1 hour ago, Lace Jetstreamer said:

The hyperspace format is designed to incentivize the sale of new faction ships to veteren x-wing players by banning 90% of "old" 2.0 content. All the regional and national events will be in this format. Its clear FFG is pushing this format over all other formats.

Basically, hyperspace format is a money grab format.

People will falsly claim this format is better for new players and better for balance. They are wrong and suffer from cognitive dissonance. The reality is, a scum, rebel, and empire conversion kit is by far the best value for money. Its litteraly a faction in a box. I would 100% recommend a new player to buy a core and 1 faction in a box if it were not for hyperspace. Why? Because it gives a new players ALL of the cards they need (except for 0-0-0, hate, etc bc FFG lied). A new player doesnt need to decide which ships they need to buy for which upgrade, they just get them all (except for the ones FFG lied about).

As for balance, FFG created an app and designed the game to be balanced. They have the means to balance the game but right now CHOOSE NOT TO. They will only balance the game twice a year. This has nothing to do with the formats. The reality is this gaming is hermoganing players and FFG must see this as a money loser. So they created a format that forces existing players to buy into the new faction ships to milk as much money out of the die hards before this game finially dies.

you can ignore this man.

1 hour ago, Lace Jetstreamer said:

The hyperspace format is designed to incentivize the sale of new faction ships to veteren x-wing players by banning 90% of "old" 2.0 content. All the regional and national events will be in this format. Its clear FFG is pushing this format over all other formats.

Basically, hyperspace format is a money grab format.

People will falsly claim this format is better for new players and better for balance. They are wrong and suffer from cognitive dissonance. The reality is, a scum, rebel, and empire conversion kit is by far the best value for money. Its litteraly a faction in a box. I would 100% recommend a new player to buy a core and 1 faction in a box if it were not for hyperspace. Why? Because it gives a new players ALL of the cards they need (except for 0-0-0, hate, etc bc FFG lied). A new player doesnt need to decide which ships they need to buy for which upgrade, they just get them all (except for the ones FFG lied about).

As for balance, FFG created an app and designed the game to be balanced. They have the means to balance the game but right now CHOOSE NOT TO. They will only balance the game twice a year. This has nothing to do with the formats. The reality is this gaming is hermoganing players and FFG must see this as a money loser. So they created a format that forces existing players to buy into the new faction ships to milk as much money out of the die hards before this game finially dies.

The salt is strong with this one...

1 hour ago, Lace Jetstreamer said:

So they created a format that forces existing players to buy into the new faction ships to milk as much money out of the die hards before this game finially dies.

Out of curiosity, how does Hyperspace force players to buy the new factions? Every faction has playable ships in Hyperspace, and apart from the Resistance A-Wing and a couple of Scum options, all of them are available in the conversion kits.

show me where FFG hurt you?

it's a game people. do what you want.

4 minutes ago, Wiredin said:

show me where FFG hurt you?

...

According to many players on this forum this was where it hurt

25 minutes ago, JJ48 said:

Also, I would expect the Rebel Falcon to be pretty high up on the list for Rebel releases.

I'm thinking Wave 4. Though there are still quite a few out there in the online shops.

2 hours ago, GreenDragoon said:

He won't engage. I don't understand why his account hasn't been banned yet. And I wonder which alt account he uses.

My money's on @Lace Jetstreamer

13 minutes ago, Marinealver said:

According to many players on this forum this was where it hurt

you are not wrong. lol

for me it was TLT/acc cor/ghost

12 minutes ago, Mattman7306 said:

My money's on @Lace Jetstreamer

Rexler's reaction says he agrees.

2 hours ago, Dwing said:

All this "taken" care of new players by allowing fewer ships, falls a bit flat, I would think most players that played 1.0 for years would be able to beat new players anyways.

Heh. Hey, newbies! do you want to get stomped in Extended or stomped in Hyperspace?

The only argument I've thought was cogent was that getting beat by ships they don't have would feel like rubbing it in.

17 minutes ago, Koing907 said:

Heh. Hey, newbies! do you want to get stomped in Extended or stomped in Hyperspace?

The only argument I've thought was cogent was that getting beat by ships they don't have would feel like rubbing it in.

It's not that Hyperspace will put a brand new player on the same level as a vet. Rather, a smaller card pool makes the game more accessible to newbies. Would a new player rather try to remember hundreds of different ships and upgrades while preparing, or dozens? Personally speaking, when someone asks me my opinion about Pilot X with Upgrade Y, I still usually have to ask what abilities they have, and I've been playing for a couple years now.

Many, almost all, collectible games eventually get formats. Formats for collectible/trading games is inevitable.

Yu-Gi-Oh has formats. Pokemon has formats. Warhammer , Sigmar and 40k, both have formats. Magic , the King of games whether we like it or not, has more formats than anybody has time to bother figuring out. Destiny for crying out loud has formats now. AMERICAN FOOTBALL HAS FLAG, TACKLE, AND ARENA FORMATS.

X-wing had two official competitive formats in first ed; standard and epic. Had some casual variations of them both. There were also casual formats like the official scenario missions. And the unofficial casual like Heroes of the Arturi Cluster.

Second edition enjoys three endorsed/official formats right now: 200/3 Extended, 200/3 Hyperspace which is their official competitive format, and Quick Build as their casual option. At some point we will see the reintroduction of the Epic formats to round it out.

And that's the way it should be. Formatting allows multiple points of entry to a game, especially for new players. As old vets we should embrace this. Otherwise we look like freaking toddlers throwing tantrums because we can't use every plastic toy in the box, and not like the competitive gentlepeople willing to challenge and accept challenge on a level field that we should be.

Formats were inevitable. It's for the health of the game, and the community. And I welcome any challenger in Hyperspace.

😁 😙 😋

16 minutes ago, ForceSensitive said:

AMERICAN FOOTBALL HAS FLAG, TACKLE, AND ARENA FORMATS.

You forgot "touch"...

What are the points and differences in points and where get this info?

1 hour ago, JJ48 said:

It's not that Hyperspace will put a brand new player on the same level as a vet. Rather, a smaller card pool makes the game more accessible to newbies. Would a new player rather try to remember hundreds of different ships and upgrades while preparing, or dozens? Personally speaking, when someone asks me my opinion about Pilot X with Upgrade Y, I still usually have to ask what abilities they have, and I've been playing for a couple years now.

In that case, maybe Hyperspace would be better as an X-Wing introductory format. Call it Academy. New players are eventually going to have to deal with game bloat, the same way we all did.

6 minutes ago, Koing907 said:

In that case, maybe Hyperspace would be better as an X-Wing introductory format. Call it Academy. New players are eventually going to have to deal with game bloat, the same way we all did.

...you realize that I was explaining ONE aspect of it, and not giving a comprehensive list of every single argument in its favor, right?

9 minutes ago, JJ48 said:

...you realize that I was explaining ONE aspect of it, and not giving a comprehensive list of every single argument in its favor, right?

You do realize my reply wasn't meant to address every argument, right?

Wow this thread has potential. Lol.

I personally like Hyperspace because I think it's a lot easier moving forward to balance a smaller pool competitively.

Casually do what you want anyway, nobody's forcing you to go to tournaments. This way new people don't feel like they have to go track down 1.0 stuff and conversions on eBay just to play the game.

34 minutes ago, Koing907 said:

You do realize my reply wasn't meant to address every argument, right?

Indeed. Not only did it not address every argument, it seemed to actively ignore the fact that there even were other arguments.

What I objected to was that you took the idea that Hyperspace is more accessible to newer players, and drew the conclusion that Hyperspace is only for newer players, who are intended to someday grow beyond Hyperspace, because it's only "introductory". This actively ignores the fact that accessibility is only one reason for Hyperspace, and not even necessarily the primary one.

28 minutes ago, Kieransi said:

Casually do what you want anyway, nobody's forcing you to go to tournaments  .   This way new people don't feel like they have to go track down 1.0 stuff and conversions on eBay just to play the game.

This is a lazy, dismissive argument that misses the point/problem that divided play structures can bring.

"Casually do what you want anyway, nobody's forcing you to go to tournaments  .   This way new people can play with their full collections at OP Events while you play with your own limited format at local stores with new players." <-- this is also lazy

****, I remember in 1E when people wanted ban lists, and people were using that same **** argument, "do whatever you want at your own table" to dismiss the idea of FFG limiting cards at official events. It sucked then, it still sucks now.

It misses the point that players do not exist in a vacuum and that what FFG does will affect all players that are not home-game-only players. If you are part of you local X-Wing community, going to local game stores, attending events, etc., what FFG OP does will be reflected in the decisions the other players in your area make, and as this is a 2-player game, you need that other player to buy-in to what you want to do.

And most everyone is going to point to whatever FFG decides is The Standard as to what to do. If you do not go with this, you will be left out. Or sitting at home playing with yourself

Now, limited formats certainly have their place at official tournaments, but not as The Standard, imo. I've said before that Privateer Press does well with their format structures and using a limited format (Champions) for some, but not all, events. FFG should borrow from their experience when trying this new structure. That does mean that they need to focus balance passes on Extended to keep the game healthy, and use Hyperspace to change up the meta for some events to challenge old players to get out of their comfort zone and to allow new players to compete with limited ships at some events.

53 minutes ago, Kieransi said:

Casually do what you want anyway, nobody's forcing you to go to tournaments.

I disagree!

Also, why is AstroTurf always green? It’s artificial anyway so why not other colours? Blue? Red? How about watching a baseball game on pink AstroTurf? I demand more colours!

Would the outcry be any different if there was no conversions to begin with?

Oh yea. That dumpster fire is still smoldering i forgot.

Yeah, the notion of it being "divided" is why I think conversion kits were a mistake.

It's impossible to fully balance a game where one faction has 20+ ships and another has 4. 1.0 got far to big to be balanced competitively.

I just find this hilarious. Our local group has people playing both. The newbies getting in are flying rerelease only and doing very well. They like the challenge of going at extended. We are just enjoying the game. We alternate formats at local tournaments. It's a great little community because we just wanna roll dice and push ships around. Format shmormat

Truth is... Boba Fenn escape craft is good in any format.

Trip x is good in any format

Oh no my punnishers and phantoms!

Go with the flow. Enjoy yourself.

6 hours ago, Marinealver said:

Currently the format has been heavily truncated for diversity ( ) with all factions on average having only 4 playable ships.

1

I just want to jump on this little statement here, because yes, limiting the number of ships per faction will absolutely increase diversity.

I guarantee you that every Extended tournament for at least the next few years (and quite possibly forever) will not be very diverse affairs, and will be dominated by the original three factions. Resistance, First Order, Republic and Separatists will be footnotes at best, simply because they will not have the options to adjust to however the meta shifts.

Hyperspace will bring all seven factions back to a more-or-less level playing field, allowing more factions to see competitive success. It won't be perfect, of course (no game with multiple factions ever is), but it will lead to a more even split amongst all seven factions than we'll likely ever get in Extended.