I think the Guardian firearm spread is interesting. I'm wondering where they go from here as far as new big weapons.

Shotgun is good for investigators that already have a high combat value to start. So Mark for instance with the Shotgun shooting at 8 skill is not bad against most stuff. You are likely to get pretty decent damage out of the weapon if you throw anything else into the skill check (someone stacking combat bonuses like Beat Cops and Ace of Swords even more so). That said Shotgun is too close to Lightning Gun in XP cost and most people would much prefer reliability. Especially when you aren't playing on Easy. On Easy Shotgun is probably not that bad an idea. On Hard I think Shotgun is going to be more a liability than a boon. You are better off taking the more reliable BAR or Lightning Gun. With Lightning Gun you are getting a much more efficient weapon at the cost of 1 more resource and 1 more xp. With BAR you are getting a slightly less damaging but more accurate weapon for the ammo expended.

I actually think BAR is quite a good comparison if we use Shotgun as a standard for big weapons. Lightning Gun feels slightly over powered by comparison IMO even at it's resource cost and xp value. Unless you get an auto fail the Lightning Gun is gonna pretty consistently give you 3 damage per ammo used, which is staggering. It's not too bad if taken as is (considering it cost 6 to put out), but if you start Sleight Of Handing it or Throwing more ammo on it the weapon gets pretty nuts.

Where Lightning Gun falls down is that it's overkill on most enemies though the same criticism can be leveled against Shotgun. BAR is kinda nice in this respect since you can scale it's output based on the ammo expended thus matching the cost to the threat. Though if you are just fighting a bunch of cultists you might have been better off just taking the upgraded .45.

All that said I usually do pretty well with just the upgraded .45s at lower player counts. Also the .45 gives you a free hand to use Machete without having to resort to a bandolier, which is nice for conserving ammo and resources. I feel like these big weapons aren't needed until you start hitting 3+ players and those big enemies start having mountains of HP to work through if you are trying to succeed through combat.

Fun fact: Shotgun is worse at killing 2-health enemies than the .45 Automatic (2).

Counter point: Our first time through FA, our Leo/Mateo combo Shotgun-ed the Harbinger to giblets in 2 actions via Mateo giving Leo the Elder Sign on both Double or Nothing tests. It was very wrath of God.

shotgun has the highest potential damage output. I have used it on hard and it is quite serviceable, even though you sort of need to build your deck around it to take care of ammo problems. Still, with flamethrower the shotgun has started to feel a bit outclassed, but it is 1 xp cheaper. I like the shotgun because I think it's stylish (more so that lit gun or flamethrower), but I admit it's starting to fall behind. I expect a L-5 shotgun will show up sooner or later.

I just want Kate Winthrop with access to Lightning Gun... which is never going to happen sadly because they missed the opportunity to Science trait it. I can't see how she would possibly have access unless she's a guardian, but that is highly unlikely.

EDIT: Strange Solution IS science traited, however. I guess she could be a Guardian/Survivor with Science traited things? Feels odd to me to think of her as anything other than a Seeker though.

2 hours ago, Iuchi Toshimo said:

Counter point: Our first time through FA, our Leo/Mateo combo Shotgun-ed the Harbinger to giblets in 2 actions via Mateo giving Leo the Elder Sign on both Double or Nothing tests. It was very wrath of God.

That's numerically impressive, but it's not particularly useful. Killing the Harbinger outright is at best handy and at worst actively harmful, and you're talking about 14 xp over 5 cards and 2 investigators - as opposed to using the exp and cards for winning/not losing the game.

You could also achieve the same result with a BAR or flamethrower with one additional card (contraband/extra ammunition/venturer for BAR or Vicious Blow (2) or Custom Ammunition for either) - and have a more generally useful weapon for the rest of the campaign.

36 minutes ago, Allonym said:

That's numerically impressive, but it's not particularly useful. Killing the Harbinger outright is at best handy and at worst actively harmful, and you're talking about 14 xp over 5 cards and 2 investigators - as opposed to using the exp and cards for winning/not losing the game. 

You could also achieve the same result with a BAR or flamethrower with one additional card (contraband/extra ammunition/venturer for BAR or Vicious Blow (2) or Custom Ammunition for either) - and have a more generally useful weapon for the rest of the campaign.

Yeah but his point is that it worked and it felt cool.

Despite my nature saying otherwise, optimization isn't the only thing to take joy of in the game.

1 hour ago, Allonym said:

That's numerically impressive, but it's not particularly useful. Killing the Harbinger outright is at best handy and at worst actively harmful, and you're talking about 14 xp over 5 cards and 2 investigators - as opposed to using the exp and cards for winning/not losing the game.

You could also achieve the same result with a BAR or flamethrower with one additional card (contraband/extra ammunition/venturer for BAR or Vicious Blow (2) or Custom Ammunition for either) - and have a more generally useful weapon for the rest of the campaign.

Well, it was the second scenario of FA, Mateo had that with 5 exp and Leo with 4 exp, and we didn't know the consequences. Sleight of Hand made Shotgun useful all campaign. Leo eventually had the BAR, too, but it wasn't released yet.

1 hour ago, Jobu said:

Yeah but his point is that it worked and it felt cool.

Despite my nature saying otherwise, optimization isn't the only thing to take joy of in the game.

I certainly can't, and don't, dispute that it's fun to have fun.

6 hours ago, Soakman said:

I just want Kate Winthrop with access to Lightning Gun...

(sits quietly staring into space with a small smile, imagining that)

On 3/8/2019 at 1:37 PM, Soakman said:

I just want Kate Winthrop with access to Lightning Gun... which is never going to happen sadly because they missed the opportunity to Science trait it. I can't see how she would possibly have access unless she's a guardian, but that is highly unlikely.

Pretty sure it would have been Relic-traited, since it's presumably a reference to "The Shadow Out of Time." Either way, it's weird that it's just an ordinary Item/Weapon/Firearm.

2 hours ago, rsdockery said:

Pretty sure it would have been Relic-traited, since it's presumably a reference to "The Shadow Out of Time." Either way, it's weird that it's just an ordinary Item/Weapon/Firearm. 

Imagine Ursula running about, gathering clues and electrifying cultists :D

"Ursula, are you sure you know how to use this th..."

"I found it, and it is mine. Mine i say!"