now since the game has been out for a year, and the next core box is coming soon should there be more colored dice added to the game.
i'm mainly suggesting like a black tiered defense die.

Just now, azeronbloodmoone said:

now since the game has been out for a year, and the next core box is coming soon should there be more colored dice added to the game.
i'm mainly suggesting like a black tiered defense die.

No need due to 6-sided dice.

Red gives you 50% (3/6) without surge and 66.6% (4/6) with surge.

White gives you 16% (1/6) without surge and 33.3% (2/6) with surge.

The only fraction not counted for is 5/6, which creates miserable gameplay (from my 40k experience).

What would the black defense die do? It can't be a six-sider in between the white and red (which would be intuitive given what dice we already have) since it couldn't give any result that you can't already get with a white+surge or a red.

I mean... I'm not saying it's remotely necessary, but is there any reason a 2/6 die + surge for 3/6 would be helpful to the game? Natively as good as a white+surge, allowing for upgrades to take it up to a red w/no surge?

I think it would be more likely and/or interesting to see surges that can turn into two shields, looking at that design space off the top of my head.

34 minutes ago, SpiderMana said:

I mean... I'm not saying it's remotely necessary, but is there any reason a 2/6 die + surge for 3/6 would be helpful to the game? Natively as good as a white+surge, allowing for upgrades to take it up to a red w/no surge?

I think it would be more likely and/or interesting to see surges that can turn into two shields, looking at that design space off the top of my head.

The first sounds mostly like a waste of plastic to me. The second sounds interesting but would just be an ability, not anything on a die.

Since the best armour (mandalorian) has been established as 3+, I don't see the need to add a new defence die.

Attack wise the three dice, and their relative combos provide enough of a bonus.

nah all we need are things like and upgrade give you X number of rerolls per game or Sabines Combat Shield

Black Defence Die for Old Republic Jedi: 2 block, 3 surge. You sure you want to shoot at me?

6 hours ago, SpiderMana said:

I mean... I'm not saying it's remotely necessary, but is there any reason a 2/6 die + surge for 3/6 would be helpful to the game? Natively as good as a white+surge, allowing for upgrades to take it up to a red w/no surge?

I think it would be more likely and/or interesting to see surges that can turn into two shields, looking at that design space off the top of my head.

No.

If they wanted to create an upgrade that took a unit defense from white surge to red no surge, they could just Depict it on the upgrade card.

6 hours ago, arnoldrew said:

What would the black defense die do? It can't be a six-sider in between the white and red (which would be intuitive given what dice we already have) since it couldn't give any result that you can't already get with a white+surge or a red.

The difference would matter when Pierce comes into play. Surges convert after Pierce removes Block results IIRC.

Another potential difference is maybe this defense dice has more than 1 defense surge. A black die that has 1 block and 3 surge faces would be interesting, particularly when you've got Pierce involved. And as mentioned, if the unit in question had Deflect it gets interesting as well.

This actually seems like a cool design space for a Jedi unit to get. A black die that has only 1 block, but a lot of surges, on a unit that has deflect. They pretty much have to burn Dodge tokens to stay alive which means they are action starved, but are very resilient to ranged attacks.

And whose to say that a new type of defense die would have to be 6 sided? You could have an 8 or 10 sided die.

1 hour ago, colki said:

Black Defence Die for Old Republic Jedi: 2 block, 3 surge. You sure you want to shoot at me?

Yup. this is where it would be interesting.

So you guys want a melee expert that is not only well armored, but can also deflect half of the enemies ranged attacks...

I don't see a problem with this.

😂

3 hours ago, BadMotivator said:

The difference would matter when Pierce comes into play. Surges convert after Pierce removes Block results IIRC.

Another potential difference is maybe this defense dice has more than 1 defense surge. A black die that has 1 block and 3 surge faces would be interesting, particularly when you've got Pierce involved. And as mentioned, if the unit in question had Deflect it gets interesting as well.

This actually seems like a cool design space for a Jedi unit to get. A black die that has only 1 block, but a lot of surges, on a unit that has deflect. They pretty much have to burn Dodge tokens to stay alive which means they are action starved, but are very resilient to ranged attacks.

And whose to say that a new type of defense die would have to be 6 sided? You could have an 8 or 10 sided die.

Unfortunately you're wrong. Surges always convert first independent of attack or defense dice. It's always:

Roll

Reroll

Convert Surges

Modify dice

What about horizontal differentiations in addition to current vertical ones. The matter has already been touched on here, with the idea of multiple surges on a potential black defense die. For comparison you could look at armada were each die color, has a different range and attack profile. Red dice have a relatively normal distribution between accuracy, hits and crits but work up to long range with the most blanks. Blue dice(medium range) have the most accuracy results whereas short ranged black dice come with the chance for multiple hit/crit symbols one one die. Especially multi damage dice could enrich Legions depth and counter system. They could easily make a system were one die can only be applied to one mini, with all overkill being lost. So that a 3 damage result would kill both a wookiee or stormtrooper but in both cases nothing gets to the rest of the squad, loosing a lot of potential on the At-ST. In the end it would be a simplified version of Wh40ks current damage system.

7 hours ago, Derrault said:

No.

If they wanted to create an upgrade that took a unit defense from white surge to red no surge, they could just Depict it on the upgrade card.

I'm inclined to agree.

The one thing this game doesn't need more of is extra components!

No. The die we have now are great, and with the variables Surge provides, there is no need for any more.

8 hours ago, BadMotivator said:

The difference would matter when Pierce comes into play. Surges convert after Pierce removes Block results IIRC.

Another potential difference is maybe this defense dice has more than 1 defense surge. A black die that has 1 block and 3 surge faces would be interesting, particularly when you've got Pierce involved. And as mentioned, if the unit in question had Deflect it gets interesting as well.

This actually seems like a cool design space for a Jedi unit to get. A black die that has only 1 block, but a lot of surges, on a unit that has deflect. They pretty much have to burn Dodge tokens to stay alive which means they are action starved, but are very resilient to ranged attacks.

And whose to say that a new type of defense die would have to be 6 sided? You could have an 8 or 10 sided die.

Is far simple and effective (and cheaper for ffg) to do a force upgrade or keyword that let you convert X number of blocks to surges while defending.

" defensive instance X: while defending from a ranged attack, you may convert X blocks to surges"

You can add variety here with the number, putting this via upgrade (that can be exhaustive or not), adding another keyword for melee or one combined... etc. Much better than a die

What I want with the new core set are some new white defense dice since mine can never roll anything...they must be cursed

4 hours ago, LennoxPoodle said:

loosing a lot of potential on the At-ST

Because this is exactly what we need: Weaker Heavies XD

Tbh Warhammer manages nearly everything with a D6. The dices in SWL are already enough to ensure a lot of variety. I don't see why we need more dice.

2 hours ago, Staelwulf said:

Because this is exactly what we need: Weaker Heavies XD

Tbh Warhammer manages nearly everything with a D6. The dices in SWL are already enough to ensure a lot of variety. I don't see why we need more dice.

I really have no idea, why I wrote that. I meant loosing potential on the stormtroopers ofc. In the end it would do as much fage as a single mini has wounds per dice at max. The result would be a rock, paper, scissors effect differentiating between many wounds or many minis.

Adding that there is only ONE potential d6 addition and that's the equivalent of a 2+, which doesn't fit anywhere since as previously mentioned, the best armour in the game (Mandelorian) has been established as 3+ with Impervious, or 3+ with Immune: Pierce (Force Users).

Additionally, the Attack dice cover the following target numbers on d8s:

Red: 3+ w/out surge, 2+ w/ surge

Black: 5+ w/out surge, 4+ w/ surge

White: 7+ w/out surge, 6+ w/ surge

So the only potential addition is an 8+, which can be handled by a rule to either make a specific unit only able to Crit, or ignore Crit results with White dice.

So only having a single percentage that can't be generated with current dice (2+) doesn't really seem to be the end of the world, and there are ways to get CLOSE to the same percentage using existing dice.

No.

On 5/3/2019 at 5:07 PM, naitsirk said:

Is far simple and effective (and cheaper for ffg) to do a force upgrade or keyword that let you convert X number of blocks to surges while defending.

" defensive instance X: while defending from a ranged attack, you may convert X blocks to surges"

You can add variety here with the number, putting this via upgrade (that can be exhaustive or not), adding another keyword for melee or one combined... etc. Much better than a die

Why would you want to convert blocks to surges?

3 hours ago, costi said:

Why would you want to convert blocks to surges?

To trigger deflect ability and inflict wounds to enemies

3 hours ago, naitsirk said:

To trigger deflect ability and inflict wounds to enemies

Far simpler to just have a rule that allows for X blocks to deflect shots than go through the hassle of converting hits to surges back to blocks which could have complicated timing issues.