2 minutes ago, dalestephenson said:

However  , the announcement said "These heroes will eventually enter The Lord of the Rings: The Card Game through standard products",  and I don't th  ink the hypothetical starters set would either be  a standard product or qualify for the plural.  

Well, I don't think Caleb sat down with a marketing intern and said, "Hey, this hero is coming out in an AP next cycle, and the other one is coming out in the following cycle, so be EXTRA careful to use a plural here, OK?"

I know often all we have as evidence is what FFG puts on its site, but I caution reading too much into the words where the marketing department is concerned, as they have repeatedly gotten things across multiple game lines wrong. (I also think a starter set that didn't cost $100 might very well count as "standard", but that's neither here nor there.)

I also don't think Caleb sat down and invented two brand-new heroes for a product that otherwise contained exactly zero new player cards. It makes much more practical sense to borrow two heroes that have already been playtested for a future cycle or cycles. Now it's *possible* for two yet-to-be-released heroes to be in the same deluxe, but as Thorin and Gildor have nothing in common and never met (that we know), that doesn't fit the pattern for past deluxes: two dwarves, two Gondorians, two Rohirrim, two Dunedain, two Noldor, Legolas & Gimli, two Dale. So even if FFG had said nothing at all, I'd expect both heroes to be released in separate, regular products. As they said exactly that, I see little reason to hedge on my expectations.

While I recognize that FFG releases aren't authoritative, the way the new heroes are portrayed in the article (brand new, but coming eventually in standard products) is different than the way the new quests are portrayed in the article (brand new and unique). I think the starter set *should* be released by FFG as a regular product, but there's been no hint from FFG that they will do so.

Since past deluxes *do* have links between their hero, who could be released with Gollum in the next deluxe? I'm betting on a new version of Frodo or Sam.

2 hours ago, dalestephenson said:

Since past deluxes *do* have links between their hero, who could be released with Gollum in the next deluxe? I'm betting on a new version of Frodo or Sam.

That would be my guess as well.

I personally love the direction the game is taking. One thing that makes Lord of the Rings LCG an awesome experience for Lord of the Rings fans is the way in which the expansions are so closely tied to the story of the setting. Adding smegol as a playable character is a natural progression here and as has always been the case with this LCG, no matter how we speculate, everyone is always ultimately surprised with what FFG comes up with. The game is taking a step into a new direction and while I can see that not everyone will love the direction, the important thing here is that we took another step forward. The risk of Lord of the Rings LCG being canceled grows year after year as the game gets older so everytime a new deluxe expansion is announced I sigh in relief knowing that my favorite game lives on. Do I love every expansion, every concept, every mechanic that they have introduced? No I don't, but I love the fact that no matter how much I add to my collection there is always more to get.

This is all great news for fans and I'm ecstatic! Thank You FFG!! My credit card is in the mail.

10 hours ago, Halberto said:

And smeagol seems working great with Beorn hero who does not exaust to defend gollum and can swing for 5 alone and in turn 1 to flip him to smeagol when needed.

Makes me to imagine a picture that little Gollum is under the mighty bear's guard...one paw hit cure for each madness time....

14 hours ago, Nickpes said:

To be honest, I would prefer a shire cycle ... do not like going into Mordor ... it is like we are going to the end

On one hand, I am really happy we got an announcement, on the other, I too would also prefer the Shire. Aslo, the cards seem a bit less exciting than usual. Of course I want to see Sméagol but without encounter control, losing a hero to the Stinker cards, that’s a bit risky. That being said, with 3 starting threat it is an ideal hero for a mono-Lore secrecy Denetor encounter manipulation deck, perhaps.

8 hours ago, sappidus said:

I know often all we have as evidence is what FFG puts on its site, but I caution reading too much into the words where the marketing department is concerned, as they have repeatedly gotten things across multiple game lines wrong. (I also think a starter set that didn't cost $100 might very well count as "standard", but that's neither here nor there.)

Can't agree with you more. I've learned through several talks that Asmodee pretty much runs the website marketing. Caleb may not even get the chance to really look at the articles or have any say to edit the article before it's released. Please don't punish Caleb!

Remember! You're just playing your "version" of what happens between the books. What if Boromir DID find the ring and take it for Gondor? What if Aragorn or Galdriel did see themselves as capable enough to bear the burden?

I've never bought into the whole "game is dying" idea. I enjoy it too much to believe enough people will lose interest in it that it will die. That being said I can see the designers getting to the point where they would like to do something different. Having said that, if this cycle dose take us to Mordor itself, and not just its borderlands, I still don't think that's how they would end it. There and back again. I expect the last box to be about the Shire.

If they really felt like it, they could also do quests that run parallel to the Sagas. See what other people were doing at the same time, that weren't featured in the books.

I'm not going to say the game is dying. But as a huge fan from the early days, it is certainly showing its age. The cards and scenarios are becoming more and more complex as time goes on, which is not a good sign.

The last time I played the Ring Saga campaign scenarios, it took like 50% more time just to track all the effects while playing. In the end, we spent more attention on the rules than the experience and it felt shallow. A healthier form of complexity would be in the combinations of simple, iconic cards within a growing card pool. It's not bad, but it's not great either.

I do trust the designers and their judgment in general - they've demonstrated it repeatedly - but the mechanics cannot just keep going this way indefinitely. It will eventually need a reboot or refocus to support continued growth and for this particular game, I'm not sure that's "in the cards" so to speak.

I'd love to see that, but also some stuff from the 4th Age. Tearing down Dol Guldur, the Sibjugating the East and South, the reforming of Arnor.

7 minutes ago, Felswrath said:

I'd love to see that, but also some stuff from the 4th Age. Tearing down Dol Guldur, the Sibjugating the East and South, the reforming of Arnor.

Minor nitpick, but Dol Guldur was destroyed by Lady Galadriel in the third age, after the three assaults on the Golden Wood. Mirkwood was cleansed, renamed, and split between Celebron, Thranduil, and the Woodmen and Beornings (and presumably any other dale-men in the area).

26 minutes ago, Distractionbeast said:

I'm not going to say the game is dying. But as a huge fan from the early days, it is certainly showing its age. The cards and scenarios are becoming more and more complex as time goes on, which is not a good sign.

I've played every cycle (not every scenario but at least 4 in each cycle), and i think the cycle with the more boring and complex elements of gameplay is The Ring maker Cycle, which was early in the game history.

Each Quest cards and a lot of Enemy cards have the Time X keyword, which is sooo boring and have so many effects that triggers. And the Ring maker was only the 4th cycle in the game.

I don't find the cards are becoming more complex. If you look at the Heroes on the last cycle, Haldan, Thranduil for instance have very simple effects. And look at Sméagol, it's a very simple yet unseen effect. Sure the game is complex, but i love a complex game, where each action should be carrefully chosen.

The thing i found weird is the number of the The Shadow in the East product. It's MEC77. It should have been MEC72 ,because The fate of Wilderland is MEC71.

Or maybe there is other products awaiting us in the shadows. ^^

23 minutes ago, Wandalf the Gizzard said:

Minor nitpick, but Dol Guldur was destroyed by Lady Galadriel in the third age, after the three assaults on the Golden Wood. Mirkwood was cleansed, renamed, and split between Celebron, Thranduil, and the Woodmen and Beornings (and presumably any other dale-men in the area).

I was under the impression that it fell after the Ring was destroyed, but I trust you.

34 minutes ago, Distractionbeast said:

I'm not going to say the game is dying. But as a huge fan from the early days, it is certainly showing its age. The cards and scenarios are becoming more and more complex as time goes on, which is not a good sign.

I'd say we have stepped away from the complexity we had been seeing. We reached a peak insanity around the end of the Ring-maker cycle, with the Time mechanic being hard to keep track of, especially in a scenario like The Antlered Crown where so many different cards have time counters. At the time, people were saying that it was way too much to keep track of. I think FFG took that feedback seriously and has given us simpler scenarios since then--- I definitely definitely don't see a linear progression in complexity that has continued unbroken.

21 minutes ago, Valiko33 said:

The  thing i found weird is the number of th  e The Shadow in the East product. It's MEC77. It should have been MEC72 ,because The fate of Wilderland is MEC7  1. 

Or maybe there is other products awaiting us in the shadows. ^^ 

Per the FFG site:

• uMEC72: Siege of Annuminas
• MEC73: the Limited Collector's Edition
• uMEC74: Attack on Dol Guldur
• uMEC75: Woodland Realm
• uMEC76: Wizard's Quest

1 hour ago, Felswrath said:

Tearing down Dol Guldur

For that we already have the POD Attack on Dol Guldur actually

Personally I hope they head towards the end now.
A good run. But I feel the game is getting a bit overly crunchy and is running out of steam.
Ending with Mordor would be a good thing.

Perhaps squeeze out a last little cycle to close things off.
And end there.

1 hour ago, Felswrath said:

I was under the impression that it fell after the Ring was destroyed, but I trust you.

It did, by three days.

25 minutes ago, Darthvegeta800 said:

Personally I hope they head towards the end now.
A good run. But I feel the game is getting a bit overly crunchy and is running out of steam.
Ending with Mordor would be a good thing.

And end there.

Agreed. I'm working under the assumption this is now the last cycle. We've had a great run and let's face it, there is years worth of gameplay out there. Hate to be negative, but FFGs attitude to restocking is now so poor, that I think they want to wind it down and focus on new stuff. Just to say, that if it is the last cycle, ending in Mordor is good. Maybe we get to fight the Dark Lord (an unwinnable battle surely) maybe as a distraction as Frodo and Sam cross Mordor?

39 minutes ago, Wandalf the Gizzard said:

It did, by three days.

Now I'm confused. Looking on One Wiki to Rule them All, the fourth age began when the Ring was destroyed which would put the destruction of Dol Guldur in the Fourth Age. However, It also said that the fourth Age Began on March 25, 3021 (exactly 2 years after the Ring was destroyed). Which was it?

Edit: There seems to be a little bit of confusion concerning the date due to different calendars, however, I guess the Third Age ended with the departure of the Three Elven rings, not the Fall of Sauron.

9 minutes ago, Felswrath said:

I guess the Third Age ended with the departure of the Three Elven rings, not the Fall of Sauron.

Correct!

The Battle of the Morannon, destruction of the Ring, and the Downfall of Sauron occurred on March 25, TA 3019. After recovering from the three assaults on Lorien (March 11th, 15th, and 22nd), the Host of the Galadhrim marched on and destroyed Dol Guldur on the 28th.

Different peoples (the Shire, Gondor) have different dates for year One of the Fourth Age, some overlapping with the end of the Third Age (when the Ringbearers passed into the West in 3021. This might clear it up some: http://tolkiengateway.net/wiki/Fourth_Age

Hope that helps!

2 hours ago, Darthvegeta800 said:

A good run. But I feel the game is getting a bit overly crunchy and is running out of steam.

To the contrary, I think you'll find that many players, myself included, consider the game right now to be the best it's ever been.

7 hours ago, Seastan said:

To the contrary, I think you'll find that many players, myself included, consider the game right now to be the best it's ever been.

As someone who remembers the core set days and how long it took us to get multiple viable archetypes I completely agree with Sea.

I am supper excited for this new announcement!

In my opinion, this game, bearing the Lord of the Rings brand and being of such a high quality, is going to keep going as long as the dev team is motivating to keep working on it.

I hoped if we got the East the two Wizzards would be there, in the deluxe. It is hard to pair anyone with Sméagol. Had they not said it in the article, I would have thought we get just one hero. Also note a strange numbering, whilst previously the heroes always got slots 1 & 2, the One Ring is 1 and Sméagol is 72 (with Stinker being 71 and Gollum 73, if I remember correctly, the last numbers out there, presumably). So, will the other hero get 2? Is he really there? If so, Frodo seems natural, but then again Spirit would, and we got him in Spirit. Maybe Leadership instead?

Also, 29 player cards, what does that mean? It includes the three copies, right? But not the heroes? The One Ring will be there just once, hopefully, then 28 more? Nine cards times three plus another with a single copy? Who can help me here?