9 minutes ago, viedit said:

My takeaway from the Hyperspace Qualifier yesterday.

Two lists went 6-0 in hyperspace.

Of those two lists, there were 7 ships. 5 of those ships were the same chassis.

Both lists had the same unique pilot.

All five of the ships of similar chassis had the same tech upgrade.

What were those ships?

2 x Dormitz

3 x Starbase Killer

5 x Hyperspace Tracking.

Houston, we got a problem.

As much as I hate to admit it, if I wanted to win dominantly and swiftly (so as to have rest in-between matches) during a full day tournament, I'm running this list hands down. I ran three YV-666 for the better part of 2 years so I can see the matrix with these ships easy.

Today will be a huge telling point on whether FFG is in tune and timely with their game, or if they are completely disconnected. I'd like to hope they set today as the date to get the data from Phoenix SO and the NZ Nationals that just ran to ensure they're in step. If they flub this, there could be further exodus of players from the 2.0 transition attrition, and I really don't want that because I love the game.

They need to get this right, the first time.

I think Tripups is strong, very strong but I dont think its as oppressive as people are making it out to be. The main thing is its a 1st turn alpha strike but there is counter play. I think its so incredibly dominant because people have not learned the counter play its a jack in the box list. If you dont know its trick and have never seen it, it will mess you up bad.

Set up on the back edge with your base touching the back board edge and roughly 1/3 in and facing towards the other 2/3 of the board. At that point he will line up on you and if you can force a at worst a 50/50 choice. If you go 4 or 5 straight if you have it and boost if he is not banking you get out of his range so he cant shoot you on turn one. Or you can slow roll and do a 1 or 2 straight and if he banks you doge him that way. The other option is to break up your deployment by splitting your forces in the extreme corners with your Ace doing the mid run trick.

The main trick to beating this is dodging or only letting one of the lead Ups hammer your ships. After the 1st turn he bleeds out all his green tokens and the list is never as nasty. Also then you can play the maneuver game. Also rock/debris placement is huge. You want to try and force him to bleed his collison detectors early so they become a problem quickly for him, or alternatively get as many as you can closer to your side and hide behind them for the 1st turn so you can at least net a extra green die out of it. All that being said, its still very strong. I think its still a little early to nerf it into the ground.

I have played several other miniature games and I have seen other Jack in the Box lists that when they 1st hit are completely dominant in the tournament scene for a few months and the suddenly disappear because people learned how to play against them and suddenly they were beatable with no changes or adjustments to the game.

Just like my above post about the 4 Juke Phantom list, its strong and people are crying for it to be nerfed, and I honestly wonder is it that good? its seeing play at the top tables because its good and efficient but its not dominating the top tables so that means its probably not overpowered. Honestly I think they might want to hold off on nerfing and maybe buff a few things that are absent from the meta and open up new doors. What is just not being seen at all, make that stuff cheaper and that will open some doors for other things to happen.

Are you guys really debating the OP nature of a squad of shuttles that cannot change direction?

What was everyone drinking this weekend?

I want some.

Yes, if your not ready for it and follow standard deployment paradigms for Xwing even if you some how DO NOT move from your starting position it will have 2 Upsilons shooting things that they have locked and with focus at range 3, if you moved forward which is pretty likely it will be range 2, and if you pushed a 4+ straight your eating range 1 shots. Putting 8 to 10 double modded red dice into something generally gets blood in the water. You man not get a kill on some of the heavier stuff like a Falcon or Firespray but it will be starting the game already mauled pretty badly.

Trip ups is strong, mainly because it requires radical departures from standard deployment procedures to not get seriously mauled on round 1. If you can dodge / mitigate that the list becomes a tough matchup that requires some good flying to beat.

22 hours ago, Da_Brown_Bomber said:

Based on how dash steamrolled through the field to win nz nats this weekend it really needs some attention.

Obligatory reminder NZ nats was a 37 person tournament (though I too want Dash dead)

2 hours ago, clanofwolves said:

Are you guys really debating the OP nature of a squad of shuttles that cannot change direction?

What was everyone drinking this weekend?

I want some.

It has white two hards, and white 3 banks. They can split directions after the initial joust and make it hard to avoid completely afterwards.

It’s not the Lambda, with only red hards. This thing can actually get turned around and reengage. And properly flown make getting behind all three very hard.

And any solution which means that ships without 5 straight boost are unviable is not a solution I am looking for @Endureil . Your answer basically invalidates Lambdas, Ywings, TIE/ln, Z-95, Bombers, U-wings, and on and on and on.

Sorry, not a good answer.

9 minutes ago, millertime059 said:

It has white two hards, and white 3 banks. They can split directions after the initial joust and make it hard to avoid completely afterwards.

It’s not the Lambda, with only red hards. This thing can actually get turned around and reengage. And properly flown make getting behind all three very hard.

And any solution which means that ships without 5 straight boost are unviable is not a solution I am looking for @Endureil . Your answer basically invalidates Lambdas, Ywings, TIE/ln, Z-95, Bombers, U-wings, and on and on and on.

Sorry, not a good answer.

Ok, yeah.... but you didn't answer my question, what was everybody drinking this weekend?

1 minute ago, clanofwolves said:

Ok, yeah.... but you didn't answer my question, what was everybody drinking this weekend?

Deschutes Black Butte Porter while fighting this list to a draw and then dumpstering everything else in 40 minutes or less at my store tournament this weekend, en route to second place and highest MOV on the day.

Stongbow myself.

So could FFG not re-cost Hyperspace Tracking such that:

1. First card on the table is normal cost
2. Second card on the table is a lot more
3. Third card on the table is stupid expensive

8 minutes ago, XPav said:

So could FFG not re-cost Hyperspace Tracking such that:

1. First card on the table is normal cost
2. Second card on the table is a lot more
3. Third card on the table is stupid expensive

Make costs geometric. Each costs 2^x where x is the number of copies in the list.

One? Two points. Two? Four points each. Three? 8 points each, and now you can’t run any upgrades but this on your list on points.

6 minutes ago, XPav said:

So could FFG not re-cost Hyperspace Tracking such that:

1. First card on the table is normal cost
2. Second card on the table is a lot more
3. Third card on the table is stupid expensive

This.... is an interesting concept. Applied to Protorps, Juke, Trick Shot, etc I wouldn't even mind if it was just ONE ship that had them in a list at current costs.

9 minutes ago, XPav said:

So could FFG not re-cost Hyperspace Tracking such that:

1. First card on the table is normal cost
2. Second card on the table is a lot more
3. Third card on the table is stupid expensive

Make it 6 points.

Make it unique.

Ban hyperspace tracking from the unironic Hyperspace format.

The only reason why I didn't say "make it unique" was that it would really require a card reprint/errata for the "dot".

1 hour ago, Elavion said:

Obligatory reminder NZ nats was a 37 person tournament (though I too want Dash dead)

true. top archetypes had trouble dealing with it. its quite degenerate.

30 minutes ago, XPav said:

The only reason why I didn't say "make it unique" was that it would really require a card reprint/errata for the "dot".

FAQ: Take a bottle of paper correction fluid. Place a white dot in front of this cards name. Wait for it to dry. Place it back in its sleeve.

3 of my 6 rounds on the 1st day were vs fel/whisper/kagi.

2 hours ago, millertime059 said:

Deschutes Black Butte Porter while fighting this list to a draw and then dumpstering everything else in 40 minutes or less at my store tournament this weekend, en route to second place and highest MOV on the day.

Porter. That’s all you needed to say. You are now my hero.