Can you do the Kanan/ID handbrake if you’re ionized?

Sorry guys, I am late to the party!

So, what are we nerfing today? I have no clue yet, but I am sure that it must be a terrible NPE.

I have got my pitchfork and my torch ready. Just give me a short update, and I'll start shouting right away.

9 minutes ago, Schu81 said:

Sorry guys, I am late to the party!

So, what are we nerfing today? I have no clue yet, but I am sure that it must be a terrible NPE.

I have got my pitchfork and my torch ready. Just give me a short update, and I'll start shouting right away.

Just answer this from @Boom Owl , tells you and everyone else all they need to know:

Quote

Ok so...there are a couple quick items people need to decide for themselves if its what they want to be available from a single ship in 2.0 X-Wing:

• Competitively Playable 360 Turret
• Reliable Regen
• Big Base Boost
• Offensive and Defensive Passive Mods
• Selectable White Stop at I6
• Run to Time Win condition

If all of these things combined into one ship are your idea of what makes interesting 2nd Edition X-Wing Gameplay I can't and won't attempt to convince you otherwise.

10 hours ago, svelok said:

I mean, we have yet to see a large base turret ever getting much mileage out of VTG...

We have yet to see a large base turret able to equip it alongside free non-action infinite init rotates.

VTG is good on the Resistance Bomber fwiw, but on anything that's not able to overlap primary & turret arcs I'm not scared of what VTG can do.

Been watching this thread since the UK Systems, where I had the pleasure of watching Jack win the tournament with this list.

Must admit it's disappointing to see that people would rather jump on a list that they feel is broken, rather than congratulating a very talented player for winning a very competitive tournament.

A lot of you seem to be giving the impression that this list needs absolutely no skill at all to fly (its broken and you can't win against it), and I can tell you that's just not true, I've seen accomplished players lose with this list.

Are more people going to pick this list up and try it, undoubtedly yes, will it replace all the Rebel beef or quad Phantom lists getting into the cuts, I very much doubt it (but only time will tell).

We can only speak for ourselves when it comes down to negative gaming experiences, but personally I've faced this list and it's no where near negative for me.

We have 3 months left before the next points changes, let's just watch and see what happens during that time, rather than jumping for the jugular immediately.

1 minute ago, xwingMinty said:

Must admit it's disappointing to see that people would rather jump on a list that they feel is broken, rather than congratulating a very talented player for winning a very competitive tournament.

4 minutes ago, xwingMinty said:

 A lot of you seem to be giving the impression that this list needs absolutely no skill at all to fly (its broken and you can't win against it), and I can tell you that's just not true, I've seen accomplished players lose with this list. 

21 hours ago, GreenDragoon said:

It is precisely part of the problem that this Han is as skill dependent - he can remove so much agency that the opponent does not get to play. Obviously that requires somewhat good decision making and eg range control, ie a good player.

On 4/22/2019 at 3:59 PM, Boom Owl said:

Vast majority of players who think Hand Brake Han is out of place in 2.0 (myself included) are laser focused on a few specific mechanics.

On 4/22/2019 at 2:24 PM, svelok said:

But, this isn't a thread about "Kanan + ID Han is OP, please nerf".

The thread is "Kanan + ID Han is wearing 1.0 clothes, cards > maneuvering game design, that slipped through the cracks and isn't fun or engaging to play against."

On 4/21/2019 at 3:16 PM, Boom Owl said:

• Competitively Playable 360 Turret
• Reliable Regen
• Big Base Boost
• Offensive and Defensive Passive Mods
• Selectable White Stop at I6
• Run to Time Win condition

If all of these things combined into one ship are your idea of what makes interesting 2nd Edition X-Wing Gameplay I can't and won't attempt to convince you otherwise.

Skill required to play the list and existence of other lists like Quad Phantoms or Leia that require point adjustment is irrelevant. 

33 minutes ago, xwingMinty said:

A lot of you seem to be giving the impression that this list needs absolutely no skill at all to fly (its broken and you can't win against it), and I can tell you that's just not true, I've seen accomplished players lose with this list.

Well, somebody hasn't bothered actually reading the posts in this thread!

To reiterate, (I'd say, "For the last time," except that I'm 100% sure it won't be the case) the problem some people have with the list has absolutely nothing to do with how strong or weak it is. It could be the worst list in the game and I would still think the developers dropped the ball by allowing so many consequence-free, chargeless mods to come together. It's counter-2E in my opinion.

44 minutes ago, xwingMinty said:

Been watching this thread since the UK Systems, where I had the pleasure of watching Jack win the tournament with this list.

Must admit it's disappointing to see that people would rather jump on a list that they feel is broken, rather than congratulating a very talented player for winning a very competitive tournament.

A lot of you seem to be giving the impression that this list needs absolutely no skill at all to fly (its broken and you can't win against it), and I can tell you that's just not true, I've seen accomplished players lose with this list.

Are more people going to pick this list up and try it, undoubtedly yes, will it replace all the Rebel beef or quad Phantom lists getting into the cuts, I very much doubt it (but only time will tell).

We can only speak for ourselves when it comes down to negative gaming experiences, but personally I've faced this list and it's no where near negative for me.

We have 3 months left before the next points changes, let's just watch and see what happens during that time, rather than jumping for the jugular immediately.

6 minutes ago, RStan said:

I agree. Also Congratulations Jack, Zack, Lukas, and Nathan.

3 minutes ago, RStan said:

This is me on the forums most of the time. For every post I type, there are 3-5 which I type then delete cuz....whatever.

1 hour ago, xwingMinty said:

Been watching this thread since the UK Systems, where I had the pleasure of watching Jack win the tournament with this list.

Must admit it's disappointing to see that people would rather jump on a list that they feel is broken, rather than congratulating a very talented player for winning a very competitive tournament.

A lot of you seem to be giving the impression that this list needs absolutely no skill at all to fly (its broken and you can't win against it), and I can tell you that's just not true, I've seen accomplished players lose with this list.

Are more people going to pick this list up and try it, undoubtedly yes, will it replace all the Rebel beef or quad Phantom lists getting into the cuts, I very much doubt it (but only time will tell).

We can only speak for ourselves when it comes down to negative gaming experiences, but personally I've faced this list and it's no where near negative for me.

We have 3 months left before the next points changes, let's just watch and see what happens during that time, rather than jumping for the jugular immediately.

If that's what you read, then that's an odd interpretation of what's going on here.

If you listen to the latest SithTaker snapshot podcast, Jack talks about his Hyperspace win ... in one section, he talks about how to beat the list ... it's not a big surprise ...

In the final, the opponent flying Rebel beef took Han off the board, but Jack won the day with Jake Farrell.

Well, no, he doesn't talk about how to beat the list because it didn't get beaten. He talks about the good things to try and do to the list that he's demonstrated he's very good at avoiding and surviving anyway.

He lost Han in the final to a bad crit (structural damage) and had already told me after our Semi Final he should have been playing Chewie not Nein Nunb to solve for that, so it's only a suboptimal build issue that made the final close. The game he lost in the swiss he put down to his opponent having crazy hot green dice.

So how do you beat his list? Get really ******* lucky. The end.

It's broken, it's bad, it's not enjoyable, it's nothing to do with anything that I'd hope we see X-Wing 2.0 about and I hope it's taken away very very soon. I'll also be playing it myself starting Friday because I don't really see any other option.

6 hours ago, xwingMinty said:

Been watching this thread since the UK Systems, where I had the pleasure of watching Jack win the tournament with this list.

Must admit it's disappointing to see that people would rather jump on a list that they feel is broken, rather than congratulating a very talented player for winning a very competitive tournament.

A lot of you seem to be giving the impression that this list needs absolutely no skill at all to fly (its broken and you can't win against it), and I can tell you that's just not true, I've seen accomplished players lose with this list.

Are more people going to pick this list up and try it, undoubtedly yes, will it replace all the Rebel beef or quad Phantom lists getting into the cuts, I very much doubt it (but only time will tell).

We can only speak for ourselves when it comes down to negative gaming experiences, but personally I've faced this list and it's no where near negative for me.

We have 3 months left before the next points changes, let's just watch and see what happens during that time, rather than jumping for the jugular immediately.

I don't see any of the above happening, I know for a fact that on one questions Jack's ability to play the game.

The concerns are all based on design issues. This list removes most of the agency from the opponent in that the Han player can, stall for time with their stops, has a large point fortress that can run to time, Wait until all other ships have moved and then choose from up to 8 options to avoid taking shots, Has a large amount of action efficiency (including re-rolls and unlimited regen and force).

These are design issues that were supposed to be left behind in V1.0 - they are the same gameplay mechanics that was causing x-wing to die (at least competitively) at the end of 1.0.

This isn't a cry for nerf that list, it a cry for FFG to not take us to a place where games are won/lost in the list building phase.

4 hours ago, TheCeilican said:

It's broken, it's bad, it's not enjoyable ... I'll also be playing it myself.

7 hours ago, RStan said:

7 hours ago, TheCeilican said:

. I'll also be playing it myself starting Friday because I don't really see any other option.

I’m sorry, but that’s absolute crap.

Just now, Estarriol said:

I’m sorry, but that’s absolute crap.

No, it's accurate and them choosing to use the broken combo competitively is reasonable.

No. Saying it’s something you don’t want to see in the game and then playing it is irresponsible, and running a list you don’t want to play against is an eff you to your opponent.

Just now, Estarriol said:

No. Saying it’s something you don’t want to see in the game and then playing it is irresponsible, and running a list you don’t want to play against is an eff you to your opponent.

Until FFG does something about it on their end, like with Phantoms, not taking it due to it being broken despite the advantages it provides is idiocy. That is one of the basic aspects of competitive games...

No, games are supposed to be fun. If you’re flying something you consider to be broken **** that you don’t think should be in the game for the whole purpose of winning, you’re not only saying that your victory is more important than your opponent having a good game, you’re saying you don’t care about your opponent at all.

Come to think about it, you’re also saying that your winning is more important than YOU having fun, in which case why are you even here?

19 minutes ago, Estarriol said:

No, games are supposed to be fun. If you’re flying something you consider to be broken **** that you don’t think should be in the game for the whole purpose of winning, you’re not only saying that your victory is more important than your opponent having a good game, you’re saying you don’t care about your opponent at all.

Come to think about it, you’re also saying that your winning is more important than YOU having fun, in which case why are you even here?

Luckily you don't think there is any problem with the list, so then there is also no problem with him playing it.

Jack Mooney just won a Hyperspace trial with this, too:

Han Solo + Trick Shot + Luke Skywalker + Nien Nunb + R2-D2 + Engine Upgrade + Millennium Falcon + Inertial Dampeners

Jake Farrell + Lone Wolf + Outmaneuver + Proton Rockets