Just smashed a local event in Missouri...

Like, smashed.

It's 5 T65s...at I2... with unlimited SLAM for damage shuffling.

Seems efficient to me.

EDIT: T70s, not 65s, at 4hull + 3shields

neat

OS-1 Config grants extra Missile slot. Sounds nasty.

A giant bucket of stats... And with */2/4/3 for the defensive side, it's up to a T-70 rather than a T-65!

Anyhow, a lot of this is things I already said in the gunboat thread:

It's a list with a lot of stats, but no way to reposition without shutting off their attack. That doesn't necessarily make them predictable, but there's less they can do outside their normal dial. A long sweeping flee and return has advantages and disadvantages over a K-Turn.

Seems like a list with a high potential of getting outflown, at least for a little while, but the giant pile of stats could be too big over time.

Is it better to do 5 gunboats, or 5 bombers? or 4 of each + jonus? or some other enhancer?

4 minutes ago, Blail Blerg said:

Is it better to do 5 gunboats, or 5 bombers? or 4 of each + jonus? or some other enhancer?

That’s tough. I find them very tough to play against because of that first big engagement.

I think it would be a meta/familiarity call.

I almost took five barrage boats to the Open in Toronto, fearing Rebel swarms and possible Triple Ups. Decided not to as I didn’t get enough time with the list to get enough of a feel for it.

I have been watching the gunboat thread for a bit to see when they would get it, they kept dismissing barrage rockets or try to strap them onto aces instead.

2 minutes ago, LagJanson said:

I almost took five barrage boats to the Open in Toronto, fearing Rebel swarms and possible Triple Ups. Decided not to as I didn’t get enough time with the list to get enough of a feel for it.

I have been watching the gunboat thread for a bit to see when they would get it, they kept dismissing barrage rockets or try to strap them onto aces instead.

In some ways, Gunboats are a trap. They have a lot of tools in the configurations for leveraging their fairly uncommon SLAM and Reload actions. So it's easy to think: the reason I should fly a Gunboat instead of a Bomber is specifically to leverage those actions and configurations. And Barrage Rocket Nus don't do that at all. They say, "Tricks be damned! Raw Efficiency!"

5 barrage gunboats certainly sounds better than 4 barrage k-wings to me. You trade the turret arcs for much greater maneuverability, more bodies, and more green dice. Losing bombs hurts a bit.

Barrage rockets have an awful time against palob, teroch, and seevor though. I'm also not sold on 5 Nus being better than 5Ys. The Nus hit harder at r3, but the Ys have kturns, ion, and turrets.

34 minutes ago, gadwag said:

5 barrage gunboats certainly sounds better than 4 barrage k-wings to me. You trade the turret arcs for much greater maneuverability, more bodies, and more green dice. Losing bombs hurts a bit.

Barrage rockets have an awful time against palob, teroch, and seevor though. I'm also not sold on 5 Nus being better than 5Ys. The Nus hit harder at r3, but the Ys have kturns, ion, and turrets.

What about 6 dorsal Ys?

If I must take five GUNs, I still prefer 5 XG-1 with Ion Cannons and Advanced Slam over the Barrage version.

38 minutes ago, Kharnete said:

If I must take five GUNs, I still prefer 5 XG-1 with Ion Cannons and Advanced Slam over the Barrage version.

Being able to SLAM and shoot (with a token!) is certainly a big advantage. But only having either a 2-dice primary or a capped-at-1-damage Ion is also a disadvantage. Ion Boats are going to do less damage to lower-agility ships than Barrage Boats.

Mobility is huge. X-Wing is a game of dice, dice modification, and positioning. Ion Boats are better at positioning, and that's not nothing. I also think Ion is underrated. But there's something about the raw damage of OS-1 Barrage which becomes tempting as I think about it more.

What about only 4, but you give them all AdSLAM, APTs, and FCS to round them out? Roll up engagement 1 with a focus for Brockets, get a TL next turn, you're set for life

Holy **** this is a really good list.

No, do not bring less than five. Bring those five generics. You are bringing like, thirty five frakking health to the playing field and modifiable 3 attack at range 2-3 attacks with five charges, you lose NOTHING and still attack at 3 dice at the range you can't use Brockets, like.

Oh my god, oh my god this list is extremely very good. It's really fat, it's hard to kill, every single foe is equally a threat, and it's very hard to outmaneuver because if you spread them wide enough and slow enough, you will have as much coverage as you could possibly want.

This is an EXTREMELY good list, probably one of the best Imperial lists out there. Holy CRAP.

It's gonna get stomped by 5Ys, but sure

6 hours ago, Bucknife said:

What about 6 dorsal Ys? 

I think the control from ion turret and/or the extra attacks from VTG are more valuable

Yes but. 5 generic gunboats... or 4 with jonus?

I'm sure everyone's well aware already, but don't forget if you want to fire Barrage Rockets after SLAMing, you need both a Focus token AND a Lock on the target.

Possible (with Advanced SLAM), but not always easy...

16 minutes ago, FTS Gecko said:

I'm sure everyone's well aware already, but don't forget if you want to fire Barrage Rockets after SLAMing, you need both a Focus token AND a Lock on the target.

Possible (with Advanced SLAM), but not always easy...

Ooooohohoho yeah of this I am PAINFULLY aware. Honestly in the playtest I BARELY used SLAM. Mostly for repositioning after the barrage alpha, when I knew I wouldn't have an attack the turn after.

Just not feasible to SLAM with these things and want to use barrage rockets, because you'd need ADV. SLAM, OS-1, and a reliable way to both Focus AND Target Lock.

That's just NOT gonna' happen!

5 hours ago, Captain Lackwit said:

Holy **** this is a really good list.

No, do not bring less than five. Bring those five generics. You are bringing like, thirty five frakking health to the playing field and modifiable 3 attack at range 2-3 attacks with five charges, you lose NOTHING and still attack at 3 dice at the range you can't use Brockets, like.

Oh my god, oh my god this list is extremely very good. It's really fat, it's hard to kill, every single foe is equally a threat, and it's very hard to outmaneuver because if you spread them wide enough and slow enough, you will have as much coverage as you could possibly want.

This is an EXTREMELY good list, probably one of the best Imperial lists out there. Holy CRAP.

Lol. Calm down.

It's not that good. It's 1 more HP per ship than 5 Cartel Marauders, but requires focus tokens to have the same attacking output and can't ever get 4 red dice at range 1.

And no one is using Cartel Marauders.

Yes, SLAM is good for disengaging in a way the Kihraxz can't, but the Khiraxz doesn't need to spend its action just to shoot 3 dice, and the Kihraxz has a better dial. The fact that it can k-turn and tallon roll means it can turn around and shoot in the same turn. The Gunboat can't do that. The Gunboat also can't shoot with 3 dice if it's stressed. The Kihraxz can and has better blues to shed that stress.

And getting five ships to focus fire is not easy. Getting five ships to focus on one or two enemy ships with all of them getting an action is even harder. If any of those Gunboats bump or go over an obstacle, they don't get their 3 dice attack. The Kihraxz doesn't care.

The SLAM is the big differential for the Gunboat, no doubt. I would say it's enough to make them better than 5 Cartel Marauders, but it's something that only a good player can exploit. Especially as any bumps also block the SLAM.

This is not an OP, autowin net list. I would say an average or worse player would have a terrible time trying to leverage the strengths of 5 BR Gunboats, because any bad maneuvers and it all falls apart.

29 minutes ago, GuacCousteau said:

...and no one is using Cartel Marauders.

*ahem*

10 hours ago, Blail Blerg said:

Yes but. 5 generic gunboats... or 4 with jonus?

Jonus implies some amount of formation flying. One strength with the 5 is being able to approach independently, then converge.

6 hours ago, FTS Gecko said:

*ahem*

Yeah, what he said.

Funny thing. I took the FCM to a 17 person Q1 kit tournament this last weekend. I finished in 4th, going 3-1 with 988 MoV. The third place finisher? He took 5 Ion Gunboats and went 3-1 with 1022 MoV.

I was hoping to play him but, alas, it was not in the cards....this time.

Ah,

Is this why the price for the gunboat has been skyrocketing everywhere?

4 hours ago, pyoinator said:

Ah,

Is this why the price for the gunboat has been skyrocketing everywhere?

No, that's just because everyone loves Gunboats.

And we don't know how long it'll be before they see a 2nd Edition release.

1 hour ago, FTS Gecko said:

No, that's just because everyone loves Gunboats.

And we don't know how long it'll be before they see a 2nd Edition release.

It’s certainly a contributing factor. A lot of Imperial players I know are turned off by the squishiness and unwieldyness of the strikers and looking to gunboats as an alternative.

An important consideration for the gunboats over Khiraxes is while the don’t get 4 dice at range 1, they also don’t give range bonuses at 3 and are obviously much better at blocking. Also 7 health vs 6 seems to often be the difference between whether a ship survives an alpha strike to fire back.