Does anyone think it's worth putting some collective effort into agreeing on a list of reprints that are in line with the spirit of FFG's tournament rules and that TO's can use at events and players can reference before hand when building their decks? There's the list that I created by aggregating the efforts of others who prepared reprint lists for the different expansions that is currently posted on www.AGoTNY.net . I think if you remove some cards that are flagged as not proper reprints that it only has cards that are identical or virtually identical to their respective LCG reprints (ignoring art and flavor text differences), but I don't know and haven't done my own vetting to confirm (having not played as long as others, some cards I don't even own to check against). If others can take chunks of the list and do a side-by-side comparison of the two cards to confirm and then inform me, I can update the list.

Of course, to do this, we have to agree on what is and is not a valid reprint. By using "virtually" above, I mean --and vote in favor of including-- cards that have merely typographical style (e.g., using a capital letter instead of a lower case one) or typographical corrections (such as "a" replacing "an" or fixing a misspelling) where there is absolutely no doubt that the reprinted card means and plays exactly the same as its prior version in all game aspects are valid reprints. I think that treating those as valid reprints can be reconcilled with what FFG states re reprints in the tourny rules. However, I would vote that other changes to gameplay relevant aspects of the card including changes that arguably are only for readability or consistent templating (e.g., "lower" to "reduce" and "a" to "one") should be treated as not valid reprints (otherwise you start down a slippery slope).

Ooooh Kaaay, so I guess this idea went over about as well as the proverbial fart in church. Plan B: if anyone who attends the mega-LCG event at the FFG event center this weekend hears or sees anything about how reprints are handled for it, I'd appreciate it if you could pass that info along. Thanks.

LGR - For most of us, who are seeing more participation from new players vs. the "CCG-converts" who actually have the old cards you see, this is just a huge non-issue a year and a half into the LCG.

For me, it's not too hard to tell the few people affected that for a single LCG tournament deck, white-bordered cards (or Clash of Arms set symbol) only. In your meta/area, things are probably a little different. So at least in my case, the lack of response was me being lazy and avoiding a whole bunch of work that ultimately wouldn't be too productive.

I'm not upset about the lack of response notwithstanding my lead-in for my second post --I just wanted an excuse to type "fart in church". And I agree that for an LCG heavy meta, it's of diminished value. I'm roughly guess-timating that turnout for Kingsmoot will be 50/50 pre- vs. post-LCG transition players, so sounds higher than what you are expecting. That said, I think the "old" players have pretty much figured out which CCG era versions are "true" reprints and haven't been using any that are not, so hopefully it will be a complete non-issue going forward and at the tournament.

I can say that I was disappointed that all my old copeis of Iron Mines do not have "(cannot be saved)" and as such are not legal in LCG, as far as I know. But I will be at the event center this weekend, and if I learn anything and I'm not too lazy, I'll post for you.

JerusalemJones said:

Interesting. I just checked Mainn's site. The Sea of Storms version lacks the "cannot be saved", the other CCG versions have it. (I will have to update the list of reprints accordingly).

I've been "in and out" since the switch, and I have most of the cards since Westeros. So, a list like this is of great value to me. I actually enjoy seeing which cards make it back into the land of the living (card game).

I'll have a deck or two with me at our NorCal event in May, but I'm not sure what the thought will be about legacy cards. Syd or cha0s would probably have to chime in on that...

Black Sword! Are you back! That would be awesome....you're one of the only players older than me! (Older thna dirt, really)

I don't think the cannot be saved thing is a real big deal for Irom Mines anyway - your clearly not going to ahve a lcoation save handy (do they even exist anymore?)

Any chance one or more of the old guard has compiled a list of reprints found in the Stark and Bara expansions? I'd like to update the list on the NY meta website without having to break a sweat. (My exposure only goes back to ITE, so I can spot some of the reprints, but not older stuff and I don't trust myself completely on the ITE and after stuff.)

Give me a few days... I'll go through it.

Also bear in mind... up through ITE FFG had a reprints list.

So ITE LP Iron Mines is a reprint of ASoS Iron Mines. I've always treated the reprint text as errata to the old one in most cases (unless an errata specifies otherwise like House Messenger (WED).

I generally consider the latest reprint of a card in FFG's official list as the card to compare with when looking at a LCG card. (Lannisport Brothel is an example).

Stag Lord said:

Beware of "Return of the kraken" ( http://agot.dbler.com/index.php?view=card&arsenalid=20895 ), maybe you've noticed, but to be sure...

anyway, i played my old designed "the iron mines" from ASoS during a tourney, nobody called for a referee...

I know my local group is fine with using the old copies of the house specific feifdoms. Everything else we treat with a case by case scenerio.

So Lords of Storm Reprint List

These have exact reprints... no text changes at all:

Stannis's Cavalry (ASoT)

Lost Captain (AFoD)

Vanguard Lancer (AToS)

Bastard in Hiding (ITE)

Herald of Storm's End (ACoS)

Hedge Knight (Wes)

Fanatical Follower (ITE)

Knights of the Realm (AToS)

Accepted Destiny (ASoN)

Knighted (Wes)

Power of Faith (ITE)

Regroup (AFoD)

These cards change 'a' to '1' which should be considered reprints. I know at most tourney's these are not considered a problem since the meaning is the same. ("A" means "One" in this context.)

Marya Seaworth (ITE)

Direct Assault (ITE)

Heart of the Stag (ASoS)

Obey the King (AToS)

See who is Stronger (AToS)

Smuggler's Cove (ITE)

Original: a

LoTS: 1

Bearer of the Light (AToS)

Orignal: kneel to

LoTS: kneel Bearer of the Light to.

Narrow Escape (ACoS)

Clarifies: hand of at least one card.

Superior Claim (ASoS)

Original: play after you win

LoTS: After you win

-

Pyre of the False Gods (AToB)

Changes to to into, a to 1, kneel to -> Kneel Pyre of the False Gods, etc.

-

Sallhador Saan (ITELP,ASoS)

Original: kneel to choose a location. Discard that location from play.
LoTS: Kneel Salladhor Saan to choose and discard 1 location from play.

-

-

Feast or Famine (ASoN)

Original: When you count income, you may choose to add +6 gold to your income. If you do, you cannot initiate challenges this round.

LoTS: When revealed, you may choose to add +6 gold to your income this marshalling phase. If you do, you cannot initiate challenges this round.

Note I just realized that Forgotten Plans may interact with Feast of Famine differently depending on the version.

Outfox(ITE) definitely interacts differently. Just an FYI.

bloodycelt said:

There are more differences.

Thanks to bloodycelt's hard work, I've updated the reprint list maintained at www.AGoTNY.net . Note that (a) it's not official and (b) it lacks Lords of Winter reprint information at this time.

I've just gone through the Lords of Winter Cards. Because it was a good way to procrastinate.

Exact Reprints:

Starks:

Grey Wind (Throne of Blades)

Jojen Reed (Winter)

Riverrun Messenger (Crown of Suns)

Wolf Pack (Sea of Storms)

Knight of the Red Fork (Throne of Blades)

Edmure's Host (Valyrian)

Hoster Tully (Iron Throne)

Mole Town Brothel (Song of Twilight)

They Shall Not Cross (Song of Night)

Fear Cuts Deeper than Swords (Ice and Fire/Westeros/Iron Throne)

Neutrals:

Rorge (House of Talons)

Training Grounds (Ice and Fire/Sea of Storms)

Plots:

Calm before the storm (Valyrian)

Take them by Surprise (Iron Throne)

A Storm of Words (Ice and fire/Valyrian)

Respect of the Old Gods (Iron Throne)

Minor (Textual) Changes:

Starks:

Frozen Outpost (Iron Throne) Change from "Kneel to" to "kneel Frozen Outpost to"

Routing the Charge (Iron Throne) Chage from "After you win the challenge as defender" to "After you win the challenge as THE defender" (Caps for empahsis) and "Kill an attacking character" to "Kill 1 attacking character".

Neutrals:

Wolf Dreams (Westeros): Change from "a direwolf card" to "1 direwolf card, reveal it,".

Nightmares (Winter): Change from "A character or a location" to "1 character or 1 location"

Plots:

Marched to the Wall (Westeros/Ice and Fire) Change from "one of his or her" to "1 of his or her"

Fortified Position: (Winter/Iron Throne/Throne of Blades). Addition of "Limit 1 per plot deck" from the Winter nad Iron Throne Editions. Change from "Limit one per plot deck" to "Limit 1 per plot deck" from Throne of Blades version.

Major (Gameplay) Changes:

Crown of Winter (Reign of Kings. Price reduced from 4 to 2. Strength bonus reduced from 4 to 2. Gains the ability to make it winter if there are no ravens in play.

Frozen Solid (Winter) "House Stark only" added

Eddard Stark (Ice and Fire) Text ability changed from "lower the claim on the attacking player's plot by 1" to "lower the attacking player's claim to 0", Renown added

Summer (Westeros) Price reduced by 1. Abiltiies rearranged in textbox

Host of the Bear (Crown of Suns): "No attachments" changed to "No attachments except Weapon"

Edmure Tully (Throne of Blades): Ability now can be triggered by declaring any Hosue Tully character as a defender, not just Edmure, and only removes your opponent's Strength 1 characters from your challenge.

Mance's Men (Song of Night). Cost changed from 6 gold to Shadows + 4 gold.

Bowl of Brown (House of Talons). Addition of "and cannot kneel to pay for effects"

The War of the Five Kings (Reigne of Kings). Name changed to "The Siege of Winterfell". "House Stark only" added. (OK, this is a joke )

I never realised 31 of the 55 cards in LoW were reprints!

Host of the Bear also gained a war crest, which actually makes the **** card useable.

I *finally* got around to updating the reprint list on www.AGoTNY.net with the LoW info. Tomdidiot, thanks a lot for doing all of that work.