? The Torrent is an amazing ship, provided you know what kind of ship it is

It IS NOT "filler" in the sense of a place-holder for a better ship, it's "filler" in the sense of a TIE fighter. It's your cheapo "swarm" ship, unique to the Republic in that it trades dial quality for an excellent stat-line and action bar relative to its cost.

What's NOT amazing is the fact that clone ships pay a stupid amount of points to get to I 3...for some reason.

The I2 generic is an amazing blocker, one of the best in the game. It can be a useful missile swarm carrier, but this is generally an inferior option.

The I3 has a ridiculous 4 point jump, and the faction talent being generic only and 3 points, and strictly inferior to Heroic is a problem, but a solvable one. BSP to 27, Devoted to 1. The named pilots are interesting, but don’t synergies well for their points. I want to love swoop, but his ability being a red boost _after_ the maneuver meaning no regular action sucks. He’ll need to go to 28, or literally never see play. Oddball is fun, and action economy deluxe, but 38 points is way too much. 34 probably.

Point being the V-19 is fine as designed mostly, it’s just the non Gold are too pricey for what they do.

The N-1 is a very different design, and not at all analogous. They’re a support ship/ flanker/ zoom and boom torpedo delivery device. It doesn’t fit the same role at all. It does, however, fit a role better in certain list types. Great with Jedi, less great with Arcs. Put the generic in the 32-34 point range (the republic needs a ship in the 30-40 bracket, and the Torrent is not worth it once you go above 31, the price with concussions).

The Torrent could be good stat-wise or whatever. But the problem is that there's no tricks or customization.

Once combo-wing gets rolling and power-creep starts, you're already at the most effective use of the ship.

The pilot abilities are awful and non-synergistic.

(Sync Console could be a thing)

(Dedicated would be a thing if they got the pricings right)

5 hours ago, heychadwick said:

they just might be nasty glass cannons that are hard to kill.

2 hours ago, ObiWonka said:

Hard to hit, but fragile once hit.

2 hours ago, Blail Blerg said:

The Torrent could be good stat-wise or whatever. But the problem is that there's no tricks or customization.

Once combo-wing gets rolling and power-creep starts, you're already at the most effective use of the ship.

It's the equivalent of a Tie Fighter. What are you expecting?

Also, I don't think combo wing and OP gameplay will happen for long before FFG smacks it down with adjustments. That's the point of the changes.

4 minutes ago, heychadwick said:

Hard to hit, but fragile once hit.

Except… not really?

2 agi and 5 health. Not hard to hit, just takes a few hits.

What you describe is more like Interceptors. V-19s are more like this

26 minutes ago, heychadwick said:

It's the equivalent of a Tie Fighter. What are you expecting?

Also, I don't think combo wing and OP gameplay will happen for long before FFG smacks it down with adjustments. That's the point of the changes.

Honestly, yeah in kinda in agreement here

The beginning of 2nd Ed was a fair bit shaky with its cheapo wombo-combos (redline, boba with han gunner, Palob etc). Even if they were nowhere near 1st Ed misery it wouldn't have been the best precedent to keep

So I'm glad FFG came down on these pieces. Even if the current environment isn't perfect, it's shown FFG's willingness to step in and curb some of the nonsense.

better still is the design of the prequel factions which I feel are impeccably balanced around a player's decision making rather than passive modifiers (...other than Hate)

Don't think we really gotta fear "combo-wing," least not remotely to the extent of the monstrous horror of last edition.

Plus Torrents got their "Howlrunner" in Sinker 😛

27 minutes ago, heychadwick said:

It's the equivalent of a Tie Fighter. What are you expecting?

Also, I don't think combo wing and OP gameplay will happen for long before FFG smacks it down with adjustments. That's the point of the changes.

And how much list design gets used by Tie Fighters?

Not much.

Especially rarely are they the best pick as non-swarm.

Six TIE swarm seems fairly popular in hyperspace

Also, let's not forget swarms aren't super friendly in an environment where you have to play a lotta games

That many ships gets exhausting pretty quick!

But re Torrent in the republic, the Jedi are really bloody expensive . Gonna have to see if it's even possible to wedge n1s with them or if the Torrent will keep its spot as Jedi escort (re: meatshield)

13 minutes ago, Blail Blerg said:

And how much list design gets used by Tie Fighters?

Not much.

Especially rarely are they the best pick as non-swarm.

TIE l/ns in the hands of a good player are terrifying, both high I Howl Iden swarms, and stuff like e.g. Vader plus 3.

(My oldest child also started 2nd ed with a list with named TIEs, generic Inquisitor and Vynder (long before 2nd ed Hatchetman revealed), actually stopped flying it, as it was "too much easy mode", not that much of an achievement winning.)

1 hour ago, Managarmr said:

TIE l/ns in the hands of a good player are terrifying, both high I Howl Iden swarms, and stuff like e.g. Vader plus 3.

(My oldest child also started 2nd ed with a list with named TIEs, generic Inquisitor and Vynder (long before 2nd ed Hatchetman revealed), actually stopped flying it, as it was "too much easy mode", not that much of an achievement winning.)

Disagree. I haven’t heard tourney results for non swarm tie fighter use.

53 minutes ago, Blail Blerg said:

Disagree. I haven’t heard tourney results for non swarm tie fighter use.

Now you did, rest in peace. ;)

2 hours ago, Blail Blerg said:

And how much list design gets used by Tie Fighters?

Not much.

Especially rarely are they the best pick as non-swarm.

I use them all the flippin' time. I don't have many Imperial lists without a single Tie Fighter. I do well, even if I don't go to the big smansy fancy tournaments. I did well at Krayt Cup with 5 and Vader (no Howlrunner)

a lot of non-swarm swarm-ship use depends on the options a faction has access to rather than combo-wing, unless combo-wing is one of the options 😜

also, I do not believe the TIE is the best non-swarm. Green dice.

Torrent is the best non-swarm swarm ship

plus, given the premise that the Gold Scrub is efficiently costed and the n1-a WONT be undercosted, it'll pretty much always have a spot in the current republic line-up because the republic has some bloody expensive aces (note, I mean "aces in ships that benefit from their capabilities" i.e the Aethersprite and not so much...Oddball. I don't think the N1 is necessarily scary enough to qualify as an aethersprite-level threat)

And, since we got Sinker and Sinker is a.) slow and b.) not terribly well served by Handmaidens given his 1 agility, we've got another home for Torrents even after the Y is released! (re-rolls on primary weapon only)

Honestly, I'm far more concerned about the n1 yeeting the Arc than the torrent. The poor arc is slow and fat, the n1-a is very decently maneuverable and slim. This is why I think Anakin + jedi + double torrents won't go anywhere, but Obi + 3 ARCs is gonna become Obi + 3 n1s

4 hours ago, Ryfterek said:

Now you did, rest in peace. ;)

Well. I see 2 counts of Gideon, and does Rank mean first place?

Nice data btw.

but still, that's basically all the tie fighters there are doing well. I think I didn't even see a swarm.

9 hours ago, Blail Blerg said:

Well. I see 2 counts of Gideon, and does Rank mean first place?

Nice data btw.

but still, that's basically all the tie fighters there are doing well. I think I didn't even see a swarm.

"Rank" is the position at the end of Swiss, "Top cut" is how far it went in the Tops - in this particular case a list with a lone Gideon/ln won the tournament.

It ain't much, but it's honest work.

I saw on one of the local FB groups that both Wave 4 articles have recently edited out June 6th as the release date in the final paragraph. Now both say, "Releasing with the rest of Wave IV".

Hopefully that doesn't mean they are getting delayed as our next tournament is June 22nd.

Ugh that would be annoying, but entirely unsurprising. I always thought 6 June was a bit too good to be true.

On 5/20/2019 at 1:45 PM, Blail Blerg said:

So so so. How many Naboos? 1 2 or 3 ?

I'm thinking 2.

However many I need to make a 200 point list of generics. I've been waiting on the **** N1 for this game for a LONG time.

Now I just hope they release it as a Rebel ship or a card/cardboard pack so we can get Leia flying in one.

Jim

Well it's official, FFG responded to my inquiry on FB and Wave IV is not releasing on June 6th now.

Aww too bad about delayed release

oh well, we'll get it eventually!

also, the n1 existing opens up hope for the silver Naboo Nubian w.e ship (the thing they escaped on in EP 1 and got asploded in EP 2) as a Republic large base crew carrier!

With also like five astromech slots and a first Ed Jerjerod effect

https://youtu.be/w3iex5U03SY

15 minutes ago, ficklegreendice said:

Nubian  w.e ship (the thing they escaped on in EP 1 and got asploded  in EP 2) as a Republic large base crew carrier!

With also  like five astromech slots and a first Ed Jerjerod effect

1. That is 2 very different ships.

2. The Ep 1 Ship is as about the size of a C-ROC (a little longer iirc) and the Ep 2 flying wing can fit more than 2 Falcons nose to nose across its wing span. They are Huge ships. Padme's "little" reverse tear drop ship from Ep 2 is small enough the be a large base though.

4 hours ago, ficklegreendice said:

Aww too bad about delayed release

oh well, we'll get it eventually!

also, the n1 existing opens up hope for the silver Naboo Nubian w.e ship (the thing they escaped on in EP 1 and got asploded in EP 2) as a Republic large base crew carrier!

With also like five astromech slots and a first Ed Jerjerod effect

https://youtu.be/w3iex5U03SY

Honestly, they'd probably do that as crew slots.

Or if it ends up as a Huge ship, as it should, maybe it'll have an Astromech repair team-upgrade with several charges it can discard to repair hull or shields.

4 hours ago, Hiemfire said:

Padme's "little" reverse tear drop ship from Ep 2 is small enough the be a large base though.

Yup - it's almost exactly as long as the YV-666 is.

The J-type Star Skiff from Episode III might be a little more problematic - being very wide - wider than the YV-666 is long.