4 hours ago, TasteTheRainbow said:

They need something for sure, and lower points isn’t a realistic way to do it.

Disagree. You'd be amazed what a difference 2 points could make. The Lothal Rebel will mostly be helped by adjustments to crew and gunners. Hera is very very close to useful, and if other I5s cost what they should she'd be even better. The Phantoms need to come down a little as well, on the whole, so that would help quite a bit. Generally some crew/gunners need to come down some more as well. Ezra's still trash at 14 when VTG is 8. He should be around 11 points and would be useful-to good Bistan and Han are also overpriced, and more gunner options wouldn't hurt.

Saw and Magva are around where they should be, but a lot of other rebel crew is either too niche or too expensive. Baze should be 1 point. Fight me. He'd actually be pretty good on AS Hera if he was. Chewbacca and Hera crew should also be cheaper as they're just a tad too expensive for how situational they are at the moment.

Try these costs:

Ghost

Lothal Rebel - 67

Chopper - 68

Hera - 71

Kanan - 76

Attack Shuttles

Zeb - 33

Ezra - 38

Hera - 37

Sabine - 39

Sheathipedes

Zeb - 31

AP-5 - 32

Ezra - 36

Fenn - 48

Rebel Crew/Gunners

Ezra Gunner - 11

Kanan Crew - 12

Bistan Gunner - 10

Han Gunner - 10

Baze Malbus - 1

Chewbacca - 2

Hera Syndulla - 2

Saw Gerrera - 4/6/8 (by base size)

Magva Yarro - 4/6/8 (by base size)

Priced like that, I'd play tons of this stuff. A Lothal Rebel with Zeb Sheathipede clocks in at 98 points, so you have a big fat ship with a free coordinate every turn and a 4-die attack that uses less than half of your list. Upgrade it a little and you can have Hera with AP-5 for 103 points and still room for a Supernatural Luke or Advanced Sensors Corran and several upgrades. Or take Sense Kanan with Sense/Cassian Ezra and slide in a couple of Intimidation A-Wings for some awesome defensive reduction and blocking, and he can keep the little guys from dying, while everyone's getting great dodge/block potential from Senses and Cassian.

Points really are good at balancing. I think the biggest problem with the Ghost is that the inflated phantom prices make its unique ship ability pretty irrelevant.

The more I think about it, the more I think that a minor point reduction and allowing coordinate to work at range 0 would do it. Maybe cost the ghost title at a point in exchange.

Think about it, right now I’m pretty sure only the Ghost would gain a benefit from this change. I don’t think anyone else gets a free coordinate, and if I’m wrong, Ahsoka can already quasi-coordinate herself, and it’s not like she’s blowing up the meta.

range 0 coordinate is great, but doesn’t help non-title

There were a lot of “close to good” pilots in day 2 of worlds. Hera was not among them.

Besides some type of upgrade or points change what could possibly make a giant space brick any good? 😁

10 hours ago, Hawkimon said:

I'd say bring back the original statline of the VCX, it lost 2 sheilds in the move to 2nd - yet a comparable ship like the Upsilon retained its statline.

Gimme that stop and Tavson pilot ability, lol. Keep the shields.

Better escort options.

The Rebellion needs cheaper A-Wings.

58 minutes ago, KCDodger said:

Better escort options.

The Rebellion needs cheaper A-Wings.

Eh, not really? Maybe a little. The problem is more that there’s not really enough room after the Ghost and its stuff.

And the Phantoms and TIEs are all too much, and that’s the only other real filler Rebels have.

And missiles are too expensive as well. They could be cheaper if Passive Sensors weren’t such a steal. That would make Z-95s and A-Wings better without making the SF busted.

And of course the Ghost costs too much.

To not have 4 red dice and be a pain in the zzz with turret options to fuel even more annoying danger areas with combo shenanigans.

The faq on the Hera/seasoned navigator trick does make me sad, but I still feel like she is somewhat usable in casual.

The turret nerf's have sorta made the intimidation build the only realistic one if you want any wingmen.

try something like this, it works for me in pickup games here and there.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Hera Syndulla VCX-100

W/intimidation, Nien Numb, Zeb Orrelios

Total- 82

Wedge Antillies T-65

W/Predator

Total-57

Thane Kyrell T-65

W/Outmaneuver

Total-54

List total-193

My thought process was along the lines of Wedge is powerful enough with minimal upgrades and will likely get focused by my opponent because everyone recognizes the pilot and watches him like a hawk, thus I should play him super safe to try to make sure he lasts to the later half of the game.

With Hera the goal is to be the lead ship and bump if possible as it tends to lead to a crippled or dead enemy ship with the support of my other ships. (intimidation helps your allies too dont forget) Nien helps make Hera more unpredictable as her pilot ability makes the ghost ALMOST have a re-position action in effect.

Thane has outmaneuver because I expect him to draw the least amount of attention from my opponent, as well as further putting weight on my opponent's flying skills as now they have to be wary of

-Hera trying to bump/get range 1 shots.

-Wedge being in range with a modded shot.

-Thane coming in from an off angle to force my opponent to face him and give my other ships a good chase angle, or ignore him and get hit harder than Wedge.

In practice it seems to work fairly well unless I am facing a missile/torpedo spam list.

I said it before but with the Nien ruling I will say it again, "Hera pilot should also have Hera crew ability."

5 hours ago, Frimmel said:

I said it before but with the Nien ruling I will say it again, "Hera pilot should also have Hera crew ability."

Agreed; it would certainly improve her synergy with Ezra and Kanan.

I expect Phoenix Leader Hera will have that ability, plus some form of stress mitigation. I guess we'll see.

5 hours ago, Frimmel said:

I said it before but with the Nien ruling I will say it again, "Hera pilot should also have Hera crew ability."

Sorry, i thought that ruling only affected seasoned navigator. I saw it mentioned, but not explained on the first page.

VCX-100 Light Freighter - •Hera Syndulla - 103
•Hera Syndulla - Spectre-2 (73)
Swarm Tactics (4)
Ion Cannon Turret (5)
•Lando Calrissian (2)
•Jyn Erso (2)
Stealth Device (3)
• Ghost (0)
•Ezra Bridger (14)

RZ-1 A-wing - Phoenix Squadron Pilot - 31
Phoenix Squadron Pilot - (30)
Crack Shot (1)

RZ-1 A-wing - Phoenix Squadron Pilot - 31
Phoenix Squadron Pilot - (30)
Crack Shot (1)

Attack Shuttle - •“Zeb” Orrelios - 34
•“Zeb” Orrelios - Spectre-4 (34)

Total: 199/200

View in the X-Wing Squad Builder

I tried to make a good thematic list with some solid concepts behind it.

31 minutes ago, KCDodger said:

VCX-100 Light Freighter - •Hera Syndulla - 103
•Hera Syndulla - Spectre-2 (73)
Swarm Tactics (4)
Ion Cannon Turret (5)
•Lando Calrissian (2)
•Jyn Erso (2)
Stealth Device (3)
• Ghost (0)
•Ezra Bridger (14)

RZ-1 A-wing - Phoenix Squadron Pilot - 31
Phoenix Squadron Pilot - (30)
Crack Shot (1)

RZ-1 A-wing - Phoenix Squadron Pilot - 31
Phoenix Squadron Pilot - (30)
Crack Shot (1)

Attack Shuttle - •“Zeb” Orrelios - 34
•“Zeb” Orrelios - Spectre-4 (34)

Total: 199/200

View in the X-Wing Squad Builder

I tried to make a good thematic list with some solid concepts behind it.

That stealth device won't last you a single round. And then Lando and Jyn will be useless to you.

Ezra's not too bad but he costs too much for what you get. If you want to keep him stressed, Maul makes a nice combo, but only on a lower-initiative ship, which are all overpriced. And you're sinking even more points into him that way too.

Cassian and AP-5 both combo well with Hera/Ezra, but most of the time you're better off with just a VTG anyway. Half the time the double-tap isn't worth the 13-19 points you're sinking into it.

46 minutes ago, KCDodger said:

VCX-100 Light Freighter - •Hera Syndulla - 103
•Hera Syndulla - Spectre-2 (73)
Swarm Tactics (4)
Ion Cannon Turret (5)
•Lando Calrissian (2)
•Jyn Erso (2)
Stealth Device (3)
• Ghost (0)
•Ezra Bridger (14)

RZ-1 A-wing - Phoenix Squadron Pilot - 31
Phoenix Squadron Pilot - (30)
Crack Shot (1)

RZ-1 A-wing - Phoenix Squadron Pilot - 31
Phoenix Squadron Pilot - (30)
Crack Shot (1)

Attack Shuttle - •“Zeb” Orrelios - 34
•“Zeb” Orrelios - Spectre-4 (34)

Total: 199/200

View in the X-Wing Squad Builder

I tried to make a good thematic list with some solid concepts behind it.

You need evade dice to use evade tokens.

1 hour ago, DakkaDakka12 said:

Sorry, i thought that ruling only affected seasoned navigator. I saw it mentioned, but not explained on the first page.

I could have it wrong but my understanding is that Nien does not give Hera pilot the entire dial to choose from. He reduces the difficulty but not till after Hera can change it. When this thread started the ruling was not out.

On 10/26/2019 at 2:54 PM, ClassicalMoser said:

That stealth device won't last you a single round. And then Lando and Jyn will be useless to you.

Ezra's not too bad but he costs too much for what you get. If you want to keep him stressed, Maul makes a nice combo, but only on a lower-initiative ship, which are all overpriced. And you're sinking even more points into him that way too.

Cassian and AP-5 both combo well with Hera/Ezra, but most of the time you're better off with just a VTG anyway. Half the time the double-tap isn't worth the 13-19 points you're sinking into it.

Frak frak frak frak frak frak frak FRAK FRAK

WHY IS EVADE SO COMPLETELY FRAKKING USELESS!?

35 minutes ago, KCDodger said:

Frak frak frak frak frak frak frak FRAK FRAK

WHY IS EVADE SO COMPLETELY FRAKKING USELESS!?

It’s not, it’s just a ton more thematic. VCXs aren’t dodging TIEs at R1. They’re reinforcing.

They might dodge R3-5 turbolasers though

4 minutes ago, ClassicalMoser said:

It’s not, it’s just a ton more thematic. VCXs aren’t dodging TIEs at R1. They’re reinforcing.

They might dodge R3-5 turbolasers though

Guh.

1 hour ago, ClassicalMoser said:

It’s not, it’s just a ton more thematic. VCXs aren’t dodging TIEs at R1. They’re reinforcing.

They might dodge R3-5 turbolasers though

They dodge a LOT of tie shots in the show. Like a lot.

Those tie pilots must have been fresh out of the academy or something.

4 hours ago, TasteTheRainbow said:

They dodge a LOT of tie shots in the show. Like a lot.

At R3 and obstructed, sure.

But I think it’s more a matter of the TIEs just plain missing. Or mechanics-wise, she’s planning her maneuvers well and staying out of arcs in general, not just rolling oodles of green dice.

14 hours ago, TasteTheRainbow said:

They dodge a LOT of tie shots in the show. Like a lot.

Not really. It is kind of like ClassicalMoser said with Hera just going the right way and with the Ghost being a tough ship. The game in my opinion gets the mechanics of the Ghost right on a thematic level more or less.

The thing is the ship and docked attack shuttle should be your entire list and you should probably get a few of the crew abilities and the shuttle ability even while docked.

If you start with this:

VCX-100 Light Freighter - •Hera Syndulla - 116
•Hera Syndulla - Spectre-2 (73)
Dorsal Turret (3)
Proton Torpedoes (13)
•Kanan Jarrus (12)
•“Chopper” (1)
• Ghost (0)
•Ezra Bridger (14)

Attack Shuttle - •“Zeb” Orrelios - 39
•“Zeb” Orrelios - Spectre-4 (34)
•Sabine Wren (3)
• Phantom (2)

Total: 155/200

View in the X-Wing Squad Builder

Then you tack on the Hera crew ability, Chopper Rebel Astro ability (ditching the re-charge charges ability,) Zeb crew ability, and a proton bomb. Clock that in at 190ish so there is a shot at moving last? Drop the rear attack from the shuttle to 2 die. And that's it. No subs or changes or additional stuff.

That's broken or NPE to go against isn't it?

I've been looking at the following, probably trash, but on paper...

Lothal Rebel

• Magva Yarro
• Saw Gerrera
• Shield Upgrade
• Fire-control System
• Dorsal Turret

Due to Initiative will frequently shooting last and getting shot at first. So, action is Reinforce, reduce the incoming, take a hit, get a TL, shoot back with dice mods and option to boot in a few crits. At 93 points give a lot of room for wing-mates, currently looking at Wedge and Arvel.

On 10/28/2019 at 1:08 PM, Shockwave said:

I've been looking at the following, probably trash, but on paper...

Lothal Rebel

• Magva Yarro
• Saw Gerrera
• Shield Upgrade
• Fire-control System
• Dorsal Turret

Due to Initiative will frequently shooting last and getting shot at first. So, action is Reinforce, reduce the incoming, take a hit, get a TL, shoot back with dice mods and option to boot in a few crits. At 93 points give a lot of room for wing-mates, currently looking at Wedge and Arvel.

I did something similar but with Kanan. Advanced sensors so you can always reinforce even when bumping or k-turning. Magva and force to ensure you have double mods all the time.

Also had ion turret and VTG for the double tap but not sure it's optimal.