Please ignore....

Yeah, what Whafrog said (last).

And (to be fair) my answer about Storm Troopers goes straight back to the OP's original question, "How do I make sure my Storm Troopers are scary (and stay that way)."

My method works.

Very well in that regard.

Two other things to keep in mind.

1. The E-11 has a stun setting. (And the ISB has some questions that they'd like to ask).
2. Stormtroopers don't travel around in Battalion size groups. They have a lot of ground to cover and an initial encounter general starts with a pair (2) of pesky Troopers.

@whafrog

You are entitled to your opinion. I disagree.

I run my table more as a conductor letting the players guide and shape the narrative while I simply am there keep it interesting and make sure no one player takes over the party. The questions I've been asking are to help me wrap my head around how to do that in this game and keep the badass bads badass.

Also in both games the GM/DM has complete control over the outcome. The difference is that in this system you have more information to decide that outcome. Instead of a binary pass fail there are two scales. The scales of sucess/failure and advantage/disadvantage.

Succeeded with a ton of disadvantage? well you did it but... fail at huge advantage? so you screwed up but... not a supper difficult concept. You failed your shot the security gaurd but with advantage? Well you missed him but hit the canisters next to him which are now spewing smoke obscuring the party. Succeeded at disadvantage, you hit him alright, right as he was replying to a radio message.

My only concern with the dice mecanics of the dice is how strong is a triumph/despair?

Lastly I frankly hate the destiny point system. No GM/DM should need a mechanical way to make the game more difficult. Likewise having the player spends feed the GM can punish the players for using those abilities. Likewise the points only make sense when running verbatum from a script. Otherwise it is putting the two at odds. Something I do not want at my table. The destiny points made me think of the momentum system from Star Trek Adventures. Momentum is better but it's paired with the way worse Threat sysrem which is frankly just giving the DM a way to legally cheat. So I don't like either system. Instead I'm going to replace them with the plot points system out of the 5e DM guide. Each player gets one untill every one has spent their point then they all refresh, DM has to approve the use else it doesn't spend, and no player can spend two points back to back.

On ‎9‎/‎12‎/‎2019 at 10:21 AM, Grathew said:

Hello all, I am a new to the system DM from good old DnD 5e and I have a few questions before I pitch my first game.

Firstly how would you recommend forming the party? I tend to gently guide players into interactions and then throw something out that they have to deal with. Like a large monster breaking into town, being killed by the party. As the party members are from out of town they will end up getting arrested because they are all outsiders. Than either breaking out of jail together or working together to clear their names. I'm assuming this set up doesn't work in the edge of the empire, so what would be recommend?

Secondly how do I esculate threat? I understand the basics of the minion system but what would a low intensity conflict look like contrasted to a high intensity one. For example would using local milita troups be recommended if I wanted the stormtrooper to be the bonafied badasses they are supposed to be. Also how do I make stormtroopers truely terrifying for the players?

I'm also thinking having the players stuck on a planet for at least the first 'adventure' is this recommend? If so how should I go about it?

First, welcome to the boards.

As for getting the player-characters together, that can vary wildly. Plus, there's nothing saying that the PCs can't start out already knowing each other; you don't have to start the campaign with "you all meet in a cantina for the first time." It's quite possible that for an EotE game, the PCs are a crew of spacers that have worked together for some time, much like how Firefly started (with the exception of Simon and River really being the only "new crew"). That said, it sounds like you've got a decent idea for getting them together and working towards a common purpose.

As far as combat threats, this system is a little tricky to get the hang of, especially if you're coming in from a more tactically-focused system like the various d20-based games. To be frank, against a starting group of PCs that aren't decked out in high-end weapons with skill levels to match, a minion group of four stormtroopers is very dangerous threat; a friend of mine (Garrett, of the Threat Detected podcast) rather infamously had an experience with this system where after years of d20 Star Wars, he and his players were shocked to find that a couple minion groups of three stormtroopers each was enough to nearly TPK the entire party, in contrast to the same number of stormtroopers being very little of an actual threat to PCs in Saga Edition.

Starting out, it's better to underdo it than over do it. If you have stormtroopers show up, keep their numbers small; I'd say two minion groups of two troopers each will be sufficient to start with, and you can build from there as necessary. It might also help to use threats other than stormtroopers, such as street thugs or local law enforcers at the beginning, so that both you and the players can get a feel for what the party can handle in combat, and save the boys in white for a bit later (perhaps even the final battle of the introductory adventure).

Plus, combat in this system is different from a lot of other RPGs in that it's always going to be dangerous, and a PC getting taken out with a single attack is going to be a likelihood for all but the most combat-centric of builds; even the F&D lightsaber specs (pretty much sitting in the higher tiers of combat-centric specializations) can be taken down pretty rapidly with a few hits, and the game is intentionally meant so that it's much easier for the attacker to hit than it is for the defender to avoid damage. It takes an extremely focused and fairly specialized build to get a PC's Soak Value into the double-digits, and that even takes a significant amount of XP (probably so much that many campaigns will have ended by the time such a build "comes into its own").

I know you've panned on the Beginner Boxes earlier in the thread, but I'd seriously suggest checking them out, if only for some ideas on how to set up what could be considered "level appropriate" encounters for the party, with the EotE and TFA sets being the best at this; much as I like the F&D set, the challenge falls apart quickly if two or more PCs have a lightsaber in their possession, and AoR seems to scale things a little higher than necessary. Plus, as whafrog said, getting the extra dice doesn't hurt, and the follow-up adventures that are available for free on FFG's own website are generally quite good.

4 hours ago, Grathew said:

But at the same time I was contemplating on how I would run stormtroopers from the 501st for when my players eventually get noticed by Darth Vader.

For this, I would suggest just buffing their stats a bit. Maybe 2 extra health so they can take a hit from a blaster rifle with 2 Success without going down and if you want them to be more effective, give them 1 extra rank in certain skills (i.e. a minion group of 4 501st troopers get 4 skill ranks instead of 3).

As far as medics go, that isn't really all that useful for minion groups because they tend to go down in one or two hits and an NPC medic is just one more thing to keep track of.

2 hours ago, Grathew said:

Lastly I frankly hate the destiny point system. No GM/DM should need a mechanical way to make the game more difficult. Likewise having the player spends feed the GM can punish the players for using those abilities. Likewise the points only make sense when running verbatum from a script. Otherwise it is putting the two at odds. Something I do not want at my table. The destiny points made me think of the momentum system from Star Trek Adventures. Momentum is better but it's paired with the way worse Threat sysrem which is frankly just giving the DM a way to legally cheat. So I don't like either system. Instead I'm going to replace them with the plot points system out of the 5e DM guide. Each player gets one untill every one has spent their point then they all refresh, DM has to approve the use else it doesn't spend, and no player can spend two points back to back.

Just to make sure you are aware: there are talents that require destiny points to activate and signature abilities that even require 2 at a time to active so that solution won't work that well as soon as they come up at your table... you either have to modify pretty much everything they are connected to or stick with them as they are.

3 hours ago, Grathew said:

My only concern with the dice mecanics of the dice is how strong is a triumph/despair?

To borrow common RPG terms; a Triumph is "critically" successful while a Despair is something of a "fumble."

Quote

My only concern with the dice mecanics of the dice is how strong is a triumph/despair?

4 minutes ago, Mark Caliber said:

To borrow common RPG terms; a Triumph is "critically" successful while a Despair is something of a "fumble."

More specifically, you can use the table for expenditure of Advantage and Triumph to give you an idea of how powerful they are, but ultimately it's up to you as to how powerful it can be when the PCs request something with Triumph results.

You should also be consistent in the strength of what you do with results against the players so that they don't feel cheated because a Triumph from an NPC does more than a Triumph from a PC.

On 9/12/2019 at 7:21 AM, Grathew said:

1. Hello all, I am a new to the system DM from good old DnD 5e and I have a few questions before I pitch my first game.
2. Firstly how would you recommend forming the party?
3. Secondly how do I escalate threat? I understand the basics of the minion system but what would a low intensity conflict look like contrasted to a high intensity one. For example would using local militia troops be recommended if I wanted the stormtrooper to be the bona fide badasses they are supposed to be. Also how do I make stormtroopers truly terrifying for the players?
4. I'm also thinking having the players stuck on a planet for at least the first 'adventure' is this recommend? If so how should I go about it?

1. Hi and welcome I find that D&D has such a built-in understanding for people that it is really easy to run and play in, and it is basically a game that lives on it's native tropes. Meaning that running D&D is largely about running combat and hitting the same beats that everyone expects from D&D. D&D is very mechanically played typically, and it is a binary result dice system so it doesn't have as much player description usually: the DM typically does the bulk of the narration and description. This game has dice that are supposed to be rolled in the open and that the players are able to describe the positive results that show up from a roll of the dice pool. The dice in this game have a mind of their own and will change the story. This game is much more narrative in nature and works best as a collaborative effort. I allow my players to describe a lot, but I make sure they use caution if they are getting into describing things like how an enemy reacts for instance, which I feel is a bit too far into GM territory for player narrative control in most cases.

2. I personally would love to have Meet Scenes but in my experience they are always a disaster. I usually have them know each other and write in some past experiences together like the Fate system uses to connect PCs.

3. The Minion/Rival/Nemesis system works well to give the players something to fight for all situations. As someone else said, the situation is really what should determine the adversaries you use. One thing to remember is that this game does not have an exponentially growing defense system like D&D, The PCs will Always Be In Danger In Combat. The genius of the way that the combat system was built is that the PCs are going to be in danger of taking critical hits throughout their career instead of just at the beginning. Jay Little, the guy who designed the game, said he wanted it to always be a threat to engage in combat. For D&D players who typically enjoy the planned obsolescence of certain monsters, this can be a bit of a shock to their system.

4. I routinely start my players poor so that they can build up to leaving the planet either on their own ship or by booking passage. Are you a Sandbox Emergent type GM, or would you say you are a more Linear Module style GM? If you are a sandboxy gm I would say to watch out for radical freedom and players travelling at a whim because in my experience it can cause aimlessness. To combat this I instituted a fuel system so that they know the cost and time of a trip and will only engage in travel for story purposes, and not just for the **** of it.

1 hour ago, Malashim said:

Just to make sure you are aware: there are talents that require destiny points to activate and signature abilities that even require 2 at a time to active so that solution won't work that well as soon as they come up at your table... you either have to modify pretty much everything they are connected to or stick with them as they are.

I wasn't aware. I suppose I'll just start flipping darkside points to do things I was going to do anyway.

13 minutes ago, Grathew said:

I wasn't aware. I suppose I'll just start flipping darkside points to do things I was going to do anyway.

I do this all the time. It keeps players guessing, but it is also very appropriate in especially dangerous situations. If there could be a really bad consequence for failing a roll, spend a Dark side pip and upgrade a purple difficulty die into a red. It brings the opportunity for a Despair.

40 minutes ago, Grathew said:

I wasn't aware. I suppose I'll just start flipping darkside points to do things I was going to do anyway.

Maybe it helps to see them more like a way for you to up the tension of a situation - even on checks they should easily shine in it can make the whole table sitting on the edge of their seat when you flip a point, and the possibility of despair is on the table. Not to screw with them but make it more exciting.

And as soon as signature abilities and other talents with DP cost join the game, they also need those tense moments to fuel their awesome abilities.

17 hours ago, Grathew said:

I was wondering if rivals get bonus actions or out of intuitive actions. For example the goblin boss, who is roughly equivalent to a stormtrooper sargent, can swith places with an adjacent goblin whenever attacked redirecting the attack as well. I didn't see anything along those lines but I got the minion rule wrong so I thought I'd ask.

You are looking for the Squad rules, which let's the leader form a squad (or squadron in case of starfighters) and it gives bonuses for the whole group as well as meatshield for the leader.

I think it's in the AoR GM kit.

2 hours ago, Rimsen said:

You are looking for the Squad rules, which let's the leader form a squad (or squadron in case of starfighters) and it gives bonuses for the whole group as well as meatshield for the leader.

I think it's in the AoR GM kit.

It's also revisited in the Rise of the Separatists sourcebook, with some possible updates/tweaks (I've not done a side-by-side comparison of the two).

On 9/13/2019 at 2:30 PM, whafrog said:

he gets 5 Advantages trying to use Charm on an Imperial officer. He says "I know her, we used to date, and she still has a thing for me."

You're son is an evil genius.

6 hours ago, Donovan Morningfire said:

It's also revisited in the Rise of the Separatists sourcebook, with some possible updates/tweaks (I've not done a side-by-side comparison of the two).

It's more-or-less the same, but it doesn't have the Mission Specialist formation and I think that it's lacking one of the Squadron formations, but I haven't looked much at those, so I don't know off the top of my head.

The mission specialist formation allows a minion to use the squad leader's ranks in Leadership to perform certain skill checks.

So I've put together most of my party form arc. Any good ideas for the mostly criminal organization that hired the players?

My first thought was Black Sun but they seem a bit too high profile. If they have a shell/daughter organization that isn't as well known and more legitimate that would be perfect. Else I'll just go make it up.

Also how would BBY be written before the Battle of Yavin? I am thinking of starting around 18-17 BBY, but it feels wrong to call it BBY when the reference event hasn't happened yet.

On 9/13/2019 at 3:18 PM, Archlyte said:

For D&D players who typically enjoy the planned obsolescence of certain monsters

#### Kobolds! Those . . . .1/4 DC kobolds . . . . <shudder>.

YOU try taking on a swarm of those <censored> and tell me they're obsolete?!?!!?

1 hour ago, Grathew said:

Also how would BBY be written before the Battle of Yavin? I am thinking of starting around 18-17 BBY, but it feels wrong to call it BBY when the reference event hasn't happened yet.

37 PGA. (37th year of Palpatin's Galactic Empire . . . ).

?

As far as the Black Sun goes, couldn't you have the PCs perform jobs for a relatively low-level crime boss who they (and possibly he) don't know is actually working for the Black Sun? Based on the "Organization" sub-header of the Black Sun section in the EotE CRB it would seem to fit their MO.

I would suggest just coming up with a relatively small-time "criminal organization" fitting your PCs specializations and have the PCs think that their organization is independent (or owned by one guy above their boss) only to find out someway or another that their boss, knowingly or not, wourks for the Black Sun, and by extension, they do to.

As far as "legitimate business" goes, the book also says that Sprax, the Nelroni Vigo runs many shipping, smuggling, shipjacking etc. criminal enterprises, many of which don't even know that they are part of Black Sun, so that particular subset might fit your campaign rather well.

13 minutes ago, P-47 Thunderbolt said:

As far as the Black Sun goes, couldn't you have the PCs perform jobs for a relatively low-level crime boss who they (and possibly he) don't know is actually working for the Black Sun? Based on the "Organization" sub-header of the Black Sun section in the EotE CRB it would seem to fit their MO.

I would suggest just coming up with a relatively small-time "criminal organization" fitting your PCs specializations and have the PCs think that their organization is independent (or owned by one guy above their boss) only to find out someway or another that their boss, knowingly or not, wourks for the Black Sun, and by extension, they do to.

As far as "legitimate business" goes, the book also says that Sprax, the Nelroni Vigo runs many shipping, smuggling, shipjacking etc. criminal enterprises, many of which don't even know that they are part of Black Sun, so that particular subset might fit your campaign rather well.

My plan for the first arc is this: The party is hired by group/person X to do a simple cargo run, they are going to be lent a ship already loaded with cargo. The cargo is labled as foodstuffs, but is actually expensive spices for import tax evasion. They will be told that it's already been stamped and won't cause any issues. The crew is being replaced because a crime lord on the other end wants the crew dead.

The players are completely in the dark, and are effectively being used as a sacrifice to lower the heat on the band of 'traders' whose ship they are being lent. After they leave the ship will be reported as stolen with out cargo a few days ago. When they arrive and it isn't empty they will get arrested for theft and smuggling as the cargo is very illegal drugs, instead of the expensive spices they were told it was. All according to the employer's plan. Sacrifice an old ship and some no nammed mooks to get the empire to let their guard down.

The Black Sun is panning on axing this group of smuglers because they are bad at their jobs. So they tipped off the Empire to the ring, and in turn are going to be collecting the reward money for ratting out a group of drug traffickers. Which in turn will shut down the spaceport and leave them grounded for the time being, and hopefully adventure will insue.

34 minutes ago, Mark Caliber said:

37 PGA. (37th year of Palpatin's Galactic Empire . . . ).

?

Works for me. I was just looking on a timeline and everything was in BBY and ABY which didn't make sense for the current time.

34 minutes ago, Mark Caliber said:

#### Kobolds! Those . . . .1/4 DC kobolds . . . . <shudder>.

YOU try taking on a swarm of those <censored> and tell me they're obsolete?!?!!?

Have you tried attacking a swarm with fortifications..... easy job they said... no one would get hurt they said...

You have really screwed those characters!

That will probably be quite fun, but you should be careful to allow the PCs a way out, it seems like you've turned all official organizations against them. I'm not saying you did anything wrong, I'm just warning you to be careful and to not be too reliant on the PCs rolling well.

My hope is that once things get set up and while the crew is waiting for their ship the empire will show up, ruin the day for their employers. Let them go because they aren't involved yet, and they are now dropped out penniless, with sights on finding the person responsible for screwing them out of an easy and large payday. If for some reason if they don't roll their way out of the social situations and end up in jail, their contact will get them out and start them on the path to conflict with another subgroup of the Black Sun.

I'm hoping they will end up founding their own criminal organization, and getting into a war eith the Black Sun. But hey that's out of scope for right now.

16 minutes ago, Grathew said:

My hope is that once things get set up and while the crew is waiting for their ship the empire will show up, ruin the day for their employers. Let them go because they aren't involved yet, and they are now dropped out penniless, with sights on finding the person responsible for screwing them out of an easy and large payday. If for some reason if they don't roll their way out of the social situations and end up in jail, their contact will get them out and start them on the path to conflict with another subgroup of the Black Sun.

I'm hoping they will end up founding their own criminal organization, and getting into a war eith the Black Sun. But hey that's out of scope for right now.

That sounds great! Have a fun campaign!

3 hours ago, Grathew said:

Also how would BBY be written before the Battle of Yavin? I am thinking of starting around 18-17 BBY, but it feels wrong to call it BBY when the reference event hasn't happened yet.

https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Imperial_calendar

18-17 BBY would be 1-2 AFE.

2 hours ago, Mark Caliber said:

37 PGA. (37th year of Palpatin's Galactic Empire . . . ).

?

BBY means Before the Battle of Yavin. And Palpatine's Empire was only around for 24 years.