Gathering Storm has a few rules or implicit rules in it that can be applied generally.

One is that "pitch black" lighting is 4 misfortune dice (with then progressively fewer for various better lighting).

The "blind" condition is one challenge die.

Am I wrong that really the effect of "pitch black" and "blind" should be the same in this regard? Lighting needs to be misfortune die to account for elves and dwarfs two fewer, and no vision at all can be challenge die since "nightvision" doesn't help against blindness. However, generally they should be the same, no?

Rob

Yeah, in general I think they should be comparable, if not exactly the same. Blind could even be a little worse than pitch black darkness, to account for the psychological aspect of being blinded.

But the Gathering Storm don't seem to follow that logic. A challenge die is worth right around 3 misfortune dice, depending on how harsh you get with the chaos stars. Just slightly nastier than 3 misfortune dice if your GM is particularly creative with the chaos stars, and just slightly less nasty if the GM tends to convert them into banes instead of having it trigger something dire.

For those folks who've upped the difficulties by adding failure symbol effects onto the chaos stars, then the purple die might be worth about the same as 4 black. I haven't analyzed the math on that. But for the rest of us, it would seem pitch black is worse than blind, and that doesn't make much sense at all.

I may go add an extra misfortune die onto my copies of the blind condition. A purple and a black are worth about the same as 4 black. It seemed a little weak, anyway - a top-notch starting PC archer is still likely to hit most targets while blinded.

How do you get the blinded condition?

I've always seen it as something that means you can just about distinguish shapes and a bit of colour but no detail, rather than actually beign completely blind.

Being blinded is slightly different than being blind, IMO.

Comparable to the difference between being leagally blind and being totally blind.

Pumpkin - that's a neat way of looking at it, thanks.

Rob

also that way, you can even make them stack if needed....blinded and pitch blackness, that is.

Great points, Pumpkin. I was taking the card too literally, and not thinking enough about the way it gets handed out (which is from a single action card, IIRC). Having thought more about that, it's probably not literally blind, but rather can't see because there's blood in your eyes. And yeah, Pitch Black could be worse than that, at least in terms of penalty.

That is a very slick way of interpreting things, pumpkin.

With regards to the world-class archer still being able to hit a target, I'd say he'd still be only able to act on the information he has. Observation and/or Intuition checks should be called for in order for him to identify potential targets, and if they don't roll particularly well, the GM would be perfectly within their rights to simply tell the player "There are two people at close range and a third at medium," without distinguishing between friend and foe. Since a skill check is also an action, this alone would prevent our archer from firing blind more than once every other round.

If blindfolded archers picking off beastmen at long ranges is still a problem, the GM is also free to increase the difficulty of the basic attack's 1d challenge. An extra challenge die per range category sounds about right to me, with a chaos star = unintended target.

Blinded condition also works nicely for things like a handful of sand in the eyes (perform a stunt).

Haggard said:

A skill check is actually a manœuvre, not an action. But still, nice idea. I like how Intuition can become useful in less than optimal situations.

r_b_bergstrom said:

My bad. Those numbers are completely wrong. I redid a bunch of math this morning, and have come to the inescapable conclusion that 1 challenge die = 2 misfortune dice. That's it. Yes, if a really nasty chaos-star line is in play (on your action or on the location card) it can make the challenge die a little worse, but only a little. 3 misfortune dice have a much nastier impact on your odds of success and odds of boonage.

In light of the new math, Pitch Black is twice as bad as Blinded.

If that's the case, that means that there's no point in ever taking the Improved defence cards.

improved defences also give you bonuses like +1 soak for improved block, quicker recharge one of your melee attacks if your opponent misses w/ improved parry, a free manoeuvre if your opponent misses with improved dodge. and as already mentioned a challenge die can add a chaos star.