I just saw that Ares Games has joined this, and hopefully FFG is going to as well.

https://www.ethicaltoyprogram.org/en/

This is something that doesn't get talked about in the hobby much.

Another thing that should be talked about is the sustainability/environmental impact of our little plastic figures.

Isn't this the reason we have plastic and not pweter/lead/tin mixes in our minis now?

24 minutes ago, Ralgon said:

Isn't this the reason we have plastic and not pweter/lead/tin mixes in our minis now?

No. That’s a money thing.

26 minutes ago, TauntaunScout said:

No. That’s a money thing.

Pretty sure ( for lead at least) it was a keeping ahead of the regulators thing.

As for the rest, can't really take an entertainment company (in any field of entertainment) advertising sustainability as anything more than hypocritical lip service.

If you follow through the sustainability of the end product matters little, as the carbon footprint getting there is just as bad.

Eh, really couldn't care less. Biggest impact I see would be on the pricing, and I'd rather not see our little plastic space army men go up in price for a questionable-at-best environmental impact.

33 minutes ago, Ralgon said:

Pretty sure ( for lead at least) it was a keeping ahead of the regulators thing.

Yes but replacing metal alloys across the board was/is about plastic having higher margins, being cheaper to ship, reducing SKU's and therefore overhead, etc.

13 minutes ago, Alpha17 said:

Eh, really couldn't care less. Biggest impact I see would be on the pricing, and I'd rather not see our little plastic space army men go up in price for a questionable-at-best environmental impact.

Thats the same thing our parents said and reason we are sliding downward enviromentally. To many people think small price increase or inconvenience should be reason enough to not make a small environmental change. If all these SKUs were just $5 more but knew they followed a better standard to protect the environment from filters on their air to proper water/waste disposal, id for one be okay with the cost.

29 minutes ago, Gridloc said:

Thats the same thing our parents said and reason we are sliding downward enviromentally. To many people think small price increase or inconvenience should be reason enough to not make a small environmental change. If all these SKUs were just $5 more but knew they followed a better standard to protect the environment from filters on their air to proper water/waste disposal, id for one be okay with the cost.

I tend to disagree with you on that we're sliding downward environmentally, but I forgot its "settled science." If you're that worried about it, feel free to donate the money to a worth cause on your own, and leave my wallet out of it.

23 minutes ago, Alpha17 said:

I tend to disagree with you on that we're sliding downward environmentally,

Wildlife populations have declined 60% in 50 years. Rates of extinction are increasing. Instead of 1 to 5 species a year, we're seeing several extinctions a day. What else would you call that?

Quote

but I forgot its "settled science."

Political much?

Edit: Heck this whole thread should probably be locked before it really starts.

24 minutes ago, Alpha17 said:

I tend to disagree with you on that we're sliding downward environmentally, but I forgot its "settled science." If you're that worried about it, feel free to donate the money to a worth cause on your own, and leave my wallet out of it.

Having worked in the Arctic the last decade I’d tell you that you are wrong but I’d doubt your opinion would change.

I would not invest long term in property in Miami mind you.

53 minutes ago, TauntaunScout said:

Edit: Heck this whole thread should probably be locked before it really starts.

Agreed, i didn't want to make it political, its sad that keeping our planet going and protecting life on it is now a political thing and not a common sense thing.

I think it's a worthwhile pursuit. I know I'd feel better having some assurance that my toy soldiers aren't being made by 12 year old factory workers that have been forced into slavery or anything like it.

As for environmental sustainability of our toys...that's primarily a concern for disposables. Our products are meant to last, not be used and tossed aside. I think it's less of concern, and I feel it would be problematic if our figures were bio-degradable.

1 hour ago, Alpha17 said:

I tend to disagree with you on that we're sliding downward environmentally, but I forgot its "settled science." If you're that worried about it, feel free to donate the money to a worth cause on your own, and leave my wallet out of it.

I do, i drive a hybrid, recycle while reducing waste (the ffg boxing doesn't help!!), we are saving for solar power, plus donate 10 a month to conservative groups looking to prevent fracking and fossil fuel lobbiest in my state. Is this making a massive change no... but it is a change and if more people do this then it will shift corporate methods. OP was stating having a company backing this initiative is a good thing for those of us that would like to see this change.

1 hour ago, Alpha17 said:

but I forgot its "settled science."

I really hate that the spokespeople for climate awareness have such stupid things to say. Isn't the term "settled science" an oxymoron? There's a majority consensus among those who study the field that not only is the climate shifting but that it's caused by mankind. That said scientists in the field do not a have full grasp of all the variables (as if they ever could in a system as complex as global climate), therefore calling it "settled" is a bit of a misnomer, there's always more to discover and understand in a scientific endeavor.

Climate issues aside, I don't think it's a bad idea to consider sustainability and environmental impact. It's important to remember that climate change isn't the only issue when looking at environmental impacts. One of the key things I notice any time I open an FFG expansion (whether this or Armada) is that there are often lot's of little plastic pieces or garbage. I feel like a lot of the extra plastic packaging is unnecessary. I feel like there's a 100% probability some of those stupid little baggies are floating around in the ocean somewhere....

4 minutes ago, Darth Sanguis said:

(Snip) I feel like there's a 100% probability some of those stupid little baggies are floating around in the ocean somewhere....

Not mine...they're all cluttering up my basement

Although I do reuse them as much as possible to keep them off the floor.

Just now, kingbobb said:

Not mine...they're all cluttering up my basement

Although I do reuse them as much as possible to keep them off the floor.

I mean I have a big ziplock full of them, I don't know if I'll ever be able to use them all.

1 minute ago, Darth Sanguis said:

I mean I have a big ziplock full of them, I don't know if I'll ever be able to use them all.

Sure, jut buy more games

But it is a good sign that FFG could put some thought toward their packaging and making it less wasteful. At least the inserts are cardboard.

5 hours ago, Darth Sanguis said:

I feel like there's a 100% probability some of those stupid little baggies are floating around in the ocean somewhere....

I hate these things. Cards? In a bag. Bases? In a bag. Models? You'll want a few bags for those. Cardboard? In a bag. We don't need it! The boxes have a divider in them already, just dump all the models in one side and cards in the other. The pop-out tokens can go between the divider and the outer box. No baggies, no chance of damage to components.

Also FFG boxes are huge compared to what they contain... hate to bring up the GW comparison yet again but the ratio of wasted space is a lot lower in most of their kits, especially the larger boxes.

I wouldn’t worry much in specific regard to Legion et al. If this hobby survives, in 10 years time we’ll probably be buying IP protected secure codes online to print all our minis at home.

See also: how we’re going to be buying the cheapest dishes, clothing, etc.

8 hours ago, TauntaunScout said:

Wildlife populations have declined 60% in 50 years. Rates of extinction are increasing. Instead of 1 to 5 species a year, we're seeing several extinctions a day. What else would you call that?

Political much?

Edit: Heck this whole thread should probably be locked before it really starts.

Typically,survival of the fittest.

Human intervention is increasing the rate at which it's happening, sure. But while we continually play God and disturb the natural order by evolving ourselves and life spans through medicine, "enlightenment" and our compassion to otherwise selectively sustain the weak and defeat our natural popultion control it ain't gonna stop.

Take gridloc for example ( and this isn't personal man, you're just here with your above post as an example)

"I drive an electric car" - how much extra mining for rare earth materials had to happen to build the batteries to build said electric? Are those batteries recyclable? And where the recharge power coming from really? True Green methods or "we'll just do it our way and buy offsets to fix it"?

"I'm saving for solar" better option than most but barely, until we get better production methods the carbon footprint building them is only offset after several years of being in use. And that's if they see full service life.

As for recycling, do a search on the Australian condition in the state of Victoria at the moment. Tl'dr a major recycler went bust and we found most of it was just being shipped to Indonesia/ China anyway.

Mean time through medicine, aged care and technology he's going to live 4-5 times the lifetime of his far ancestors,as are his kids, as are those after them. Babies that shouldn't survive childbirth are born and sustained every day. Humans have a sustainability problem of their own making, and refuse to deal with it out of compassion.

Initiatives to save life on the planet are a good thing for our kids kids (forget about the notion to "save the planet" that's another heap of bantha doo to play to our humanity in saving ourselves, the planet will barely notice us after we are gone) But there really is an awful lot of Koolaid being drunk on the subject of just what is and what isn't actually helping.

Edit: I should add, that against a backdrop of views like that(and they are mine, I don't expect to convert anybody) any company that sells consumerism for consumerisms sake trying to promote its sustainability, just comes off like bury you deep bantha doo. Now I'm gonna stfu for this topic.

Slow Clap

52 minutes ago, Ralgon said:

Typically,survival of the fittest.

Human intervention is increasing the rate at which it's happening, sure. But while we continually play God and disturb the natural order by evolving ourselves and life spans through medicine, "enlightenment" and our compassion to otherwise selectively sustain the weak and defeat our natural popultion control it ain't gonna stop.

Take gridloc for example ( and this isn't personal man, you're just here with your above post as an example)

"I drive an electric car" - how much extra mining for rare earth materials had to happen to build the batteries to build said electric? Are those batteries recyclable? And where the recharge power coming from really? True Green methods or "we'll just do it our way and buy offsets to fix it"?

"I'm saving for solar" better option than most but barely, until we get better production methods the carbon footprint building them is only offset after several years of being in use. And that's if they see full service life.

As for recycling, do a search on the Australian condition in the state of Victoria at the moment. Tl'dr a major recycler went bust and we found most of it was just being shipped to Indonesia/ China anyway.

Mean time through medicine, aged care and technology he's going to live 4-5 times the lifetime of his far ancestors,as are his kids, as are those after them. Babies that shouldn't survive childbirth are born and sustained every day. Humans have a sustainability problem of their own making, and refuse to deal with it out of compassion.

Initiatives to save life on the planet are a good thing for our kids kids (forget about the notion to "save the planet" that's another heap of bantha doo to play to our humanity in saving ourselves, the planet will barely notice us after we are gone) But there really is an awful lot of Koolaid being drunk on the subject of just what is and what isn't actually helping.

Edit: I should add, that against a backdrop of views like that(and they are mine, I don't expect to convert anybody) any company that sells consumerism for consumerisms sake trying to promote its sustainability, just comes off like bury you deep bantha doo. Now I'm gonna stfu for this topic.

**slow clap**

9 hours ago, Kwatchi said:

Having worked in the Arctic the last decade I’d tell you that you are wrong but I’d doubt your opinion would change.

I would not invest long term in property in Miami mind you.

Oh no, first hand experience?! Pshaw. I have my ideas and will stick to them.

21 hours ago, kingbobb said:

I think it's a worthwhile pursuit. I know I'd feel better having some assurance that my toy soldiers aren't being made by 12 year old factory workers that have been forced into slavery or anything like it.

As for environmental sustainability of our toys...that's primarily a concern for disposables. Our products are meant to last, not be used and tossed aside. I think it's less of concern, and I feel it would be problematic if our figures were bio-degradable.

Somewhere an exec is heavy a wet dream because a customer is asking for a product that will break down before they're finished using it.

10 minutes ago, DtLS said:

Somewhere an exec is heavy a wet dream because a customer is asking for a product that will break down before they're finished using it.

I think you've misunderstood what I was saying....