I apologize if this is a silly question, but I think I need some specifics on how the Wargear quality works on equipment

Is it really just a flat "any strife your actions inflict on someone else while wearing a piece of Wargear is increased by 1" or am I missing something? It seems from the flavor text like the intention is to be a drawback saying "yo don't wear this during a social encounter" but the effect actually seems fairly positive for both combat and social encounters (other than maybe losing a lil glory for walking into a fancy Crane party in full stompy suit).

Am I missing something here?

37 minutes ago, drbraininajar said:

I apologize if this is a silly question, but I think I need some specifics on how the Wargear quality works on equipment

Is it really just a flat "any strife your actions inflict on someone else while wearing a piece of Wargear is increased by 1" or am I missing something? It seems from the flavor text like the intention is to be a drawback saying "yo don't wear this during a social encounter" but the effect actually seems fairly positive for both combat and social encounters (other than maybe losing a lil glory for walking into a fancy Crane party in full stompy suit).

Am I missing something here?

the Cranes won't let you enter their party in wargear.

Oh they will...but only so they can laugh at you behind your back all night.

Doesn't really answer my question though

40 minutes ago, drbraininajar said:

Oh they will...but only so they can laugh at you behind your back all night.

Doesn't really answer my question though

to answer your question, yes, if you try to convince someone using fire stance to throw strife at them and you are wielding a tetsubo, they will get +1 strife.

edit: and no, the Crane won't let you come to their party wielding a Tetsubo just to laugh at you, they will downright won't let you enter.

1 hour ago, Avatar111 said:

edit: and no, the Crane won't let you come to their party wielding a Tetsubo just to laugh at you, they will downright won't let you enter.

They'll most likely won't even let you walk around in war gear, so you won't get to try to get into the party. Social standards matter in Rokugan. If you walk around wearing or carrying wargear you're announcing you consider yourself to be in a potentially violent situation. Unless there actually is a good reason for this (like being near the Wall) doing so is either a dire insult or a threat, and will probably be interpreted as both. There will be consequences, and unless you have enough status to get away with insulting or threatening the local lord and magistrates those consequences will be harsh.

well yeah I understand the narrative reason you wouldn't wear it to a court function, and would enforce such in my games. (though I could see the Lion, for example, allowing a general to wear their Ceremonial lacquered armor to something hosted in a Lion castle)

But that wasn't really the point. I think I just fell prey to a little ludonarrative disco biscuits since the mechanical effect of Wargear doesn't really reinforce the flavor, since it's an entirely different game mechanism (honor/glory) that supports the "don't wear this off the battlefield" part, and if the strife increase IS supposed to be a mechanical hook for its unsettling nature in the wrong context, it seemed odd to me that the effects of it would also apply in its appropriate context (ie: a battle situation)

I've got my answer, though. In a shocking turn of events, the game rule does exactly what it says on the tin. I think I just got a mental gear stuck on the idea that the mechanic doesn't really sell the intended outcome to me, and I knew there had been some post-print clarification on other such things so I was just checking.

Also, you're right, the Crane wouldn't let you into their fancy party wearing your spiffy lacquered armor just to get you to make an embarrassing faux pas. Now the Scorpion on the other hand..........

Excuse me going on about this, but it's a bit of a pet peeve I have with this topic (that I see popping up every few months).

15 minutes ago, drbraininajar said:

1) well yeah I understand the narrative reason you wouldn't wear it to a court function, and would enforce such in my games. (though I could see the Lion, for example, allowing a general to wear their Ceremonial lacquered armor to something hosted in a Lion castle)

...

2) Also, you're right, the Crane wouldn't let you into their fancy party wearing your spiffy lacquered armor just to get you to make an embarrassing faux pas. Now the Scorpion on the other hand..........

1) Ceremonial gear is an exception, but that only applies to ceremonial functions. You wouldn't get to wear ceremonial armor to just any courtly occasion. And in the great majority of cases when it does apply it will be an in-clan thing: a ranking Lion bushi in ceremonial armor will certainly be welcome at a Lion funeral, but someone from another clan will have to come up with a good reason for doing the same.

2) Honestly, neither will allow it. The difference is that the Crane are hopefully going to be polite enough not to make a public scene when they deal with you, while the Scorpion will handle the matter in whatever way serves them best - which might be by humiliating you thoroughly, and then heaping an extra helping of shame on your lord for having such poorly educated retainers.

I think there are two orthogonal effects to the wargear quality: 1) the narrative effect of "do not wear this in an inappropriate context", where failure to comply can lead to Glory loss adjudicated by the GM or calling the magistrates on you, and 2) stressing the sh## out of people (think 'showing up with a M16 slung over your shoulder at your local grocery store'), which is represented by the strife add-on mechanical effect.

The first one is almost entirely restrictive, while the other can be a mixed blessing (you want to get your foe compromised on the battlefield, but in other contexts, you may chase off or alienate people who would be crucial to the plot).

Ah sorry bout that, nameless ronin . I wasn't clear enough about my concern being the seemingly counter-intuitive nature of the mechanical effect of Wargear when matched up to the supposed narrative purpose of the effect, especially with how many "gaps" got left in the rules and made it to print, so I was worried there was something actually missing, not hoping I had found a loophole haha.

and of course I know the actual reaction would be simultaneously more severe and nuanced than my sarcasm lets on, but hey that's in-jokes for ya.

and Franwax , I had considered that, but even that interpretation feels a stretch and isn't readily apparent enough on a first reading if that is the intent, especially since the strife increas also applies in the narratively appropriate context.

Anyhoo, I may toddle over to the House Rules thread and see if someone's come up with some kind of tweak that makes it line up a little better

50 minutes ago, drbraininajar said:

Ah sorry bout that, nameless ronin . I wasn't clear enough about my concern being the seemingly counter-intuitive nature of the mechanical effect of Wargear when matched up to the supposed narrative purpose of the effect, especially with how many "gaps" got left in the rules and made it to print, so I was worried there was something actually missing, not hoping I had found a loophole haha.

and of course I know the actual reaction would be simultaneously more severe and nuanced than my sarcasm lets on, but hey that's in-jokes for ya.

and Franwax , I had considered that, but even that interpretation feels a stretch and isn't readily apparent enough on a first reading if that is the intent, especially since the strife increas also applies in the narratively appropriate context.

Anyhoo, I may toddle over to the House Rules thread and see if someone's come up with some kind of tweak that makes it line up a little better

what is not clear about;

Wargear;

implements seen in battle and few other context.

decidely inapropriate for most social context.

makes people nervous, which impedes efforts at diplomacy.

it is obvious that it increase strife caused to others by a wielder of wargear by 1. because it makes others nervous (hence they take more strife).

and yes, in a diplomacy context not on a battlefield, you can increase the TN of someone trying to make a diplomacy check while decked out with wargear if he decided to still wear it while everybody told him not to wear it.


i am the biggest known houseruler in these forums, and I think Wargear is fine as is. if that is worth something to you.

to be fair, the wargear trait is well designed and much better than the flawed and nearly useless razor-edged trait (especially on a 2 handed weapon that cannot iaijutsu cut for they are the only techniques that make razor-edged remotely useful). just so we put things into perspective.

this game is a mess of design when it comes to small details and yet you point out something that is not even a problem or imbalanced in any way....

astonishing.

Like I said, I think the fault's with me. It seemed counter-intuitive at first, and that sorta got stuck like a popcorn kernel in my head, so I asked a question to make sure nothing was missing, but I get the idea now.

33 minutes ago, Avatar111 said:

iaijutsu           cut for they are the only techniqu  es th  at m  ake razor-edged remotely useful  

Deadly Sting also works well with razor edged (both successes and opportunities add damage), but it also does not work with big two handed weapons. This said, I don’t have any gripe with the razor edged quality. It’s always good to increase the severity of a crit (... when you crit, obviously). But this is a discussion for another thread

12 minutes ago, Franwax said:

Deadly Sting also works well with razor edged (both successes and opportunities add damage), but it also does not work with big two handed weapons. This said, I don’t have any gripe with the razor edged quality. It’s always good to increase the severity of a crit (... when you crit, obviously). But this is a discussion for another thread

Oh i definitely don't have enough gripe with razor-edge quality to "houserule it".

It just isn't a very strong trait (better than nothing i suppose).

You should have seen it in beta 😛 it only had the downside. It’s one of the few things that could be altered via consistent feedback.

On ‎1‎/‎6‎/‎2019 at 4:32 AM, Franwax said:

You should have seen it in beta 😛 it only had the downside. It’s one of the few things that could be altered via consistent feedback.

Indeed. The *-to-increase-deadliness is a nice ability to have in a general purpose skirmish.