After resolve the attack you can recohesion the enemy unit. Also it seems that the guy says 1 and 2 pip commands put out supression.

What are your thoughts on build the new vader op? With this info you can engage turn 1 with darkness descend so is force push needed?

I'm thinking i will go with fear and choke.

So still not sure what that means. Basically you can rearrange the remaining minis distance 1 of the unit leader?

8 minutes ago, chr335 said:

So still not sure what that means. Basically you can rearrange the remaining minis distance 1 of the unit leader?

You can put out of cover the unit, out of LoS (they must move to shoot then), and close the gap between vader and a unit.

Basicay with new 3 pip vader start at 18 inches of the enemy. After scout 1 it is 14. When he activates and spur is 8. Then he can attack via relentless and put a unit around 4 inches via recohesion so 4-5 inches away. Then another spur move and you are engaged round 1.

That could be enough to close a distance gap between Vader and being able to use a force push to get into melee.

On 7/26/2019 at 10:12 PM, naitsirk said:

You can put out of cover the unit, out of LoS (they must move to shoot then), and close the gap between vader and a unit.

Basicay with new 3 pip vader start at 18 inches of the enemy. After scout 1 it is 14. When he activates and spur is 8. Then he can attack via relentless and put a unit around 4 inches via recohesion so 4-5 inches away. Then another spur move and you are engaged round 1.

Nice.......However I think he can only Spur once per activation. If after the Force Throw the enemy unit is placed 4 inches away, he could still move into melee ready for round 2. And unless that unit withdraws he is safe from being shot at if you activated him early in the round.

53 minutes ago, Timinater said:

Nice.......However I think he can only Spur once per activation. If after the Force Throw the enemy unit is placed 4 inches away, he could still move into melee ready for round 2. And unless that unit withdraws he is safe from being shot at if you activated him early in the round.

Reading the entry in the RRG, I don't think that Spur is limited to once per activation. It's limited to one per move, so you won't be going speed 3, but I think you can Spur on each of your moves.

6 minutes ago, Qwrety77 said:

Reading the entry in the RRG, I don't think that Spur is limited to once per activation. It's limited to one per move, so you won't be going speed 3, but I think you can Spur on each of your moves.

Wow i missed that. I thought it was an action like Jump, however looks like I was wrong and it's a unit keyword so can be done as often as you move (if you wish). Combo with Endurance and they come off at the end of the activation phase and during end phase......What a BEAST!!!

So Scatter, the keyword tied to Force Throw of the new and cheaper price Vader, is able to change how the attacked unit is cohered?

And that same range 2 attack has Blast?

So essentially the new and cheaper Vader has a range 2, two black attack that ignores cover and works as a limited Force Push, and then Vader can still use Force Push?

2 hours ago, JediPartisan said:

So Scatter, the keyword tied to Force Throw of the new and cheaper price Vader, is able to change how the attacked unit is cohered?

And that same range 2 attack has Blast?

So essentially the new and cheaper Vader has a range 2, two black attack that ignores cover and works as a limited Force Push, and then Vader can still use Force Push?

Looks like that.

The Operative version is definetly better than the original in most contexts. At least if you plan to take a second commander anyway and have no additional opportunity cost there. Scatter, Spur, Jedi Hunter and 30 points discount are better than 2 extra wounds and immunity against suppression.

31 minutes ago, M.Mustermann said:

Looks like that.

The Operative version is definetly better than the original in most contexts. At least if you plan to take a second commander anyway and have no additional opportunity cost there. Scatter, Spur, Jedi Hunter and 30 points discount are better than 2 extra wounds and immunity against suppression.

I think this is because they wanted the old factions to have answers to the new heroes they’re bringing out...which is a warning of coming creep. At least from the hero standpoint, even if the bulk of forces are still balanced.

It’s a good thing Luke is getting Disengage. That will make things balanced. 😏

12 hours ago, Timinater said:

Wow i missed that. I thought it was an action like Jump, however looks like I was wrong and it's a unit keyword so can be done as often as you move (if you wish). Combo with Endurance and they come off at the end of the activation phase and during end phase......What a BEAST!!!

With the latest RRG, Jump now counts as a normal move, and can be done twice, same as any other movement. At least, that was the ruling at the last RPQ I was at.

21 minutes ago, Alpha17 said:

With the latest RRG, Jump now counts as a normal move, and can be done twice, same as any other movement. At least, that was the ruling at the last RPQ I was at.

That was simply incorrect. the latest RRG didn't change that at all, it just clarified that you can/have to use it when panicked, using Dauntless or Pulling the Strings, etc. I would ******* LOVE for that to be the case, as it would make my Luke and Sabine even better.

13 minutes ago, Alpha17 said:

With the latest RRG, Jump now counts as a normal move, and can be done twice, same as any other movement. At least, that was the ruling at the last RPQ I was at.

Could you say what line in the RRG they were referencing?

I can only find, “When a unit performs the jump x card action, treat this action as a move action.” That was from the explanation of Jump in the RRG, but that line is not new. That line has been there since version 1.0.0.

I’d love it to work twice, but all rules I’ve seen haven’t allowed it.

The line used was "The jump x ability can be used any time a unit would perform a move action or free move action, including while using the dauntless keyword or when a friendly unit uses he pulling the strings ability."

Combined with the section on movement, "During a unit’s activation, it is possible for a unit to perform multiple move actions. Unlike other actions, a unit is not limited to only one move action per activation."

As it doesn't say that a unit can take a standard move multiple times, but any move action, the Judge ruled that it could be used at any time.

Even the section on Actions leaves it muddled. "A unit cannot perform the same action more than once during its activation, except the move action, which can be performed multiple times.
• If an ability is preceded by a card action (󲊂) icon, that ability is a card action.
»» Each card action is a unique action; a unit can perform different card actions during its activation. However, a unit cannot perform the same card action more than once during its activation."

Again, the "move action" is allowed multiple times, and the Jump ability can be used whenever a move can be made. I'd love to get an official ruling on this, and I'd love for it to be limited. Simply rule that a standard move is what is allowed to be conducted twice, nothing else. Giving Sabine (or Boba and Luke, but Sabine is the one that gets my ire) the ability to ignore terrain on literally ever movement is ridiculous.

9 minutes ago, Alpha17 said:

The line used was "The jump x ability can be used any time a unit would perform a move action or free move action, including while using the dauntless keyword or when a friendly unit uses he pulling the strings ability."

Combined with the section on movement, "During a unit’s activation, it is possible for a unit to perform multiple move actions. Unlike other actions, a unit is not limited to only one move action per activation."

As it doesn't say that a unit can take a standard move multiple times, but any move action, the Judge ruled that it could be used at any time.

Even the section on Actions leaves it muddled. "A unit cannot perform the same action more than once during its activation, except the move action, which can be performed multiple times.
• If an ability is preceded by a card action (󲊂) icon, that ability is a card action.
»» Each card action is a unique action; a unit can perform different card actions during its activation. However, a unit cannot perform the same card action more than once during its activation."

Again, the "move action" is allowed multiple times, and the Jump ability can be used whenever a move can be made. I'd love to get an official ruling on this, and I'd love for it to be limited. Simply rule that a standard move is what is allowed to be conducted twice, nothing else. Giving Sabine (or Boba and Luke, but Sabine is the one that gets my ire) the ability to ignore terrain on literally ever movement is ridiculous.

That seems to be taking that single line wildly out of context (given what comes after it, which is NOT an explanation that it lets you break one of the fundamental rules of the game), but I have submitted a rules question to FFG nonetheless.

Well ge will be a nice assassin unit, much like the bounty hunters however he is more meele focused and have force powers.

He won't be the unstoppable blob that the commander version is. It will be interesting to see the rest of the new command cards for him and Luke and how they will work with the different versions

I'm liking the new command cards, or at least the not knowing exactly what command cards Vader or Luke will have. Makes the 1 pip generic imperial command card become more and more useful with each release.

6 hours ago, That Blasted Samophlange said:

I'm liking the new command cards, or at least the not knowing exactly what command cards Vader or Luke will have. Makes the 1 pip generic imperial command card become more and more useful with each release.

I'm thinking on the rebel 1 pip card that give an order to an operative and the enemy have 1 less order to issue is a good way to counter attack "focus fire" when your new op luke charges into clones.

12 hours ago, JediPartisan said:

So Scatter, the keyword tied to Force Throw of the new and cheaper price Vader, is able to change how the attacked unit is cohered?

And that same range 2 attack has Blast?

So essentially the new and cheaper Vader has a range 2, two black attack that ignores cover and works as a limited Force Push, and then Vader can still use Force Push?

On paper even the cheapest version of this vader (fear+choke) could engage round 1 + 2 supression + kill a heavy. Second round even more supression (asuming master of evil is played) and perhaps delete 1 unit + kill another heavy.

Perhaps this could be worth the points even if he dies after that. If he even survive this round the oponent will have serious problem (new 1 pip put even more supression + presumible multiple attacks)

On 7/28/2019 at 10:05 AM, Alpha17 said:

The line used was "The jump x ability can be used any time a unit would perform a move action or free move action, including while using the dauntless keyword or when a friendly unit uses he pulling the strings ability."

Combined with the section on movement, "During a unit’s activation, it is possible for a unit to perform multiple move actions. Unlike other actions, a unit is not limited to only one move action per activation."

As it doesn't say that a unit can take a standard move multiple times, but any move action, the Judge ruled that it could be used at any time.

Even the section on Actions leaves it muddled. "A unit cannot perform the same action more than once during its activation, except the move action, which can be performed multiple times.
• If an ability is preceded by a card action (󲊂) icon, that ability is a card action.
»» Each card action is a unique action; a unit can perform different card actions during its activation. However, a unit cannot perform the same card action more than once during its activation."

Again, the "move action" is allowed multiple times, and the Jump ability can be used whenever a move can be made. I'd love to get an official ruling on this, and I'd love for it to be limited. Simply rule that a standard move is what is allowed to be conducted twice, nothing else. Giving Sabine (or Boba and Luke, but Sabine is the one that gets my ire) the ability to ignore terrain on literally ever movement is ridiculous.

I just got an email reply from Alex Davy:

No, the Jump action can be performed only once per activation.

I also got a reply confirming that when you cut a dice pool in half (such as Saber Throe with Obi Wan) the player that controls the attacking mini gets to choose which dice to use.

7 hours ago, arnoldrew said:

I just got an email reply from Alex Davy:

No, the Jump action can be performed only once per activation.

I also got a reply confirming that when you cut a dice pool in half (such as Saber Throe with Obi Wan) the player that controls the attacking mini gets to choose which dice to use.

Good to know. I hope they put out something official on this so its not an issue in the future. As of right now, it's sadly still word of mouth.

8 hours ago, Alpha17 said:

Good to know. I hope they put out something official on this so its not an issue in the future. As of right now, it's sadly still word of mouth.

I don’t think we really need a call on either of things. Jump is an action, and a move action is the only thing you can do twice in an activation. So that’s easy enough.

The second one was clarified when discussing vehicle damage results - the player gets to choose what dice to use when the weapon damaged result is rolled (mattered for RRRBBB weapons). I think he’s confirming already answered stuff.

4 hours ago, TalkPolite said:

I don’t think we really need a call on either of things. Jump is an action, and a move action is the only thing you can do twice in an activation. So that’s easy enough.

The second one was clarified when discussing vehicle damage results - the player gets to choose what dice to use when the weapon damaged result is rolled (mattered for RRRBBB weapons). I think he’s confirming already answered stuff.

The reason I asked about cutting dice in half is because I was talking to someone on Reddit who insisted that because it said that for Weapons Disrupted and not anywhere else that it must be an exception to a general rule. The justification for the Jump around question is in the thread above. I already knew what the correct rulings were.

5 hours ago, TalkPolite said:

I don’t think we really need a call on either of things. Jump is an action, and a move action is the only thing you can do twice in an activation. So that’s easy enough.

When tournament judges rule differently with nothing official, it's an issue. And while I'd rather Sabine not be able to ignore terrain every move she makes, the RRG does contradict itself in how these would interact. An official "FAQ" post or note in the next RRG would be incredibly helpful.