I visited the French AGoT site just a minute ago and saw this card which looks to be doctored (the unique symbol and text font gives it away).

But then again IIRC, the Acolyte of the Flame preview that was showcased before also looked doctored, but was in fact right on the money.

So here goes:

well i'm hoping its a fake....but judging by how they seem to have no clue how to cost baratheon cards (or even give them good abilities) thats probably what we are getting....whoopie?

no its real it was on the uncut sheet of cards that we won at mn regionals

Lars said:

Hmm. A 4/3, 2-icon character with a crest, Renown and a STR boost ability. Looks a lot like Core Set Mel.

But.... Core Set Mel's STR boost is situational (she has to be standing). Stannis' is general!

But... Mel's STR boost applies to herself. Stannis' doesn't!

But... Mel has an additional ability on top of the STR boost.

~ But... Stannis has a military icon, Mel only has an intrigue icon (that one was for you, Lars)

Hmm. Lars might have a point. The $64,000 question thus becomes: Is Stannis overcosted, or is Core Set Mel undercosted?

(Personally, I'd say that considering "X cost, X-1 STR, 2 icons, Renown, nothing else" is a pretty common Baratheon formula, I'm thinking Mel is undercosted in comparison to the usually assumed design assumptions, but that 5-gold cost barrier is a huge psychological factor.)

ktom said:

well i'd argue they are both situtational, due to the dearth of in house Night's Watch and all

ktom said:

lol what made this funnier was that you editied in the time between me reading your first post (w/out it) and me hitting quote = fun surprise for me.

ktom said:

~I think I just passed out

ktom said:

1) I think Mel's STR boost is seen for the non-factor it usually is and as such isn't taken into account when costing her (plus I'm not a fan of trait based STR boost, i much prefer triggered effect STR boosts, like naval escort or The Bastard of Godsgrace

2) maybe the problem is the formula....

I'd have been happy if this stannis was something like King Balon, 4 for 3 noble 2 icons with renown and a king turn off ability that works really well within his house.

I'd been exstatic if it was like Victerion, 4 for 3 war crest (yes war crest, ~makes his military icon more viable w/ war crest) 2 icons, in house keyword and situational once a turn power generation

I'd be a fool to expect something like the blackfish (~I have a couple of millstones on which to grind axes ) 4 for 3 noble w/ 2 icons renown, in house trait based passive and non kneeling draw ability w/out participation in the trigger challenge.

Hm.

I have to say I'm not impressed either.

Ok, theoretically this card could boost all your Baratheon cards by +1 when you use The Wall (and they do not kneel to defend).

Add to this CS Melisandre and all your Asshai characters receive a +2 STR boost. (To bad the Priestess of the Pyre doesn't work with winter.)

But all in all the card just seems... I don't know... boring? I guess that's my main problem with it...

He could be worth it though, especially if you add The Rangers Agenda to make several of your Int/Pow characters to tricons.

(Refugees (0-cost, 3 STR, tricon), Melisandre, Selyse, Queen of Thornes, King Renly, Margaery, etc...)

Seat of Power to reduce the huge costs to get the initial setup (Stannis, Mel and The Wall each cost 4, and this in a winter environment),

Samwell & Sword in the Darkness to get some draw, and there you go...

We'll have to see how effectif this will be.

At least it will be quite nedly...

Jekothalep said:

yup had this thought too. the cost is almost oppressive though. 4 gold for stannis (and then 4 more gold if you want mel) 4 gold for a location that needs you to spend 1 more gold to 'turn it on' and if you add in the rangers you need + 2 more power to win the game..... for +2 power i'd drop this Stannis, the wall and the night's watch and just run wildlings w/ the newest agenda and their non-kneeling to attack location....its cheaper and doesn't need winter

Seat of power only helps you once a turn so you need at least 2 turns of set up

oh and a milk of the poppy or a location control card and you just wasted 4 gold...

Well, having seen a few other upcoming cards from Regionals (and I'm not sure if we are allowed to spoil anything yet, so I haven't), I can say that there is an upcoming card that,as a Night's Watch deck player for years, I am so excited about that I would actually run this Stannis Out of House, both for his STR boost and the King trait. Right now there are good arguments for running NW out of either Bara or Stark, and while the deck may not be on the same tier as Lannister, I like running traited decksand, really, should have already built my NW deck structure by now.

I also think the new Neutral house card from BwB will assist this type of deck. I don't judge every card by its cost-ability ratio, but rather how it fits into the deck, and if I enjoy playing the deck (I once played a Greyjoy raid deck for 6 months after Thorns came out that rarely won, but discarded 20-30 cards each game from my opponent's deck; it was fun, but was so focused on discarding it couldn't do anything else unless the game kept draggin on and on). Unless you are running a NW themed deck, there is no reason to run this Stannis over CS Stannis, but in the right deck this card fills a very useful role and it will be in my NW deck.

~Whoopie!

Bleh, seriously, what do they have against Stannis anyway? Compare this guy to King Renly for example. The power level difference between the two isn't too nedly either.

Well, it's sort-of viable to try and go for a winter-based Baratheon Night's Watch deck... but really, you need a setup of at least one seat of power and one narrow sea, to have the resources to get winter (search plot), Wall and Stannis all up on turn 1 (if you didn't setup any of them). Possible, but... not sure if it's worth it really since the Night's Watch doesn't do too much right now. It'll be one of those decks that can totally be ruined by a bad setup, or a well placed Carrion Bird. And a three part combo as a primary strategy for a deck doesn't really sound all that feasible. Nevermind a four part combo with Mel thrown in.

For night's watch I'd much rather go with some kind of Stark deck anyways. Though I don't think even that has anything really interesting yet.

EDIT: JerusalemJones seems to have hinted at some interesting cards to come for NW, so maybe this guy will have his place in a dedicated NW deck. Guess the jury's still out on this. Why DO they leave all the good bits to the last few chapter packs I wonder? (New Mel, Balerion,...)

JerusalemJones said:

if its out there, spoil it.

JerusalemJones said:

maybe this is what I am missing, but why do I want to give NW +1? TO make it harder to burn them? to make it easier to win challenges (stealth and deadly do that much more effectively)? to win dom? Is there going to be a really cool win by 4 event? maybe w/ drumbeater I might want it....

though the first game against martell (viper's rage, hotah) I'm not going to want that +1 str....

Not sure when FFG is going to realize that strenght boosts are not all that great

All NW get deadly...now that would be something. ~Or cannot be discarded...

rings said:

I see where you're coming from, but Randyll Tarly in a GJ War Crest deck is pretty nasty. +1 strength can make all the difference with Intimidate, winning a challenge on defense with Marauders, etc.

That said, I'm skeptical of Stannis' strength boost being as useful as Randyll's.

Yeah, it doesn't seem like a very good card.

So far, in the new chapter packs + LoW spoiler, we've seen two 4 gold noble characters - Drogo and the Blackfish, and both of them are better than this new Stannis.

I thought noble renown was suppose to be the staple for baratheon. If that's the case, why give them suckier nobles?

Yawn.

Forgot to post that yesterday.

I miss RoK Stannis. Now THAT was a damned fine piece of cardboard.

BTW, that's the new Stannis. Confirmed.

Is the new Stannis printed as shown?

That is, with the asterisk for the unique symbol, rather than the usual black flag?

It will have a black flag.

Stag Lord said:

QFT

kpmccoy21 said:

With Mainn's site gone I can't look that card up. What did it have?

@Lars I don't always play the cards that will let me win faster. If I am making a theme deck, I will play cards that fit that theme. The Wall from the ITE Legacy Pack which gave all NW cahracters +2 STR is in my current NW Legacy deck, because +2 STR is amazing. With Stannis, I get renown, a STR boost to all my NW characters, and the King trait, which is useful by itself.

The card I am referring to is a new "The Wall." It is neutral, so susceptible to your MwnK, but it makes all NW characters challenge jumpers (you can jump a NW from your hand into the current challenge, limit one per challenge). As far as I am concerned, this is the best Wall ever. I can keep NW characters in my hand, and jump them into any challenge when necessary no icons are required. And, like the other jumpers, the characters return to my hand at the end of the phase.

Sure, this Stannis is not the greatest card, or even the greatest version of Stannis. He is Night's Watch Stannis, and that is his design space. Yes, i want to run him in my NW deck. Yes, he will be in many casual NW decks. And he may never make the cut in a serious tournament deck. But GoT isn;t just about tournaments, and I for one am glad that we get a card like this for themed decks.

You make good points JJ - adn I should qualify my yawn.

My inner Jaime yawns - my inner Ned is pumped. I've run Baratheon Nigth's Watch decks several times over the years - including at the Murder event in Madison in 2005, adn its a build I often revisit - because its thematic and becuase I always think it can maybe be somehow competitive.

Stag Lord said:

Nice quote BTW...old-timers all know where that comes from!

I know he is more for fan-decks...but you could at least then make him interesting if not good. Yes, we can have tri-con strength-y NW...whoo-hoo!

LetsGoRed said:

Five cost three str mil pow and renown. if he was the only king in play you got to do an extra challenge of your choice. so like two powers or two intrigue or two mils.

Well, I don't understand all the negativity...

I mean, sure, he's not the greatest incarnation of Stannis, but he isn't that bad...

And he fits the current theme. North, NW, etc...

I couldn't complain too much...