Hi,

I'm rather a boardgamer than a CCG player, so I'm hoping to get into this LCG thing without deck construction. I picked up this game, since I'm a huge fan of the novels; hence I can't stand to play without the option of including Greyjoy and Martell.

So please let me ask some questions which may have been asked a hundred times in this forums (I beg your pardon, but this LCG system is VERY confusing to me):

1. Can the KotS / PotS decks be considered as preconstructed decks that are a balanced addition to the core game?

2. I'm especially irritated with the differing numbers of cards in the decks. Seems to me that the expansion decks come with almost 10% less cards. I'd think that this is a balance problem, isn't it?

3. If the latter is a problem, is there a consensus about how this is solved (e.g. include cards x,y,z from the second PotS deck or something like this)?

4. Are the additional cards that come with the expansions (Kings/Queens, Allies) intended to be included in the Core Game's House decks? Or are they rather a feature meant for deck construction?

Maybe I'm off the point with all this, but the game seems to be marketed as a game that CAN be played "out of the box" and without deck construction; I've got the same impression of those big expansions.

Thank you for your help!

playernumberone said:

Not a problem to ask questions!

1. More or less... see #3.

2. The KotS deck comes with 6% less cards if I am doing the math correctly (42 vs 45), and so does PotS if you discount the out of house/out of theme cards. PotS is fine because it doubles up on everything (very nice for people actually interested in deck construction) so it's easy to add in a few duplicates and get 45. KotS is a little rough because it has only one copy of each of the resource locations, but the power level of the other core decks is not that high so the Greyjoy deck doesn't feel like it's behind just different (and if you don't have PotS to supplement a few things with, you will be short a few cards in your Greyjoy deck...).

3. Regarding PotS, here is an answer I have given previously:

"If you want to keep the deck list at 45 cards, I'd take out all five of the non-Martell dual house characters (so all of them besides Arys Oakheart) and Mag the Mighty, Denys Mallister, Kingsguard Squire, and the three World Championships cards (Former Champion, A Pinch of Powder, and When I Woke...). That's 11 cards so you'll have 42 still in one of the decks (not counting plots). Then I'd add in a second copy of Dornish Fiefdoms, Water Gardens, and Palace Fountains from the other deck. If you want could use the Narrow Sea instead of one of these."

Since that answer, I have realized that Former Champion is pretty freaking awesome (especially in multiplayer), so I might consider putting that one back into one of the decks after playing with them enough to get a feel for the cards and what card might be worth subbing out for it.

Regarding KotS, after you take out the plots, the Kingsmoot cards and the out of house Kings/Queen, you only have 42 cards. If you want to get back up to 45, I'd consider adding in a few of the leftover cards from PotS. Theon Greyjoy is an obvious choice. Former Champion is another good one. If you play mostly melee, Make an Example, The Dragon's Tail, and Formal Petition are also good options. If you play more joust, Court Advisor, Parting Blow and Rusted Sword are nice.

4. They make fine additions. I'd recommend starting with them on the sidelines and then considering subbing or adding them in once you have a feel for the decks without them.

I have not played the Core Set version of the decks in a while but they are pretty fun as is.

Thank you, this helps me a lot.

I got still some more questions concerning your post:

1. To get it correct, both precon decks come with 42 cards and the 3 missing cards would be best replaced with locations. This would be no problem with PotS (since a second deck is included), but KotS does come only with one deck. So one would have to buy another box for quite a high price, that's why you recommended to replace them with ohter cards from the PotS expansion. But if the price didn't matter, which locations would you recommend to be doubled in the greyjoy deck?

2. Is there a problem with using Baleon Greyjoy as the only King in the game (this would be the consequence of including Baleon while not using the other King/Queen characters)? If one used the Kings/Queens, would they replace the Unique characters (in the other house's decks) or be an addition to them?

3. If one used the Allies from the PotS expansions, would there be a reasonable distribution, which grants one to each house?

4. Say one would use the additional cards (Kings/Queens AND Allies) both Greyjoy and Martell would be short another card. Any suggestions with which card to replace this (I guess a location, but which)?

If I could but in with a few suggestions:

Welcome to aGoT, by the way!

I actually started play without the Core Set (it was out of print) I just bought the PotS Expansion. The PotS makes a very fun stand alone game. (We made our own power tokens and gold tokens, but you already have those so) Included in the PotS expansion is 120 cards and 14 plot cards(Two copies of each). Included also in the PotS expansion is a rulebook for 'Civil War' play, in which both players Draw from the same deck. That makes PotS a definite buy. Plus Martell is Awesome

I know you came into the game wanting to avoid Deck Construction, but don't be so worried about it. I am the only one of five of my friends who play, who owns aGoT cards, and I ended buying most of the 'chapter packs'. It makes for a fun activity with the people who play to have a say in constructing a themed deck for the house they like the most. And new comers still enjoy coming in and picking up one of the houses and sticking with it.

Also, it doesn't sound like you are interested in tournaments, so the deck size difference of 45-60 doesn't make a huge difference. If you played any of the expansions right out of the box vs. any of the core set decks, you'd be doing well and relatively fair. And if there is a perceived imbalance, buy a chapter pack and throw in some cards to each deck.

Have fun with it! There are a whole lot of ways to enjoy this game.

playernumberone said:

1. Yes, I would say that's right about the locations. The Core Set decks have seven reusable resource locations in house (the exact count of each varies a little between the houses, plus they have some number of Crossroads and Street of Steel, Street of Sisters, or Shadowblack Lane for 10 total). I'd recommend doubling Iron Island Fiefdoms, Gatehouse, and Bloody Keep. Aeron's Chambers is unique so it's annoying to draw it a second time in a game.

I had overlooked the neutral locations in the Core Set decks in my previous post. So really, the Core Set decks each have 7 in house and 3 neutral locations each. Greyjoy has 4 in house and 1 neutral location, and if you follow my previous recommendation Martell will have 8 in house locations and no neutral ones. One way to make things more equitable would be to cut a Crossroads from each of the Core Set decks and give three of them to Greyjoy and one to Martell. That would leave Greyjoy with 8 locations and all the other houses with 9. If you did get a second KotS, you could double up those Greyjoy locations, but you could still consider shifting the Crossroads around to give all your decks 9 locations. I think 9 is enough. You could replace the Crossroads in Core Set decks with the allies in PotS or the kings in KotS.

One general piece of insight I can give is that if you are playing mostly melee the exact balance of the locations is not crucial. Players beating up on each other will slow the game down some and balance the power out some what even if someone starts off a little bit ahead of the other players. If you're playing more joust, you will want the locations fairly balanced since it is much easier to press an early advantage in a two player game.

2. I'd say Balon's ability would not be unbalancing even if it did not have the only king in play restriction. I'd none of the other kings' abilities are that strong either, but it would add a nice extra layer of interaction between players if multiple decks had access to kings which could clash with each other's abilities.

3. Hmm, well, since you have two copies of each, there are probably multiple distributions that work fine if you are willing to have the same character show up in two decks. I can tell you this: Arys is stronger than the others with Ser Jorah not too far behind. If you play much melee, The Hound will be fairly weak as he's kind of useless when someone is playing Targaryen. Joffrey is also a bit underwhelming since there is only one Small Council event in the Lannister deck to trigger his ability (though he does have Renown which is welcome in the Lannister deck). Brienne and Theon are pretty solid, not as good as Arys and Jorah, but on par with any characters in the Core Decks. If you don't want to double up the allies in different decks, I guess I'd recommend Jorah->Targ, Theon->Greyjoy, Brienne->Stark, The Hound->Lannister, Joffrey->Baratheon (since Lannister already has a Joffrey, in fact two counting the KotS one).

4. Well, I suppose my suggested Crossroads switch would be one solution here. If you're adding more than one card and you've evened out the locations already, you could consider some of the neutral cards I highlighted (Former Champion, Court Advisor, etc).

I hope that's all helpful (and consistent).