There are several mentions of ancient blades that had no physical blades. Pardon me but it'll take a whiile to unearth it among all the books. I remember it quite clearly.

I'll go check Eisenhorn, I think it indicated he had a power sword with no blade, not a Sollex. Wheres that book...

Eisenhorn had the Abnett equivalent of a Sollex, it was a super rare special "power" sword, not the standard type.

Quicksilver - Aside from Eisenhorn's special lightsaber powersword, can you name authors (preferably not CS Goto or James Swallow, as both have more than one instance of having written before reading what they're writing about, ie: backflipping terminators armored marines and bolters firing lead), that use a different version of power sword that is not a xenos powerblade? They are all swords, with an activation button (rune, stud, etc) that sheath the blade in crackling energy. I really can't think of one, in fact, I think even Goto & Swallow got it right but it's been ages since I've punished myself by reading them.

If memory serves right, the description in the original RT book mentioned that only the crudest power swords had actual blades like most of those currently or recently depicted: the most advanced were wholly bladeless, while the majority had a hilt and a wire antenna around which the energy field was projected (said antenna usually being vastly shorter than the energy field, meaning a little dagger sheath could be concealing a full-sized power sword)

Well, think about it from a purely 40k standpoint. Most powerswords have actual blades, even the supposedly-superior weapons of the Space Marines. Only the MOST advanced of them are made of purely energy. The point of the disruption field is to soften the material to ease the job of cutting it with the blade. However: the density of the material is still going to have an impact on the effectiveness of the power sword. Power swords can cleave through armor that is thin enough to fit a humanoid, but is it really going to cut through a bulkhead? Compare it to a real-world analogy: a utility knife will cut through a hollow tube of styrene with ease, but if you were to try and cut through a solid block of styrene you might find it a bit more difficult.

FoxPhoenix135 said:

Actually the power field is the only thing that does the cutting. The blade doesn't make contact with anything while the field is on.

Personally I wouldn't allow a power sword, lightsaber style or not, to be able to cut through anything more than an inch thick. Chain weaponry and breaching tools I wouldn't have a problem with cutting through bulkheads and what not. Although, with the chain weapons I might have them loose a point of pen if the wielder fails a challenging Strength test per meter of cutting.

Remember that a power weapon needs to be activate to count as a power sword and the energy that this weapon uses has a limit. After the energy cell or battery or whatever a power weapon uses, runs out of energy thay need a new "battery" or else the power sword will be only a sword. (This is explained under the Power Weapons description) I recommend you to make this "batteries" difficult to find and expensive to buy. The players will have the posibility to open something with their power sword, but they will know that they are wasting the energy that they will need later during combat.

Have fun and keep rolling!!!

ItsUncertainWho said:

I've always wondered about this...if its not brute force that helps the sword or other power weapon why are we adding the strength characteristic (isnt that SB?). even in the tabletop game the Strength characteristic is added to a d6 to penetrate tank armor with a power weapon (str+2 if relic blade).

You should probably treat it using the Cover rules (pg 246), where if you exceed the Cover's AP, you reduce the AP by 1.

A hatchway is AP 16

A bulkhead is AP 32.

With 1d10+5+SB Pen 6, with a SB of 3 he's doing 6+5+3+6 an effective 20, with a 'max' (not counting fury) of 24. So, a hatchway, with AP 16, will be destroyed in 16 rounds.

A bulkhead is very difficult for a power sword to damage, let alone destroy as you can see (barring a lot of fury rolls). It would take something closer to a power fist (which does 2d10+6 Pen 9, for an effective 27 on average) to bash it for long enough to breach it, taking 32ish rounds to do so.

pvhammer said:

I'm a bit worried that you decided to thank this guy for the help and nobody else, while it's just my personal opinion that the advice offered by any/all of the other posters is better than this utter nonsense, I should to point out that power fields are marvels of the Dark Age of Technology, their arcane power cells last for generations (if they fail at all, so far I'm yet to hear of a power weapon failing by any means save sabotage or destruction) and while power weapons are not common items, they are eminently obtainable. But that's all besides the point, if Power Weapons are causing a problem in your game you either don't understand how effective they actually are or you're not accounting for them when you are planning your session. I am yet to play in a Dark Heresy or Rogue Trader campaign where even Heavy weapons and Melta Bombs have proven to be a problem at all, and you can bet your arse the melee specialist in any Dark Heresy cell (or even the whole party in Ascention and Rogue Trader ) would aspire to obtain at least a Power Blade, as there are other, even more potent weapons on offer, not to mention cheap, easily obtainable tools that can do far more damage to inanimate objects than a Power Sword.

Power Weapons are a staple in 40k, and it's not hard to account for the fact that your players have them, if you want a safe they can't get at just by shearing the hinges off with a Power Sword, make it out of something tougher than iron, an experienced Rogue Trader with his Power Sword would do something to the tune of D10+15 Damage, Pen 5. Now that's an optimistic number and it's still not enough to penetrate materials like armaplas or adamantine, and if it wasn't a power weapon it wouldn't even cause cosmetic damage to a starship's bulkhead.

So once you've got an idea of just how tough metals are, there are many other alternatives, a room shielded by a Power Field (which is more common than you may think), is as difficult to breach as the story demands. Just think about the possibilities, it's not hard!

Oh, and bobh , it's okay, the Power Weapon does actually make contact when you attack with it, the Power Field greatly enhances its cutting/smashing/chopping power but the disruptive field itself does not actually have any mass of its own, I don't pretend to know all the details, but I do know that the Power field being a solid, physical force that replaces the blade rather than augmenting it is just silly .

Thanks, Azraiel. I knew that I had it right, and that there was a physical blade in all but the most advanced power weapons. Otherwise, why would the type of power weapon matter? (Power axe, power swords, power blade)

I'm a bit worried that you decided to thank this guy for the help and nobody else.......

Power Weapons are a staple in 40k, and it's not hard to account for the fact that your players have them, if you want a safe they can't get at just by shearing the hinges off with a Power Sword, make it out of something tougher than iron, an experienced Rogue Trader with his Power Sword would do something to the tune of D10+15 Damage, Pen 5. Now that's an optimistic number and it's still not enough to penetrate materials like armaplas or adamantine, and if it wasn't a power weapon it wouldn't even cause cosmetic damage to a starship's bulkhead.

So once you've got an idea of just how tough metals are, there are many other alternatives, a room shielded by a Power Field (which is more common than you may think), is as difficult to breach as the story demands. Just think about the possibilities, it's not hard!

My apologies. I wish to thank everyone who responded to my post. I have followed the discussion avidly. Once the discussion turned to AP values I knew how to solve my games problems. My post was a result of my first two sessions as GM. My whole group was a bit murky on the rules. My original misunderstanding with power weapons was visualizing Henry Zou's Inquisitor carving through Chaos Tanks with his power fist. So I thought, hey power swords can do that too. I guess I wasn't prepared. But thank you all again, it has made me a better GM.

no one in my group has ever used a power sword as a door opener, had a guy use a melta pistol on a locked bulkhead. didn't open the dorr but istead ended up sealing it. not sure if that counts

pvhammer said:

Let them have a phasefield generator. Then they won't need to use the Power swords.

...have the batteries run out just as they are getting to the cutting maybe?

I've had a player use paired power fists to start tearing into a parked Arbites flyer. I ruled that while he could indeed rip through the armour's AP, he had to spend several turns to cause widespread enough damage to be able to walk in.

The notes on AP in this thread are a good thing for GMs to bear in mind. Though some of the more "trap-like" ideas might be fun in eccentric noble houses.

Give doors and whatno Hit Points and a AP value, if they can carve through it, thats fine, but would probably take a few rounds. But a Bulkhead door should be more like 40-50 hp and 20+ AP in my opinion....

To me there are two problems here:

First is a bit of a GM problem: It kind of feels like you are having a classic thematic problem. Lets look at D&D. Early on in D&D (lvl 1-12) characters are fairly normal and things like doors, locked chests, and town guards are obstacles. Then they start getting powerful. There are two ways to handle this, a right way, and a wrong way:

The wrong way is the route that Oblivion took: make everything tougher. Suddenly every chest is made of adamite, every town guard has a +6 sword and is level 8, every door has an anti-teleportation and anti-scrying field, and every trap does enough damage to level mountains. The benefit is that the GM can keep running things like he has been. It is a lot easier than the alternative. Unfortunately it robs the players of any feeling of advancement and power.

The right way, and the hard way for a GM, is to shift the scale of the story. Instead of saving towns they are saving countries, then the world. They are getting involved in intrigue, politics, and power plays. They no longer fight random monsters or clear dungeons infested by dangerous flora and fauna, they are no longer just endangering themselves, they are fighting armies, daemonic overlords, and making tough decisions that effect hundreds of thousand. This is VERY hard to do as a GM, but leads to memorable games and a feeling of grandure.

In short, Rogue Trader falls into the latter category of games. The obstacles you present your players should NOT be doors and safes, at least of the mundane variety. If there is a door they can't pass it should be an ancient Eldar gateway to a pocket dimension that contains the secret to curing a plague ravaging the sector. If there is an item they need it shouldn't be in a chest they have to unlock, but in the heart of an enemy installation. If there is a trap it isn't arrows coming from the wall, it is an ambush or warp gate.

You're RT characters shouldn't have any problems with a door or chest, they are far to powerful for that. They have a ship in orbit that can destroy continents, weapons that can bring down buildings, and yes, swords that cut through most materials like butter. Encourage that epic feeling, don't hamper it.

The second issue, and a more direct answer to your question, is your characters attitude:

As has been mentioned, they are not showing proper respect to an ancient and hallowed piece of technology. One that has a machine spirit. And yes, it should totally turn on them and refuse to work due to their disrespect. On top of that they should have problems with the ad-mech for disrespecting technology.

And thus my rant ends.