13 minutes ago, Aurelus said:

I played Rebels against Krennic, 3 DTs with DLT and config, 1 DT with leader and config, 3 Storms with medic, Eweb...

I got lit up 2 games in a row.

There is no answer to 2 red, 4 black, and a white at Range 4 with suppression. None. Never mind 6 red and white at Range 2 with blast.

Having a unit that can punch this hard, with the best defense possible is a recipe for disaster... If it was a single commander, ok sure, but having the option to put 4 of these on the table is terrible design.

That list is a very stationary list if you plan to take advantage of the config range which is a problem that is compounded by the lack of good units to advance up the field.

The damage is good, but without surge to crit or sharpshooter they'll have problems with units in cover without using the blast config. And that's only range 2, which they can't advance into if beyond that without having given their play away a round in advance at minimum. Frankly Strict Orders is a hard counter to their suppressive if you have your commander in a good spot to be handling that. If suppression is a problem, then I recommend Wookies. I finally got to play with them, and I was thoroughly impressed by their performance.

Finally, Flamethrower RTs are the best counter to that list. Only three units with impact, and two with surge to crit. Have them go after the medic squads, and once down the obligitory sniper teams won't have to worry about the wounds being healed. Or just focus on one squad with snipers. Medics can only heal damage done in the same round as when it was taken and it's unlikely that all three medics will be in range of one of the squads.

1 hour ago, thepopemobile100 said:

That list is a very stationary list if you plan to take advantage of the config range which is a problem that is compounded by the lack of good units to advance up the field.

The damage is good, but without surge to crit or sharpshooter they'll have problems with units in cover without using the blast config. And that's only range 2, which they can't advance into if beyond that without having given their play away a round in advance at minimum. Frankly Strict Orders is a hard counter to their suppressive if you have your commander in a good spot to be handling that. If suppression is a problem, then I recommend Wookies. I finally got to play with them, and I was thoroughly impressed by their performance.

Finally, Flamethrower RTs are the best counter to that list. Only three units with impact, and two with surge to crit. Have them go after the medic squads, and once down the obligitory sniper teams won't have to worry about the wounds being healed. Or just focus on one squad with snipers. Medics can only heal damage done in the same round as when it was taken and it's unlikely that all three medics will be in range of one of the squads.

I honestly don't know how to respond to this. Hypothetically, you are making some good points, but this is all perfect condition scenarios. The reality is that 4 units rolling 5+ hits against white dice will eat 5 man squads behind heavy cover no problem. Strict Orders is terrible against compounded stress. Wookies are pretty good, but I doubt their effectiveness against Standby/Ready 1/ Precise 2... and red melee will punch holes in crappy Wookie defence. Flamer AT-RTs will lose their effectiveness at 4 wounds (less damage, less actions, reduced movement). 1 Unit with Impact and Precise 2 will absolutely score at least 2 crits per shot with that many dice to play with, ATRTs wont have a chance to hit range 1.

I'm not trying to criticize your suggestions, but I am VERY concerned that this perfect storm managed to get past play testing. And given FFGs track record of dealing with units that under/over perform, a fix could be 6 months to a year away. We are planning another game tomorrow, same Imps vs another Rebel player in our community, hopefully we are wrong and/or overreacting.

1 hour ago, Aurelus said:

I honestly don't know how to respond to this. Hypothetically, you are making some good points, but this is all perfect condition scenarios. The reality is that 4 units rolling 5+ hits against white dice will eat 5 man squads behind heavy cover no problem. Strict Orders is terrible against compounded stress. Wookies are pretty good, but I doubt their effectiveness against Standby/Ready 1/ Precise 2... and red melee will punch holes in crappy Wookie defence. Flamer AT-RTs will lose their effectiveness at 4 wounds (less damage, less actions, reduced movement). 1 Unit with Impact and Precise 2 will absolutely score at least 2 crits per shot with that many dice to play with, ATRTs wont have a chance to hit range 1.

I'm not trying to criticize your suggestions, but I am VERY concerned that this perfect storm managed to get past play testing. And given FFGs track record of dealing with units that under/over perform, a fix could be 6 months to a year away. We are planning another game tomorrow, same Imps vs another Rebel player in our community, hopefully we are wrong and/or overreacting.

DLT Deathtroopers at range 4 don't average 5 hits though so if that's what you were seeing, then it's a bad run of luck.

Every action that the Deathtroopers are shooting the AT-RT is an action that they aren't shooting your squishier rebel troops. It's a general rule of thumb that you should never run just one Flamethrower RT as it gets focused down too easily, but two makes it a good deal more difficult to do. Furthermore while precise 2 is good at getting crits, it still can't guarantee them. Ultimately it's down to luck as to whether you'll catch any crits when you fish or them, and any plan that relies on unfavorable die roles is an unfavorable plan regardless of how many dice are rolled.

Unless they're being given a standby from Krennic or have overwatch, then standby is not an action I see being taken a lot on these guys. Normal range 2 standby is bad as it's easy to break it. Since they're config relies on ready actions, they generally won't have an aim if they're planning on using their range 4 suppressive option.

15 hours ago, Aurelus said:

I honestly don't know how to respond to this. Hypothetically, you are making some good points, but this is all perfect condition scenarios. The reality is that 4 units rolling 5+ hits against white dice will eat 5 man squads behind heavy cover no problem. Strict Orders is terrible against compounded stress. Wookies are pretty good, but I doubt their effectiveness against Standby/Ready 1/ Precise 2... and red melee will punch holes in crappy Wookie defence. Flamer AT-RTs will lose their effectiveness at 4 wounds (less damage, less actions, reduced movement). 1 Unit with Impact and Precise 2 will absolutely score at least 2 crits per shot with that many dice to play with, ATRTs wont have a chance to hit range 1.

I'm not trying to criticize your suggestions, but I am VERY concerned that this perfect storm managed to get past play testing. And given FFGs track record of dealing with units that under/over perform, a fix could be 6 months to a year away. We are planning another game tomorrow, same Imps vs another Rebel player in our community, hopefully we are wrong and/or overreacting.

Each of those large stack of dice require exhausting that config card, that means many turns of either not moving or not aiming to reduce the strength of the list. Underpointing your list a bit and getting the missions that benefit you could go a long way to helping balancing it out, it is a lot of damage, but just seems like you either are getting unluck with dice, or are split firing and not focusing down units to reduce the threats.

To be fair with the tapping/untapping of the Config, their Stand By action also gets them an aim (Ready 1). So if they don't have to move (guarding an objective or area denial), they could untap the card, Stand By and then they can still shoot that turn when someone else activates AND still have an aim token (with precise 2) AND still have the suppressive or blast that they need.

So yes, you won't be throwing their awesome ranged shot out 6 turns a game. But with some good early game moves and positioning, you could then 'turret' with them for a bit. Or have a Spotter near them.

6 minutes ago, InterceptorMad said:

To be fair with the tapping/untapping of the Config, their Stand By action also gets them an aim (Ready 1). So if they don't have to move (guarding an objective or area denial), they could untap the card, Stand By and then they can still shoot that turn when someone else activates AND still have an aim token (with precise 2) AND still have the suppressive or blast that they need.

So yes, you won't be throwing their awesome ranged shot out 6 turns a game. But with some good early game moves and positioning, you could then 'turret' with them for a bit. Or have a Spotter near them.

The big downside of standby in today's meta is snipers, who will be gunning for DT's anyway because of their vulnerability to pierce and single health, high value minis. A single suppression gets rid of their standby and takes away one of their attacks.

@InterceptorMad @KommanderKeldoth

Snipers aren't even the only downside. If there are already units in Range 3 of the DT unit, one of them can just declare an attack against the DT and place a Suppression, preventing the Standby activation, barring an unlucky roll. And it requires the DT player to activate them early in order to have the greatest chance of activating Standby.

Paint them with big target circles on their backs cause these are what win the game.

On 3/25/2019 at 4:10 PM, Aurelus said:

I honestly don't know how to respond to this. Hypothetically, you are making some good points, but this is all perfect condition scenarios. The reality is that 4 units rolling 5+ hits against white dice will eat 5 man squads behind heavy cover no problem. Strict Orders is terrible against compounded stress. Wookies are pretty good, but I doubt their effectiveness against Standby/Ready 1/ Precise 2... and red melee will punch holes in crappy Wookie defence. Flamer AT-RTs will lose their effectiveness at 4 wounds (less damage, less actions, reduced movement). 1 Unit with Impact and Precise 2 will absolutely score at least 2 crits per shot with that many dice to play with, ATRTs wont have a chance to hit range 1.

I'm not trying to criticize your suggestions, but I am VERY concerned that this perfect storm managed to get past play testing. And given FFGs track record of dealing with units that under/over perform, a fix could be 6 months to a year away. We are planning another game tomorrow, same Imps vs another Rebel player in our community, hopefully we are wrong and/or overreacting.

Time to try airspeeders?