Here's what's written on yesterdays article about points change :

Quote

• First and foremost, we overhauled upgrade cards which increase in value based on initiative, like Advanced Sensors and Supernatural Reflexes. These upgrades will now scale up in cost according to initiative.

As we know, mistakes or unconsistencies (sometimes big ones, like the old K-wing article^^) are not uncommon between articles and the "real stuff".

But I wonder, is this one an omission on the points list, or did the article writer assume Adv. Sensors would be Initiative scaled, because its mechanic is so close SR ?
In other words, will the points list be errated quickly to add this initiative scaling to AS? Because it really makes sense, and that would be nice for some ships.

I'm curious about this as well. Right now, according to the official app, Advanced Sensors costs 10 points, regardless of the initiative of the ship that's being equipped with it. This isn't in line with what was stated on the article. It'd be great to have confirmation from an official FFG source.

(Personally, I'm hoping that Advanced Sensors scales with Initiative, just like Supernatural Reflexes.)

Iiiiiiintersting!

And the "spot the mistake in an FFG article" award goes to...

I can see it going either way. It could be that the article was written before Tripsilons came along and they decided at the last minute to just give Sensors a flat cost of 10pts to avoid buffing the Ups.

1 minute ago, TheCeilican said:

I can see it going either way. It could be that the article was written before Tripsilons came along and they decided at the last minute to just give Sensors a flat cost of 10pts to avoid buffing the Ups.

I thought all Tripsilon lists ran Collision Detector, since they need to fly forward and joust as soon as possible…

1 hour ago, TheCeilican said:

I can see it going either way. It could be that the article was written before Tripsilons came along and they decided at the last minute to just give Sensors a flat cost of 10pts to avoid buffing the Ups.

I'm cool with this.

32 minutes ago, Captain Lackwit said:

I'm cool with this.

That's easy to fix.

Up the ups.

I like Adv. Sen. And hope it does get initiative scaled eventually.

36 minutes ago, Scum4Life said:

That's easy to fix.

Up the ups.

I like Adv. Sen. And hope it does get initiative scaled eventually.

No.

Triple Upsilons are considered a problem because of the way they mutually support each other. It's a 'sum of its parts' kind of thing. If you increase its cost, you'll not only kill that combo, but you'll remove single Upsilons from more balanced squads.

Hyperspace Tracking is the thing that makes Tripsilon not behave like a normal list.

Article mistake. Probably meant to say primed thrusters.

Though, as could well benefit from init scaling. A lot of things could. All TL ordnance for instance.

The addition of initiative based scaling is one of the most exciting parts of the points adjustments to me. I hope Advanced Sensors gets scaled pricing eventually. It definitely deserves it. Although, as a huge B-wing fan, I'm probably not impartial here.

Overall, I'm just super hyped by the points adjustments overall.

Guessing they had scaled it at one point then realized it wasn’t quite as big a deal as they thought when it’s locked in to one action. No link possibilities or other shenanigans like SNR.

That, and the last thing trip shuttles need is help with anything cheaper.

Once tracking is shut down, then they’ll behave normally. Or maybe just up the cost of Dormitz so they can’t blitzkrieg two Ups at you right away turn 1. That is the other linchpin to the list being bonkers beyond the tracking data. You can fly trip Ups, as long as one isn’t Dormitz. Or just up the Hyperspace tracking to prevent 3x copies plus 3x Upsilons.

I'd say article mistake.

Let's recall: variable pricing by Initiative doesn't just make things more expensive at higher Initiative, it makes things cheaper at lower initiative.

Primed Thrusters don't add too much power to lower-init things. It's a nice tool, nothing too potent.

However, a lot of low-initiative ships would be massively buffed by a cheaper Advanced Sensors, such as Lambdas and U-Wings, 4-LOM, and the now-ubiquitous Upsilon. Advanced Sensors doesn't need to be cheaper at lower Init levels in order to be good. It does hurt B-Wings a bit, to have this classic build for them become more expensive, but grand scheme, this seems correct.

//

This is somewhat contradicted by Supernatural Reflexes being 4 points on any initiative 0-2 ships with force talents, but currently none of those exist, and they don't show up in previews. However, SNR is a lot less flexible than Advanced Sensors, since it is only movement actions. Meanwhile, 8 points instead of 12 on an Init 3 ship probably doesn't really cause a problem. I bet flying a few generic Inquisitors would be a lot of fun.

8 minutes ago, gamblertuba said:

The addition of initiative based scaling is one of the most exciting parts of the points adjustments to me. I hope Advanced Sensors gets scaled pricing eventually. It definitely deserves it. Although, as a huge B-wing fan, I'm probably not impartial here.

Overall, I'm just super hyped by the points adjustments overall.

What about scaling by base size? 6 small, 8 medium, 10 large? There's something scary about initiative scaling, IMHO. Lambda and Upsilon Shuttles are very good ships which would get a lot better with cheaper Advanced Sensors, and being lower-initiative doesn't make their pre-move actions worse.

There'd be downsides, such as a cheaper AdvS for Quickdraw. I think that's probably better than a 5-point AdvS on an Omicron Group Pilot.

I don't think Advanced Sensors should ever be cheaper than 8 points. Unblockable actions should be a premium. I would raise the price on high initiative more then lower it for the other end.

2 minutes ago, gamblertuba said:

I don't think Advanced Sensors should ever be cheaper than 8 points. Unblockable actions should be a premium. I would raise the price on high initiative more then lower it for the other end.

Sure thing; but I don't think FFG is opened to change the price gap between aces and low-init on all ships anytime soon.

56 minutes ago, ScummyRebel said:

Guessing they had scaled it at one point then realized it wasn’t quite as big a deal as they thought when it’s locked in to one action. No link possibilities or other shenanigans like SNR.

That, and the last thing trip shuttles need is help with anything cheaper.

I disagree. While Advanced Sensors is, indeed less powerful than SNR (in that it doesn't allow more than one action), it still scales incredibly well with Initiative. Specifically, higher initiative arc-dodgers are weak to being blocked, and AS covers this weakness perfectly.

It just seems wrong for Advanced Sensors to cost the same on an Initiative 2 B-Wing than on an Initiative 5 Corran (for example). The value that Corran gets off that upgrade is several orders of magnitude higher.

As for the Shuttles, I'm not sure they want Advanced Sensors. I'm fairly certain that their sensor upgrade of choice is Collision Detector, as they need to fly forward as quickly as possible to engage.

I am really hoping the article was right this time and Advanced Sensors gets bumped down to 9 points or less at Init 2. I want my 4x B-Wing + Adv. Sensors back.

I hope the score sheet is wrong but I doubt it.

AS is still useful at low PS for blocking and advanced maneuvering.

Assuming it follows SN pattert of being cheaper at i4 / more expensive at i5 it would be costed something like 3/3/3/6/12/18.

4x Black Sun Enforcer/AS would be nuts, as would 4x AS Selfless Bwing

Somebody at PAX got 9th with Ten / Braylen / Blue AS / Blue AS and that list has already dropped 5pts (incl AS going up) , imagine if it dropped 14 more,

Don't get me wrong I would love the Bwing meta I just don't think its gonna happen.

15 minutes ago, joeshmoe554 said:

I am really hoping the article was right this time and Advanced Sensors gets bumped down to 9 points or less at Init 2. I want my 4x B-Wing + Adv. Sensors back.

Yeah! I took 3rd at a tourney with this list. Its a hoot. You can still run it you just have to throw one of the named in :-/

4 minutes ago, prauxim said:

I hope the score sheet is wrong but I doubt it.

AS is still useful at low PS for blocking and advanced maneuvering.

Assuming it follows AS patter of being cheaper at i4 and more expensive at i5 it would be costed something like 3/3/3/6/12/18.

4x Black Sun Enforcer/AS would be nuts, as would 4x AS Selfless Bwing

Somebody at PAX got 9th with Ten / Braylen / Blue AS / Blue AS and that list has already dropped 5pts (incl AS going up) , imagine if it dropped 14 more,

Don't get me wrong I would love the Bwing meta I just don't think its gonna happen.

Yeah! I took 3rd at a tourney with this list. Its a hoot. You can still run it you just have to throw one of the named in :-/

I mean, they have free jamming beams now. B-Wings OP!

Advanced Sensors is a weird card, in that its uses change as Init values increase, but don't necessarily get much better as Init values increase. Just for example, you're more likely to find it useful for a low-Init pilot stuck in a scrum to stay in place (but still get actions) than you are a high-Init pilot. They could have reasonably scaled Advanced Sensors up a tiny bit at the high end of Init (perfect knowledge pre-positioning is really good), but it would have been a mistake to scale it down lower than 8 going the other way. I suspect, if they considered scaling it, they just decided the difference wasn't worth the complexity.

I think the article just meant Primed Thrusters.

While they were doing Init-scaling, though, did they miss Juke, which tends to be significantly better at high-Init? (Although, of course, there's the counter-argument of massed Jukes, which are obviously also really good.)

1 minute ago, MasterShake2 said:

I mean, they have free jamming beams now. B-Wings OP!

I mean, I think Tavson will be common, as will Ups in general, and you definitely spread the Jam onto double modded 4-5 die

7 hours ago, Wickercrow said:

I thought all Tripsilon lists ran Collision Detector, since they need to fly forward and joust as soon as possible…

Adv Sensors achieves most of the same thing, especially with debris obstacles, and makes your post-blitz game much better as you can self-bump with unstoppable actions.

Either works but the guys who I trust, and who flew it successfully at Outrider, are firmly in the camp that Sensors is the superior version.

1 hour ago, TheCeilican said:

Adv  Sensors achieves most of the same  thing, especially with debris obstacles, and makes your post-blitz game muc  h better as you can self-bump with unstoppable actions. 

Agreed that it makes your rounds 2+ better. BUT! And this is a big but! If gives your opponent effective counterplay. There's rock deployment that can be used to blunt the alpha and create safe spaces.

Essentially without collision detector, your opponent can blunt your alpha by just taking big rocks. Because triple upsilons depend so much on the alpha, CD takes priority.