Multiple Ride Them Downs

By Cloudless, in Rules questions & answers

Example: I succesfully quested for 5 and now I play two copies of Ride Them Down. Can I now assign 5 damage twice or not?

Kuvahaun tulos haulle lotr lcg ride them down

I would say that if you choose the same enemy for both events you apply the progress-damage twice, but as separate instances (if this is somehow relevant).

Edited by Alonewolf87

I'd say there's no point to playing two copies, since it alters the way progress is placed -- it doesn't magically multiply that progress. And it is played *before* you quest successfully, not after. It would go something like this:

After staging you see that you are *going* to quest successfully, and would place 5 progress on the current quest without playing this card. You play this card and choose a non-unique enemy in staging with 4 hp remaining. Then you resolve the quest -- 4 progress becomes 4 damage on that enemy, causing it to be destroyed. The fifth progress that would have been placed on the current quest is lost.

If there's a second enemy, you can't play a second copy to capture that lost progress -- there's no action window, and after playing the first copy you've ensured that no progress will be placed on the current quest to be redirected.

53 minutes ago, dalestephenson said:

After staging you see that you are *going* to quest successfully, and would place 5 progress on the current quest without playing this card. You play this card and choose a non-unique enemy in staging with 4 hp remaining. The  n you resolve the quest  -- 4 progress becomes 4 damage on that enemy, causing it to be destroyed. The fifth progress that would have been placed on the current quest is lost.

If there's a second enemy, you can't play a second copy to capture that lost progress --

I think the idea was more to play both the copies before quest resolution.

2 hours ago, dalestephenson said:

I'd say there's no point to playing two copies, since it alters the way progress is placed -- it doesn't magically multiply that progress. And it is played *before* you quest successfully, not after. It would go something like this:

After staging you see that you are *going* to quest successfully, and would place 5 progress on the current quest without playing this card. You play this card and choose a non-unique enemy in staging with 4 hp remaining. Then you resolve the quest -- 4 progress becomes 4 damage on that enemy, causing it to be destroyed. The fifth progress that would have been placed on the current quest is lost.

If there's a second enemy, you can't play a second copy to capture that lost progress -- there's no action window, and after playing the first copy you've ensured that no progress will be placed on the current quest to be redirected.

I guess this makes sense. The rule of thumb in lotr: If you are not sure about the rules, they will always be against you >:D

Thanks for your help!

5 hours ago, Alonewolf87 said:

I think the idea was more to play both the copies before quest resolution.

The problem is that both copies do the same thing -- redirect *all* the progress that would otherwise be placed on the current quest. As the first play is causing all progress to be redirected to enemy A, there is no remaining progress that will be placed on the current quest for the second copy to redirect. The card doesn't redirect from enemy A to enemy B.

11 minutes ago, dalestephenson said:

The problem is that both copies do the same thing -- redirect *all* the progress that would otherwise be placed on the current quest. As the first play is causing all progress to be redirected to enemy A, there is no remaining progress that will be placed on the current quest for the second copy to redirect. The card doesn't redirect from enemy A to enemy B.

My idea was more to target twice the same enemy A with both copies of Ride Them Down, but I can see how there are problem with that interpretation too.

I agree with @dalestephenson that two copies won't work to ding two enemies.

If you did play two for some reason, targeting enemy A, then B, the one that resolves is B's: they are both replacement effects (note the "instead") with the same trigger, so the RR entry on these applies. It specifies that the most recent of the effects is the one that is used for resolution. To wit:

Quote

If multiple replacement effects are initiated against the same triggering condition, the most recent replacement effect is the one that is used for the resolution of the triggering condition.

The A copy thus automatically whiffs: the progress placement has already been replaced and cannot be replaced again.

Similarly, if you targeted enemy A twice, only one copy (the later one, technically) can resolve.

Edited by sappidus

If the card said 'deal X damage to an enemy, where X is the number of progress would be placed on the quest,' you could play multiple copies, as there would be multiple instances of 'deal X damage.' With the way it is actually written, there is no instance of 'deal X damage.' Instead, playing multiple copies would twice queue up the effect 'assign progress as damage instead.' Since game allows you to place progress only once per question resolution, this effectively does nothing.