replacing two of the Vultures. Init 4 isn't super high, but it's not bad.
- I understand the impulse to load him up with stuff like Outmaneuver, Soulless One, and Impervium. He's not bad like that. However, I think it's probably better to keep him cheap. At 45 points with just Crack Shot, he's an amazing pilot for punching up, and lets the rest of your list get that much stronger. Init 4 isn't quite high enough to go full ace on him, IMHO.
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Soulless One is great, and worth the points on someone. When I'm flying a multiple Bubbles list, if there is a relay carrier, they get Soulless One. I don't care about lore if Grievous is on the flank, I want GG cheap, and I want to protect Sear with Kraken.
Impervium Plating isn't bad. I'll do what I can to get it on a Soulless One, but it's lower priority on anyone else. It'll be better than Hull or Shield, IMHO, due to the price, but a little RNG. I haven't tried out the 5x Impervium Autopilots, but it might be OK.
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Overall, my favorite multiple Belbullab list is this:
- Sear (Kraken, Soulless One, Impervium Plating) 59
- Feethan Ottraw Autopilot (-) 36
- Feethan Ottraw Autopilot (-) 36
- DFS-311 (Landing Struts) 24
- General Grievous (Crack Shot) 45
Grievous is a nasty flanker, Sear is in the main group with the two Autopilots, and presents a decent-enough threat. DFS-311 sits on a rock and hands out calculate tokens, and that's fine for its cheap-cheap 24 points. It's a list which likes to get into a scrum and fight.
Edited by theBitterFig
This thread has lots of stuff on Belbullabs (it's from April, which means everything became better after July points change)
https://community.fantasyflightgames.com/topic/257378-belbullab-22/?tab=comments#comment-2954311
4 hours ago, Blail Blerg said:Discuss.
is Wat+Kraken that good?
I think so - especially with Treacherous. If he flies even with three Vultures, he gets an entire primary attack reroll without the help of an EPT or lock. That's pretty impressive, since he can still take a focus for mods.
1 hour ago, Brad84 said:Bulbasaurs are great relay carriers...... also 3 die primary ain't to be sniffed at.
I agree - it definitely adds punch to a list with a lot of expendables.
54 minutes ago, theBitterFig said:What are they good for? 3 red dice. It's meaningfully cheaper than an X-Wing. It's tougher than a Striker or Interceptor. Compared to a Kihraxz, it has useful linked actions. Their blues are tragic, but that's a problem for next turn.
- Feethan Ottraw Autopilot is good at being cheap. 36 isn't the cheapest native 3-red ship (TIE Interceptor and TIE Striker are 34), but it's close. It can easily be part of a 5-ship list. Being only Calculate instead of Focus kinda matters on offense, but it's not uncommon one of these needs to spend their token to defend.
- I can't wait to try out a pair of these with Berwer Kret. I'm thinking 2 of these, Ensnare Berwer, and non-Ensnare Sun Fac (points-wise, I can't get Ensnare).
- Skakoan Ace I haven't flown. In theory, the thing they do well is provide a Talent slot. Not much in the faction does.
- Flying 4 of these with a Hyena to provide DRK-1 Probes for long-range Locks might be good. 4 ships with Focus/Lock/(maybe Crack Shot), shooting at Init 3, plus a 2-dice pop-gun to assist (and maybe it's DBS-404, maybe making 4-dice Range 1 attacks).
- Sear is well known to be solid. His "crack shot" effect is potent, and its range is HUGE.
- Sear + Swarm = Good.
- Wat Tambor has done OK for me when I've flown him, but I still don't know if I like him. In the heart of a big swarm, Sear seems better. If I'm running multiple Bubble-buddies, Grievous is probably my 2nd choice.
- I guess the strength of Wat in a list is that he doesn't need to flank, he can stick with the main group.
- Grievous with Crack Shot is an amazing 45 point toss-in. A great pocket ace or filler ace. Toss him on the opposite side of the board from the rest of your list, and with the Boost and 5-straight he'll be able to close in on the flank. If left alone, it's not too hard for him to get double-mod shots, and even 4-dice Crack Shot. If Sear's around, and you've got a way of getting Calculate on Grievous (DFS-311 is my favorite), he can even double-crack-shot.
- I've mostly put him in with multiple Belbullab lists, but I think he could probably slide in along side a more traditional swarm, replacing two of the Vultures. Init 4 isn't super high, but it's not bad.
- I understand the impulse to load him up with stuff like Outmaneuver, Soulless One, and Impervium. He's not bad like that. However, I think it's probably better to keep him cheap. At 45 points with just Crack Shot, he's an amazing pilot for punching up, and lets the rest of your list get that much stronger. Init 4 isn't quite high enough to go full ace on him, IMHO.
//
Soulless One is great, and worth the points on someone. When I'm flying a multiple Bubbles list, if there is a relay carrier, they get Soulless One. I don't care about lore if Grievous is on the flank, I want GG cheap, and I want to protect Sear with Kraken.
Impervium Plating isn't bad. I'll do what I can to get it on a Soulless One, but it's lower priority on anyone else. It'll be better than Hull or Shield, IMHO, due to the price, but a little RNG. I haven't tried out the 5x Impervium Autopilots, but it might be OK.
//
Overall, my favorite multiple Belbullab list is this:
- Sear (Kraken, Soulless One, Impervium Plating) 59
- Feethan Ottraw Autopilot (-) 36
- Feethan Ottraw Autopilot (-) 36
- DFS-311 (Landing Struts) 24
- General Grievous (Crack Shot) 45
Grievous is a nasty flanker, Sear is in the main group with the two Autopilots, and presents a decent-enough threat. DFS-311 sits on a rock and hands out calculate tokens, and that's fine for its cheap-cheap 24 points. It's a list which likes to get into a scrum and fight.
Some really valuable observations here, @theBitterFig !
You get 1 for free with every 2 Vultures
A friend of mine flew General Grievous along side some other (non-vulture) ships in a CIS squad that he was working on. Grievous with the title is pretty consistant with his green and red dice (so long as you can manage arcs to pull of his tricks).
Stat-wise, the whole ship feels like an odd take on an X-wing. The dial is great (as long as you are not stressed), and you do have a solid linked action set IF you are willing to deal with the stress after.
The Belbullab is a good, agile chassis. You really can't go wrong with a knife fighting Greivous.
36 minutes ago, Captain Lackwit said:The Belbullab is a good, agile chassis. You really can't go wrong with a knife fighting Greivous.
I have to disagree with "agile". It maneuvers like a drunk rhino with any stress which makes it hard to use the linked actions effectively.
40 minutes ago, MasterShake2 said:
I have to disagree with "agile". It maneuvers like a drunk rhino with any stress which makes it hard to use the linked actions effectively.
Try it with Daredevil. It greatly enhances the ability of the ship to maintain firing arcs while stressed.
Just now, PhantomFO said:Try it with Daredevil. It greatly enhances the ability of the ship to maintain firing arcs while stressed.
But you can turn the same amount without it of you start unstressed.
Daredevil is worth bringing but it doesn't actually increase the agility of the ship much.
6 minutes ago, thespaceinvader said:But you can turn the same amount without it of you start unstressed.
Daredevil is worth bringing but it doesn't actually increase the agility of the ship much.
Yeah, but Shake was talking about how poorly the ship knife-fights once you get stressed. Daredevil goes a long way towards fixing that.
Plus, if you are starting unstressed, you're still going to be more maneuverable. You can do consecutive hard-1 turns in a single activation! You know who can't do consecutive hard-1 turns? JEDI.
Edited by PhantomFOThe thing I found most useful with daredevil is getting into out of arc flanking positions. Being able to vary your potential endpoints from a 1 turn to a 1 turn after a 5 straight gives you a lot of flexibility in planning and in surprising your opponent with where you end up.
It's one of the better talents for Greivous but more often than not I run him without one at all to save points.
Just now, PhantomFO said:Yeah, but Shake was talking about how poorly the ship knife-fights once you get stressed. Daredevil goes a long way towards fixing that.
Plus, if you are starting unstressed, you're still going to be more maneuverable. You can do consecutive hard-1 turns in a single activation! You know who can't do consecutive hard-1 turns? JEDI.
You still have to 2 bank, 2 straight or 3 straight to clear stress which is way too far to consider this ship a knife fighter even with daredevil.
There’s another problem of what even the point of mid init aces are in separatists
or what is the point of mid init aces in the first place
2 hours ago, MasterShake2 said:
I have to disagree with "agile". It maneuvers like a drunk rhino with any stress which makes it hard to use the linked actions effectively.
I like to say that you have to get out and push ships such as the BielzaBatmobile once they get a stress token.
I like the 50’s roadster in space, personally. They’re fairly low priced, and can be slotted in as a nice filler for when ALL THE VULTURES isn’t something you’re feeling that day. Plus as someone mentioned, Grievous with Soulless One is a **** of a harasser. Despite how finicky and odd they can be, my only complaint with the BattaRangs is that they are only available in the squad box.
1 hour ago, It’s One Of Ours said:Despite how finicky and odd they can be, my only complaint with the BattaRangs is that they are only available in the squad box.
I'm still waiting for someone to tell me they have too many and want me to buy one of theirs.... I want more, but don't need more Vultures.
4 hours ago, Kleeg005 said:I'm still waiting for someone to tell me they have too many and want me to buy one of theirs.... I want more, but don't need more Vultures.
NO. SUCH. THING.